charles Barkely: "Kawhi leonard is a top 5 player in the league"

[HarlemHeat37]

Don't you think it's a bit of a reach to call him the best since Jordan? I'd like to hear your thoughts on this -- on Curry's case I mean.

I don't actually think he's the best player since Jordan, I said he's looking like it, currently..he's obviously not going to continue at this pace..

He's the best PG I've ever seen, though, been saying it since last season..I never saw Aids Johnson play, to be fair..

[HarlemHeat37]

I don't know, getting the FMVP kinda negates what you just said.

He wasn't really the #1 option on that team, though, nobody was..Kawhi has been a great playoff performer, overall, so far in his career, but he disappointed in the latter part of last year's series as the #1 guy..he needs to do that before I put him in the same conversation as the Lebrons and Currys IMO..

It's fair to question other players in the same situation, as well, like Anthony Davis IMO..

[TD 21]

I find it amazing that so many non-Spurs fans apparently haven't watched them play since 2013 and still describe Kawhi as the same player he was back then, tbh..

And no, Durant is not clearly better anymore IMO..his defense is atrocious, one of the worst perimeter defender in the league nowadays..he may be better, but it's not clear like it used to be when Durant was a legitimate 2-way player that could stay healthy and consistently dominate(2012-2014)..

I won't put him in the top 5, yet, because he hasn't done it in the playoffs as the #1 like others have..I'm confident he will, though..to be fair, neither has Harden, and he's had multiple opportunities..

I can't stand him, but he hasn't played enough since his foot injuries to make a definitive judgement on the caliber of player he is at this point.

Even if what you say bears itself out over the long run, he's still a historically great offensive player. That was always enough for the consensus to be that Nowitzki was clearly superior to better two way players and he shouldn't be treated any differently just because he's more athletic.

Leonard is not in the top five, not so much because he hasn't done it in the playoffs as a number one (that's nonsense, considering he's played in one series where he was was the number one, that changed midway through it and it came on a beat up team playing a fellow top five team), but because he hasn't proven he can carry an offense and an elite one at that, over a long period of time.

[DMC]

He wasn't really the #1 option on that team, though, nobody was..Kawhi has been a great playoff performer, overall, so far in his career, but he disappointed in the latter part of last year's series as the #1 guy..he needs to do that before I put him in the same conversation as the Lebrons and Currys IMO..

It's fair to question other players in the same situation, as well, like Anthony Davis IMO..

He has to get the benefit of the doubt though, since the defense wasn't focused on stopping anyone in particular.

I think if he had the same y swag that RW has, people would think he's the next coming of MJ.

[ajh18]

I can't stand him, but he hasn't played enough since his foot injuries to make a definitive judgement on the caliber of player he is at this point.

Even if what you say bears itself out over the long run, he's still a historically great offensive player. That was always enough for the consensus to be that Nowitzki was clearly superior to better two way players and he shouldn't be treated any differently just because he's more athletic.

Leonard is not in the top five, not so much because he hasn't done it in the playoffs as a number one (that's nonsense, considering he's played in one series where he was was the number one, that changed midway through it and it came on a beat up team playing a fellow top five team), but because he hasn't proven he can carry an offense and an elite one at that, over a long period of time.

I remember people consistently rating guys like KG and Duncan ahead of Dirk because they were two-way players and Dirk was mainly just an offensive threat. Duncan obviously had other reasons as well, like overall success, but I do feel like when comparing elite players folks take the defense into account.

[LoneStarState'sPride]

Kawhilights is top 3

[Spurtacular]

I never thought id hate hearing those words...

Barkley has a great eye for talent but he hardly watches games ourisde of of the nationally televised games...and we all know he has the tiest of takes.

Speaking of goty takes...

[100%duncan]

He's the second best defensive player of that group (Lebron is still Lebron, but I still think Kawhi has done more than Davis). The top four are obvious but there's a chance Kawhi surpasses Harden and Davis at some point, especially if Harden's sub league average D is accounted for. Only other guys I'd consider there are Paul and Blake. Blake's D is vastly improved.

Lebron literally plays no defense right now

[cjw]

Lebron literally plays no defense right now

I guess you weren't watching him in the Finals last year? He jogs through the season. Still elite when he cares.

