Lowe: Celtics starting point for Leonard likely Tatum and Kings 1st

[SpursDynasty85]

I hope they don't give a where Kawhi wants to live. If a team from Mars offered a better trade package, RC better be getting on the phone with Elon Musk.

I feel you if Kawhi really is protesting by sitting but I do believe he is putting his health above all currently and wants to be 100%. But if they dont communicate we are left with an asset that could bolt after a year hence giving us less in return whereas if we do a sign and trade we get significantly more i hmm assets to the right suitor.

[tim_duncan_fan]

I would love to have Kuzma and Ingram for Kawhi.

If we were to maximize the potential of both guys....yikes!

[SpursDynasty85]

I would love to have Kuzma and Ingram for Kawhi.

If we were to maximize the potential of both guys....yikes!

Both guys play the same position. Aldridge, Randle, Kuzma, Murray, and insert SG would be a solid line up. But yea. Those Lakers have a lot of solid young talent now.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Both guys play the same position. Aldridge, Randle, Kuzma, Murray, and insert SG would be a solid line up. But yea. Those Lakers have a lot of solid young talent now.

They have so much of it. I'm not big on Randle long term. I prefer not to pay undersized players, ever.

But on the whole, that young squad just needs some corporate knowledge to be a 48-50 win team.

They are more talented than we are, just not as disciplined/ knowledgeable.

Not that we have much discipline either.

[cd021]

What would Phoenix offer?

I would suspect the Bucks and Heat picks plus the Sun's own 2nd (the 15th, 16th, and 31st pick, currently) plus maybe their 2019 1st, lottery protected, or Bender /Chriss.

The deal wouldn't be able to be made official until July 1st but they could agree prior to the draft.

[HarlemHeat37]

Pop would never even think about coaching Marquese Criss, tbh

I like Jackson's potential, have to get him soon before Phoenix kills his future..he's spent the past 2 months being a chucker on a team with no structure, playing stupid basketball(I watch a lot of Suns games, since I've been regularly betting against them)

[Ice009]

If you're trading kawhi for a package based on picks, at least one of those picks need to be in the top 10. 15th as a highest pick is nowhere near good enough for me.

[Ron Swanson]

If you're trading kawhi for a package based on picks, at least one of those picks need to be in the top 10. 15th as a highest pick is nowhere near good enough for me.

I agree.

[Ice009]

We can pretty much get the 15th pick right now just by missing the playoffs. I'm not interested in a package of the 15th, 16th and 31st. One of those picks is going to have to be in the top 10 and closer to the top 5 if we're not getting back a good player along with those picks.

[MannyIsGod]

Doncic is most likely the #1, and he's basically a younger Ginobili. If the Spurs could get him, Bender/Chriss, and not ty salary filler (Tyson Chandler?) that would be a nice package.

Doncic is no here near the athlete Manu is. That's a comparison.

[MannyIsGod]

Jaren Jackson is a guy I like, as are Doncic and Ayton. To be honest, I don't know too much about the class, and if the choice were between the first-overall pick and the third-overall pick plus assets, I could be on the latter side easily. But I don't see any way PATFO would want to wait another year to pick their guy, especially considering the uncertainty of where the pick will fall and will be at whatever pick.

Ideally, the team knows what specific player they want for Kawhi and then draft that player as late as possible. Like if they want Jaren Jackson, they could guarantee getting him by trading for the first pick. But obviously, if Jackson falls to seventh, getting him and Love for Kawhi would just be better value, since they could send Love to Phoneix for like the 15th- and 31st-overall picks and just add those to their bullpen. But they wouldn't pass up on Jackson (or whomever) altogether just to get like two mediocre picks and Tatum

Jackson is not going 1. If the Spurs got the #1 somehow Ayton is a possibility as is Doncic. I like Bagley as well but those two are better. After those 3, however, the talent has question marks, IMO. Porter Jr. barely played this year, for instance. I'd rather have multiple later picks than anything between 3-9 or so.

