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With another 1st (assuming it’s anywhere between 8th pick and lower… i don’t believe the Spurs have any assets to move that high and even the 8th pick is being generous):
Hawkins
Rupert
Keyonte
Tie between Wallace and Black
Hawkins
Bufkin
Rupert
Murray
George
Coulibaly
Hood-Schifino
Jackson
Whitehead
That's not how I have them on my Board, but that's probably where I'd put them on our Board.
With another 1st (assuming it’s anywhere between 8th pick and lower… i don’t believe the Spurs have any assets to move that high and even the 8th pick is being generous):
Hawkins
Rupert
Keyonte
Tie between Wallace and Black
Would take them in the late lottery/late teens:
Keyonte George
Dariq Whitehead (if health checks out)
Kobe Bufkin
Jordan Hawkins
Would take them but in the 20s:
Rayan Rupert
Bilal Coulibaly
Don't want them:
Kris Murray
Hood Schifino
GG Jackson
Chopping it up on other threads really has cemented the thinking that the Spurs need to be aggressive in this draft. There are other solutions to the PG problem, but they aren't looking fantastic.
1. Go with what we have into the future, hope for the best.
2. Get a starting PG through free agency.
3. Draft a starting PG. (Do so sooner than later.)
I am a Tre Jones supporter. I don't think he's a longterm starter. Both his height and shooting limit him, but retaining him this summer is vital. I'm honestly not a big optimist in Wesley. Develop him, certainly, but I think he's more of a SG than the point you need.
I do think Sochan and others can initiate the offense. I don't think a pure playmaker or a pure shooter is necessary. My big thing is we need a point of attack defender. That's my key skill in PGs. Shooting is second. Playmaking in the Spurs system can be taught (more or less).
Problems are:
1. Next draft looks pretty weak in PGs. Of course, no way of telling until games start. I don't want to count on getting the solution here.
2. Free agency doesn't look promising. Aging and problematic players this year. Only a guy like Dejounte Murray is on the horizon, possibly, and he's going to want a bag. Free agents are expensive.
3. The team is absolutely jammed with players right now. I know Barlow is not assured, or KBD. But I don't think guys like Branham or Wesley or Mamu are assured. We have a lot of picks coming up.
Really think the play here is getting aggressive with the draft this year. As discussed, there are probably amounts the Spurs FO is willing to pay. Maybe it's for certain players, or maybe they cap out across the board.
Anthony Black
Cason Wallace
Kobe Bufkin
Jalen Hood-Schifino
Those, I think, are the 'aggressive' targets, guys who will be in the lottery or toward 20.
I don't think they'll go after Keyonte George or Nick Smith, Jr. Neither rates as a point/facilitator and both have big questions. Both might fall into the 20s, though. It's hard to imagine either as a starting point guard, and I want defense.
Later players include Colby Jones, Marcus Sasser, Andre Jackson, and Amari Bailey. Of the last three, Bailey seems to have the most upside. I don't think Sasser or Jackson is a real solution so much as a depth guy.
Anyway, I think this is a serious question going forward. There are no great solutions on the immediate horizon and I'm curious to see how the team tries to solve it.
Moving up to pick Black or Wallace I think will cost way more then what the Spurs will want to pay. To be honest people getting a little to greedy we just got the number 1 pick in the draft with a generational talent and people want to try and find another top starter in the same draft. As far as a PG I would like to find one but if not I am very confident we can find one in the draft in 23/25. Also, it is just not we get Wemby and a starting PG were set we still need to find a lottery SF and a defensive Center in the next couple of drafts so be careful of just giving away picks.
Where else are you getting your point guard if you don't get it in this draft? How do you know a good defensive point guard will be available in the next two years? Why wouldn't you be aggressive when you know the player you might need is there?
It's hazardous to make projection past this summer. Spurs will have nice trade assets at the 2024 trade deadline (expiring/cap space and first round picks), likely a lottery pick in 2024 and a lot of cap space to go after free agents next summer. They aren't in a bleak situation at all.
Focusing on this summer:
As you said, the answer won't come through free agency. Fred VanVleet or D'Angelo Russell aren't the answer. Tre or #33 pick being starter caliber players is somewhat unlikely.
To get a mid first round pick, the perfect entry point would be Miami at #18. They aren't in a good situation luxury tax wise and Spurs could give them a lot of breathing room this summer by taking Lowry $30M expiring contract.
