Woj: Marcus Morris Reneging on Agreement with Spurs?

[spurraider21]

Section 1. Required Form.
The Player Contract to be entered into by each player and the Team by which he is employed shall be a Uniform Player Contract in the form annexed hereto as Exhibit A.

I don’t read that to provide a condition precedent to enforceability.

really? shall is the strongest language you're going to have here. any employment dispute with the nba or a team will be subject to the CBA... it seems pretty cut and dry

plus, it states outright that there can be no agreement until after the moratorium

Section 15. Moratorium Period.Except as permitted in the next sentence, notwithstanding any otherprovision of this Agreement, no player and Team may enter into any oralor written agreement concerning terms and conditions of the player’semployment, or reduce any such agreement to writing in the form of aUniform Player Contract or amendment, during the Moratorium Period.

[spurraider21]

Section 5. Conformity.
(a) All currently effective Player Contracts, and all Player Contracts entered into on or after the effective date of this Agreement that do not otherwise so provide, shall be deemed amended in such manner to require the parties to comply with all terms of this Agreement, including the terms of the Uniform Player Contract annexed hereto as Exhibit A. All Player Contracts shall be subject to the terms of this Agreement, which shall supersede the terms of any Player Contract inconsistent herewith. No Player Contract shall provide for the waiver by a player or a Team of any benefits or the sacrifice of any rights to which the player or the Team is en led by virtue of a Uniform Player Contract or this Agreement.

But you’re right in that the contracts are subject to the CBA’s restrictions, hence the Jard Dudley example. Still don’t think it supplants common law like frauds

pretty sure it does.

[Degoat]

I still hope he signs with us even though it’s not looking likely, one thing that is kind of interesting. I think Morris would start for us but is there enough room on the roster for him with Rudy, and carrol? Because the players that close most games imo will probably be dejounte/White/DeMar/Rudy/LA... I’m sure carrol wouldn’t care but Morris might throw a fit if he doesn’t finish games

[spurraider21]

I still hope he signs with us even though it’s not looking likely, one thing that is kind of interesting. I think Morris would start for us but is there enough room on the roster for him with Rudy, and carrol? Because the players that close most games imo will probably be dejounte/White/DeMar/Rudy/LA... I’m sure carrol wouldn’t care but Morris might throw a fit if he doesn’t finish games

carroll would be the primary backup 3 and gay would be morris' primary backup

[Marcus Bryant]

I still hope he signs with us even though it’s not looking likely, one thing that is kind of interesting. I think Morris would start for us but is there enough room on the roster for him with Rudy, and carrol?

Yes.

[vy65]

really? shall is the strongest language you're going to have here. any employment dispute with the nba or a team will be subject to the CBA... it seems pretty cut and dry

plus, it states outright that there can be no agreement until after the moratorium

Section 15. Moratorium Period.Except as permitted in the next sentence, notwithstanding any otherprovision of this Agreement, no player and Team may enter into any oralor written agreement concerning terms and conditions of the player’semployment, or reduce any such agreement to writing in the form of aUniform Player Contract or amendment, during the Moratorium Period.

Shall refers to the form of agreement only.

As for Section 15, you left out the second half that qualifies what you posted:

The following shall be permitted during the Moratorium Period: (i) a player may accept any Required Tender, Qualifying Offer, or “Maximum Qualifying Offer” (as defined in Article XI, Section 4(a)(ii)) that is outstanding; (ii) a player and a Team may negotiate over the terms and conditions of a Player Contract that may be entered into following the conclusion of the Moratorium Period; (iii) a player and a Team may enter into an Offer Sheet; (iv) a First Round Pick and the Team that holds his draft rights may enter into a Rookie Scale Contract; and (v) a player and a Team may enter into a Player Contract, not to exceed two (2) Seasons in length, that provides for a Salary for each Salary Cap Year equal to the Two-Way Player Salary or the Minimum Player Salary applicable to the player (with no bonuses of any kind), and (v) a Team may exercise a Two- Way Contract’s Standard NBA Contract Conversion Option or, with respect to a Contract with an Exhibit 10, such Contract’s Two-Way Player Conversion Option, in accordance with Article II, Section 11(g) and (i) above.