[MannyIsGod]

I"m very leary of trading with the Celtics. First, Stevens gets more out of his players than anyone else, so I worry about getting anyone from that team and having them live up to what they are doing in Boston. Second, Ainge always seems to win his trades.

[Chinook]

Jackson is not going 1. If the Spurs got the #1 somehow Ayton is a possibility as is Doncic. I like Bagley as well but those two are better. After those 3, however, the talent has question marks, IMO. Porter Jr. barely played this year, for instance. I'd rather have multiple later picks than anything between 3-9 or so.

That's really far removed from the main point, though. Jackson was just a name that came up in my award-winning "Pick Three" thread. The point is that getting the first pick means they can pick the single player they want the most guaranteed, which has a lot of value. Ideally, you play the draft to where you pick the guy you want right before another team would have picked him, and you get compensation to moving down or not lose too much to move up. So you could be right about Jackson going lower (and I suspect you are). Either way, if the Spurs wanted him, then they aren't accepting Tatum and 2019 picks. "Value" is a concept for bad teams.

[duncan2k5]

Yes there is. Windhorst reported on it.

Show me the link to the report saying most players hate kawhi

[duncan2k5]

I do think Spurs are queasy about the supermax bc Kawhi isn’t healthy and I understand Kawhi and his agency (which Carter is close to as they were his agents too) would be upset about that. I am sure his agency has some hardball of his own and might want to spread rumors to force the Spurs. There’s something else going on, there’s some truth to some things but it’s a likely fluid situation IMO and Spurs still hope he will be fine and they can move past this. I am not being naive or blind like duncan2K5 and assume things are peachy but it’s nothing that can’t get resolved.

The only problem that doesn’t have a real solution is Kiwis tendinopathy. Only he knows what’s going on with that and I am giving him credibility that he’s legit hurt.

I never said everything is peachy...im saying i believe kawhi is hurt...and the very small number of ppl that have a problem with it in the spurs camp,have that issue because they want to see manu and tony go out strong

[TheCultOfPersonality]

Don't Celts have the Memphis pick aswell? Why not ask for that instead plus Tatum?

Yes. It's top 8 protected in 2019, top 6 protected in 2020, and unprotected in 2021. And there's a possibility that the Grizzlies could be terrible the next few seasons so this could be a factor.

[Proxy]

trade Kawhi to get rid of Patty or Pau's contract and get the picks and pieces needed to surround Lebron and LMA

[DAF86]

I would suspect the Bucks and Heat picks plus the Sun's own 2nd (the 15th, 16th, and 31st pick, currently) plus maybe their 2019 1st, lottery protected, or Bender /Chriss.

The deal wouldn't be able to be made official until July 1st but they could agree prior to the draft.

And how is that better than Tatum and the Kings pick?

[cd021]

And how is that better than Tatum and the Kings pick?

You mean how is 3, potentially 4 first rounders (lets say 31 is a 1st in this scenario) is better than Tatum and a pick likely in the 5-10 range in next years draft?


I really don't feel like that's a question that needs to be answered, but I will anyway.

the 15th, 16th, 20th (our pick), 31st and 50th in this year's draft.

Spurs could stash three of the five picks and in adddition to saving roster spots moving Kawhi to Phoenix would save at least $15,000,000 next season and theoretically give them about $10,000,000 in cap space.

If the Celtics were to give up Tautum, Kings Pick, Memphis Pick and maybe even the Clippers (lottery protected in 2019 and 2020-unlikely to convey, but still) then that is a better deal but no way Ainge would give up that much. He'd probably be loathe to give up Yabusele and two seconds for Kawhi.

[TD 21]

You mean how is 3, potentially 4 first rounders (lets say 31 is a 1st in this scenario) is better than Tatum and a pick likely in the 5-10 range in next years draft?


I really don't feel like that's a question that needs to be answered, but I will anyway.

the 15th, 16th, 20th (our pick), 31st and 50th in this year's draft.

