It's over
He had his chance
simple question tbh ... assuming argentina qualify
No, he'll still be the greatest player of all time. When you see how bad Argentina was without him, it's not his fault.
Plus International football has been pretty crap for some time now.
Missyturds
he was never in the discussion to begin with
son I was talking about the goat not the goat choker, but you make a good point with them being similiar tbh.
son I love messi and he is obviously the best player today, but argentina isn't portugal in terms of talent. He should've gotten at least a copa, through on field play, leadership, whatever. If you are in the goat talk and your NT is not working you need to speak up and say : I want coach X, I want players X/Y/Z, I want to play style X, and your federation will comply.
Since Pele and Diego, goat talk has never included Di Stefano or Cruyf, this goat talk still does not include Messi but Messi is not done yet with football
I don't think there's a GOAT since you can't compare different eras. That's why most people name a group of 3-5 players as the elite.
my top 3 is pele, maradona, zidane in no particular order tbh.
missi is in the next group with fat ronaldo and others.
Christ. The midget bandwagon is so unbelievably delusional
How can they still blame his NT teammates when midget was directly and mainly responsible for Argentina being short one Copa America when he missed his penalty, while his teammates stepped up and did their job.
Well some people atribute a cup win to a guy who played less than 10% of the final.
Yeah, he only created & scored the goals that got them to the Gold medal match. It's not like he missed a penalty...
Zidane
He's top 10, tbh... by the numbers alone... that's not a bad place to be... (and I'm not a homer, tbh, partial to Diego in this convo)
Zidane and Ronaldo (P) are closer to the top 20 tier... which is not a bad place to be either, tbh...
Except they didn't do their job, biglia missed his penalty as well.
You are right, Messi didn't do anything in the previous matches
all the way to:
- multiple rings at all possible levels and declared by ronaldo/rivaldo/figo and the like as the most talented they ever played with.
- probably some of the best WC performances in history
- zidane combines individual brilliance with a xavi level control of the game, at the highest level you need control more than the ability to score 15 goals against osausuna and venezuela.
- his on/off impact on france was
- this is coming from a german.
there isn't ONE player in the history of the game that I'd take over peak zidane. not one.
fans of Zidane need to remember the following when criticizing Missi...
- Moved from Bordeaux to the reigning CL winner Juventus (basically pulling a Lebron)
- Was shut down by Paul Lambert (who?) in the following CL Final, which Juve lost against Dortmund (lmao)
- One year later, he again makes the CL Final and loses again, now to Real Madrid.
- Next year he doesn't win the Scudetto and loses in the CL group stage after headbutting and getting banned.
- After that, he pulls a KD, and joins the stacked team that beat him, Real Madrid.
- He's already on the decline in 2006, announcing his retirement soon, starts stat-padding and record his first career hat-trick that year.
- Quit on his team in the 2006 World Cup final with another headbutt, which France lost.
It would be wise to remember this niglet lost more CL Finals than he actually won, and as many WC Finals as he won.
This is not even hate, Zizou was an incredible talent, but it's a disservice not to tell the whole story, tbh...
excuses tbh:
more like pulling a dleague to nba move, the could he win at bordeaux? meanwhile midget grew up at barcelona (basically pulling a magic)
at least he got there tbh, everybody has chokes.
losing to that real was no shame son.
had a temper tbh
misty grew up at barcelona ..
nobody cares about hat tricks tbh.
that was a bad quit tbh.
well at least he won both euro and world cup, in days where the compe ion was fierce (1998 brasil, 1998 croatia, 1998 italy, 2000 spain, 2000 portugal, 2000 italy were all very strong tbh). What strong team did missi beat at ANY national tournament. Name one tbh.
....
That being said, the reality is that at the super top level where all teams have solid rosters you don't need a hat-trick threat but a great individual player that is also a cerebral presence to WIN as a team. (like a xavi + iniesta). That's why I take zidane over all. Yes he had his chokes, you are right tbh, nobody is perfect and that '06 headbutt was really sad tbh, but you can argue like you had against him against everybody in the top 10:
- pele didn't even play against the best compe ion and had the most stacked team possible full of forgotten greats. He was never truly tested and when he was missing there were other greats ready to carry the team. Imo the bill russell of football.
- maradonna quit on his career not on just a single match. inconsistent, hard to coach, etc.
- fat ronaldo has some horrible chokes and his longevity is poor (health).
- misty hasn't won diddly squat, not ONE ing lousy goal in a final and he didn't beat ONE good team, even missed at penaldos. even got cucked at home by brasil. this niglet has collected a world class string of Ls. If he didn't play at the godly stacked barca he'd be just another penaldo. Winning it all at barca with another 3-4 top 10 players in the game is nothing of historical worth tbh.
-cruyff is the father of all chokers with more than one can count, but at least he scored in a final ... tbh.
-puskas and di stefano played in the black and white era, sorry but I can't even compare the game back then to what we got today
-beckenbauer is the best leader out of the group but isn't as impactful individually.
-platini isn't even worthy of this list
-penaldo .. at least he sidenaldoed a euro tbh
Like it or not zidane has the most complete club+NT resume in the toughest era, and his game is the easiest to adapt to in term of teamplay, he is always useful and is very hard to freeze out of games (pele/misty/cruyff have been historically frozen by making them go deep in their half for the ball). His on-off for all his teams is significantly larger than missi's. He is also the 2nd best leader out of crop. He can defend, is an aerial threat, isn't a ballhog, tactically astute, can work in various systems, just a great piece all around with the individual brilliance to match anybody on this list.
Zidane
Not even the GOAT of his generation
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