The parties negotiate and agree to the terms of the deal that will be reduced to the model form agreement once the moratorium is over. Nothing in the CBA that I’ve seen says that a written contract on the required form is a precondition to enforceability, especially when negotiations are successful.

[poopbox]

Makes sense.

To be clear, I think its a move to give your word and then reneg. I just don't know if its a violation of the rules.

On it's own it's not a violation of the rule and I am sure players or teams reneg on stuff during free agency all the time and we just don't hear about it...

But when a team makes 2 moves that they can't undo BASED on your verbal agreement then it becomes the biggest possible violation of the rule...

Carroll now has a 3 year contract for no other reason than Morris said he would sign and the Spurs can't undo that...

Bertans is gone for nothing because Morris said he would sign and the Spurs can't undo that...

Bertans would have been gone anyway...but he would have been gone for more than nothing if this Morris thing never happens...

If they could go back and undo the bertans trade and the carroll sign and trade and just give him a large portion of the mle...no harm no foul...

But they can't...so now they might have just given away a player who had some value for absolutely nothing...

[spurraider21]

Shall refers to the form of agreement only.

As for Section 15, you left out the second half that qualifies what you posted:

The following shall be permitted during the Moratorium Period: (i) a player may accept any Required Tender, Qualifying Offer, or “Maximum Qualifying Offer” (as defined in Article XI, Section 4(a)(ii)) that is outstanding; (ii) a player and a Team may negotiate over the terms and conditions of a Player Contract that may be entered into following the conclusion of the Moratorium Period; (iii) a player and a Team may enter into an Offer Sheet; (iv) a First Round Pick and the Team that holds his draft rights may enter into a Rookie Scale Contract; and (v) a player and a Team may enter into a Player Contract, not to exceed two (2) Seasons in length, that provides for a Salary for each Salary Cap Year equal to the Two-Way Player Salary or the Minimum Player Salary applicable to the player (with no bonuses of any kind), and (v) a Team may exercise a Two- Way Contract’s Standard NBA Contract Conversion Option or, with respect to a Contract with an Exhibit 10, such Contract’s Two-Way Player Conversion Option, in accordance with Article II, Section 11(g) and (i) above.

The parties negotiate and agree to the terms of the deal that will be reduced to the model form agreement once the moratorium is over. Nothing in the CBA that I’ve seen says that a written contract on the required form is a precondition to enforceability, especially when negotiations are successful.

yes. the form of the agreement. as in in a written contract, and not an oral promise

doesn't say anything about agreeing tbh... just that they can negotiate over terms

[Chinook]

Bruh - no. I hate Morris no matter what he does from here on out (unless he picks SA and plays amazing and works hard to shed this bs incident). I think most fans at least feel the same way.

How he’s viewed in a locker room and by teams may differ.

Nah. I don't really care what Morris does this summer if he re-signs. If he backed out to try to get LAL to sign him but came back after they said nothing than a min deal, that would be an issue. But if he has a chance at more money and passes it up, it speaks much more to his character than him listening at all. I certainly don't think the teammates will hate him if he sticks to SA. I wouldn't be surprised if Murray and the others are recruiting him now and might be playing a role him Morris holding off. As I fan, I pretty much considered him a mercenary before this. If he picks SA, at least I'll consider him a mercenary who will try his hardest to make good. Rather than it feeling like him being almost forced to agree with SA after they were the last girl at the ball, it would feel like he had options.

[Xx_SpursNation_xX]

him, toodles , enjoy the knicks

[timvp]

Bruh - no. I hate Morris no matter what he does from here on out

You'd hate him if he says, "I got a last second offer I had to consider from the Knicks but I decided I still wanted to go to San Antonio. Go Spurs Go, tbh!" ?

I don't think you would, IMO.

[slick'81]

Damn reggie bullock

[Duncan87]

Not a done deal yet but this dude looks gone

[Marcus Bryant]

Tbh, the more I think about it, this would actually work in Morris' favor if he signs with the Spurs. San Antonio would celebrate a guy who turned down more money from New York City to play for the Spurs. It wouldn't be a negative at all.

I think the Knicks have the better shot of signing him but all isn't lost. And Morris' reputation isn't damaged at all if he picks the Spurs.