Spurs could stash three of the five picks and in adddition to saving roster spots moving Kawhi to Phoenix would save at least $15,000,000 next season and theoretically give them about $10,000,000 in cap space.

If the Celtics were to give up Tautum, Kings Pick, Memphis Pick and maybe even the Clippers (lottery protected in 2019 and 2020-unlikely to convey, but still) then that is a better deal but no way Ainge would give up that much. He'd probably be loathe to give up Yabusele and two seconds for Kawhi.

You don't trade a superstar for a bunch of mid round picks, which are unlikely to turn into so much as a foundational player. You have to receive a baseline of certainty that a guy like Tatum provides, in addition to a secondary asset that is capable of providing the same.

[cd021]

Yes. It's top 8 protected in 2019, top 6 protected in 2020, and unprotected in 2021. And there's a possibility that the Grizzlies could be terrible the next few seasons so this could be a factor.

Memphis has no incentive to be bad next season, granted they didn't have one to be bad this season- though injuries played a big factor.

I could see Memphis, finishing 10th in the West next season if Conley and Gasol are healthy plus the have a good chance at the #1 pick so that should help them.
In terms of their pick, it would likely convert next season and likely be a late lottery pick. Tatum plus Memphis' and Sacramento's 1st's is a pretty good start in a Kawhi trade

[cd021]

You don't trade a superstar for a bunch of mid round picks, which are unlikely to turn into so much as a foundational player. You have to receive a baseline of certainty that a guy like Tatum provides, in addition to a secondary asset that is capable of providing the same.

I guess the question that I have is is Tatum really that good- or projects to be that good? Tatum and a 5-10 range Kings pick doesn't seem like nearly enough for me. Adding the Grizzlies pick helps but I would press for the inclusion of the Clippers pick, as well for a deal for Kawhi.

[TD 21]

I guess the question that I have is is Tatum really that good- or projects to be that good? Tatum and a 5-10 range Kings pick doesn't seem like nearly enough for me. Adding the Grizzlies pick helps but I would press for the inclusion of the Clippers pick, as well for a deal for Kawhi.

I don't think Tatum will be a superstar, but star looks more likely than not and the floor looks to be a tier below that.

"I bet their starting point for any negotiations would be Tatum and the Kings pick and let's go from there."

[DAF86]

You mean how is 3, potentially 4 first rounders (lets say 31 is a 1st in this scenario) is better than Tatum and a pick likely in the 5-10 range in next years draft?


I really don't feel like that's a question that needs to be answered, but I will anyway.

the 15th, 16th, 20th (our pick), 31st and 50th in this year's draft.

Spurs could stash three of the five picks and in adddition to saving roster spots moving Kawhi to Phoenix would save at least $15,000,000 next season and theoretically give them about $10,000,000 in cap space.

If the Celtics were to give up Tautum, Kings Pick, Memphis Pick and maybe even the Clippers (lottery protected in 2019 and 2020-unlikely to convey, but still) then that is a better deal but no way Ainge would give up that much. He'd probably be loathe to give up Yabusele and two seconds for Kawhi.

I much rather have two top 10 picks (Tatum and the Kings pick) than 4 mediocre picks that can easily be hit or miss. With those picks you would be lucky to get a Tatum. I really don't see your point at all.

[CGD]

I much rather have two top 10 picks (Tatum and the Kings pick) than 4 mediocre picks that can easily be hit or miss. With those picks you would be lucky to get a Tatum. I really don't see your point at all.

I agree. For every Leonard at 14, there are 30 Chris Singletons picked at a similar slot.

Still, Tatum + Kings pick for Leonard is quiet thin as noted by the poster above. Brown AND the Memphis pick need to be part of the deal. Unless there is another injury, i cant see Memphis having another ultra terrible year and I think it’s likely it conveys next year (Only top 8 protected).

Also, can someone clarify something. Looks like the “Kings” pick can actually still be 2-4 if the Lakers land in one of those slots, right?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sbn...nba-draft-2018