[exstatic]

I guess you weren't watching him in the Finals last year? He jogs through the season. Still elite when he cares.

elite when he cares =/= Elite

[100%duncan]

I guess you weren't watching him in the Finals last year? He jogs through the season. Still elite when he cares.

And? You said kawhi is still 2nd best defensively, but if you have actually been watching lebron for the past 3seasons you know what you're talking about is total bull .

Oh and the finals.last year where he got torched by either curry or iguodala? Smh

[Silver&Black]

And? You said kawhi is still 2nd best defensively, but if you have actually been watching lebron for the past 3seasons you know what you're talking about is total bull .

Oh and the finals.last year where he got torched by either curry or iguodala? Smh

Welcome back...

What did you get banned for? If you can't say it ITT...PM me.

[100%duncan]

Welcome back...

What did you get banned for? If you can't say it ITT...PM me.

I think it was when spurraider talked about the becky banning and i replied with yeah that got mod. You know what they wrote in my ban statement? "Guess you have fond memories of being banned" or something like that. I musta stepped on some sensitive vagina.

[Silver&Black]

I think it was when spurraider talked about the becky banning and i replied with yeah that got mod. You know what they wrote in my ban statement? "Guess you have fond memories of being banned" or something like that. I musta stepped on some sensitive vagina.

Yeah....I try to stay away from Becky conversations. They never go well, and the banhammer usually follows.

[100%duncan]

Yeah....I try to stay away from Becky conversations. They never go well, and the banhammer usually follows.

What's funny is they didnt do about the kawhi is a re or all the wishing parker of ill threads as I said i musta stepped on some vagina tbh. Goodbye in advance for now

[dabom]

The MODs can suck my !. Except a couple of mods.

[Kidd K]

I knew when i read the article abou kawhi watching barkley..barkely was going to go on a mission to elevate kawhi among mainstream media fans...

Pop with the strong PR move

Kawhi is a top 6-8 player though..for sure.

This. If anyone thinks his comments aren't suddenly happening because of that. . .lol.

Kawhi's good though, just not top 5 good. Also I don't think Barkley always has ty takes. . .but yeah. He's only handjobbing Kawhi now because of the tape thing.

[YGWHI]

When SI.com and ESPN ranked Kawhi top 10 player some guys here were talking about him and the rankings...now he's easily a top 7-8 player.

He's only handjobbing Kawhi now because of the tape thing.

Not sure, Barkley said Kawhi was a top 10-15 player three years ago, he always praised him.

[SouthernFried]

On a team, I would take Kawhi over Harden every single time. If I didn't have a "team" and just needed a scorer, I'd take Harden...or Iverson.

[YGWHI]

I guess you weren't watching him in the Finals last year? He jogs through the season. Still elite when he cares.

[YGWHI]

[YGWHI]

He's a bit overrated defensively...he made some huge defensive mistakes in those series.

[cjw]

He's a bit overrated defensively...he made some huge defensive mistakes in those series.

I'm sounding like an apologist here, but for a guy bearing such a huge load offensively (most scrub team last year since the 07 Cavs or AI's Sixers playing in the finals), he's still able to guard multiple positions pretty darn well. Jordan was on another level when it came to his defense while being the alpha dog on offense for a perimeter guy.

I can also post a bunch of plays where Kawhi's been burned on D. Remember how he played the second half of the Clippers series?

[dweaver99027]

If Kawhi was asked to carry a Cavs team with Mo Williams as the second best player, a Heat team with a one-legged wade, and another Cavs team with Dellavedova(!!!) as the second best player and still could play elite level defense then I'd rank him top 5 all time, not just current. I can also make a video that makes Duncan appear as the most dumbfounded defender of all time. The hate is strong in this forum.

[HarlemHeat37]

2010-2013 Lebron was probably the best 2-way player in league history IMO, but ya, his defense fell off a cliff in 2014, and furthermore in 2015, tbh..understandable with the load he carries, the wear&tear and his current age, but still, I wouldn't necessarily classify him as a 2-way player "today", despite his strong defensive start for these first 2 weeks of 2015-2016..