If the Spurs and Morris are still talking I'm sure the Spurs are being clear about his role and likely amount of minutes in the rotation (ie significant). The Knicks threw out a larger number for one season, but what's his role with the rest of the 4s on the roster? How much PT?

[barakz21]

Well, guess that means he’s no Tony Montana if he does go to the Knicks..

”All I have in this world is my balls and my word, and I don’t break them for no one!”

[vy65]

yes. the form of the agreement. as in in a written contract, and not an oral promise

doesn't say anything about agreeing tbh... just that they can negotiate over terms

Negotiate and enter are the words used. If negotiations are successful there’s an agreement. Maybe I’m missing it but what in the CBA says the written contract on the required form is required to enforce a contract - or - that an oral agreement struck during the moratorium is otherwise unenforceable?

[Marcus Bryant]

Let's be honest, NBA careers go to Madison Square Garden to die.

[DPG21920]

You'd hate him if he says, "I got a last second offer I had to consider from the Knicks but I decided I still wanted to go to San Antonio. Go Spurs Go, tbh!" ?

I don't think you would, IMO.

But that is not what happened. This leaking like it did pretty clearly (to me) means the Spurs don’t feel that way either. When you have the league run the way it is, ANY thing like this is bad. This is not something to laud him over; he shouldn’t have even taken the call.

Maybe, if there was no trade of Bertans due to his commitment I could see this. Maybe. But there was a trade and the fact it’s even out there is wrong. That’s just my view and I think many others feel the same way.

Even if it was for a longer term deal with a lot more money and opportunity I would be more forgiving. This is just flat out character issue and going against what every knows the rules to be.

[Dhbsr555]

On it's own it's not a violation of the rule and I am sure players or teams reneg on stuff during free agency all the time and we just don't hear about it...

But when a team makes 2 moves that they can't undo BASED on your verbal agreement then it becomes the biggest possible violation of the rule...

Carroll now has a 3 year contract for no other reason than Morris said he would sign and the Spurs can't undo that...

Bertans is gone for nothing because Morris said he would sign and the Spurs can't undo that...

Bertans would have been gone anyway...but he would have been gone for more than nothing if this Morris thing never happens...

If they could go back and undo the bertans trade and the carroll sign and trade and just give him a large portion of the mle...no harm no foul...

But they can't...so now they might have just given away a player who had some value for absolutely nothing...

alot of people say bertans is gone for nothing we basically traded him for the full mid level exception.. which we still have even if he’s goes to ny. We were gonna use it on Carroll but that trade opens it up for another player

[Kindergarten Cop]

[spurraider21]

Negotiate and enter are the words used. If negotiations are successful there’s an agreement. Maybe I’m missing it but what in the CBA says the written contract on the required form is required to enforce a contract - or - that an oral agreement struck during the moratorium is otherwise unenforceable?

they wouldn't specifically say you can negotiate now, but can only enter an agreement afterwards... if they really meant its ok to make agreements during the moratorium. you're going against the plain language of the contract

[Marcus Bryant]

So, I was on a basketball forum and a law school class broke out.

[FkLA]

re (lawyer) fight

[poopbox]

alot of people say bertans is gone for nothing we basically traded him for the full mid level exception.. which we still have even if he’s goes to ny. We were gonna use it on Carroll but that trade opens it up for another player

But the spurs obviously would have rather used the MLE on Carroll until Morris entered the picture...which is why they did just that...

Hilariously enough this has created a paradox for the spurs where they are now probably going to spend the mle on a one dimensional 3 point shooting "stretch" who can play the 3 or 4 and is trash at defense...

You know...like Davis Bertans...

[vy65]

they wouldn't specifically say you can negotiate now, but can only enter an agreement afterwards... if they really meant its ok to make agreements during the moratorium. you're going against the plain language of the contract

Well not really, and that’s kinda my point. The contract is silent as to successful negotiations, or an oral agreement during the moratorium. So I don’t see how any other provision - which uses different language - preempts that contingency.

As a practical matter, you have teams act as though an oral agreement is binding. Like the Tiago trade or Bert. I find it hard to believe the spurs would rely on oral agreements struck during the moratorium if they meant nothing under the CBA. Like Chinook said, the purpose behind the moratorium period is to allow for salary cap machinations. That’s frustrated if the acBA says a verbal agreement is worthless or otherwise unenforceable.