A trade like Lowry + #18 for Birch (or Graham) + #33 would just make sense. Spurs could add some assets (#44, future second round pick, Charlotte pick?) to sweeten the deal.
The Miami pick is interesting.
The Spurs really have to take a good hack at it next week. I don't see any FA answers on the horizon and it's impossible to know what happens in future drafts.
We get it bro, you LOVE Anthony Black
There are Anthony Blacks that come around every year and it’s just a question of if the Spurs want to give up assets now to develop one now or if they can be patient and wait another year. IMO, the Anthony Black last year was Jalen Williams and I don’t even think Black will reach that level. There will be another Black next year. And if we’re being truly honest, guys in the lottery normally have decent stats (if they don’t have otherworldly athleticism) and Black’s numbers are quite underwhelming… he doesnt even reach .200 WS/40.
Hmm... Didn't say that in this thread.
Jalen Williams is not a point guard.
And the thread isn't about Black. It's about getting a defensive point guard who is a potential starter. I listed at least four of these, possibly six.
Do people just not know how to read? Is that the issue?
Maybe the world doesn’t revolve around you? I see mention of Black’s name in the post before mine and I’m free to post about it. off.
Theres also the option of trading for one thats on a current roster. I'm not really thinking of anyone in particular, but I'm just saying that the way the new cba is going to effect teams may make someone available that we aren't thinking about.
My preference though is trading for a PG in this draft. You'll hate this, but my prder of preference (I'm leaving out Scoot and Amen because I don't see us moving that high) is:
NSJ
Wallace
Black
Bufkin
JHS
If we move up I really like taking the upside of Keyonte George, JHS, or Nick Smith. (In that order I think)
I dont think the spurs honestly view the need of an actual PG, just a combo guard that can do a little bit of everything
Should go after Keyonte he is still the best shooter and shot maker among combo guards. We underrating his size and frame at 205, he probably plays at 210. That prevents him from being a huge liability on defense.
I agree that I am pushing more for a 'point guard' distributor. Not even Parker was that kind of player. If the team thinks those guys you mention are good targets, then by all means. I think George might not be up to snuff on the defensive end. That's really what I'm after as much as anything.
Jalen Williams was a 21 YO Junior. Black is a 19 YO freshman.
Scoot's WS/48 = -0.054
Last edited by exstatic; 06-13-2023 at 09:02 AM.
You okay? Maybe sit this one out?
Typical Body, act like an ass and then deflect by saying something sassy. Always trying to “win the internet” by being a keyboard warrior.
You know how I feel about age already, and you know I disagree with you about Scoot’s athleticism (that you downplay it heavily). So we’re gonna go into a rabbit hole again here with me being open minded about how these players will end up while you go on about knowing which players will be successful and which won’t. Just a ridiculous type of discussion reeking of arrogance about one’s own judgment about NBA players (you and that boi Body)
As this debate has evolved I have come to the conclusion that the guy to target is Bufkin. He plays good D, has a great feel for the game, finishes a crazy high percentage at the rim and can shoot the 3 both C&S and off the dribble. And he could very well be available outside the lottery. He has good positional size at 6'5" and just has the feel of being a great fit for the Spurs.
I simply took a criteria that you applied as a negative to Black, and applied it to Scoot. Has nothing to do with athleticism.
I know your stance on age, just as you know mine, but the fact is that the overwhelming majority of FRPs are 18/19, not 21/22, so I think the NBA kind of sees it more my way. If you stick around in college until you're 21/22, you're stronger and more physically developed, but it doesn't make you a better star prospect, IMO. I don't see it being much different from the 20YO Thompsons playing against 15/16 YO kids.
100%. He's mocked all over the place from the 20s into maybe even 9. He'll go somewhere in between.
I want to look more at Wallace. I've kind of determined him as not the right fit, but that's unfair.
As for Hood-Schifino, I watched the Hoosiers this year. I strongly felt like he'd be a lotto pick if he stayed another year. There were flashes. He's big, under control, has some nice moments, and then all that would disappear.
One thing that happens in the NBA, that I feel is under-recognized, is that players just don't get time to develop. It's one thing to work out in gyms and against your teammates, it's another to have play after play in a game environment. A lot of players never get that game time stuff because they aren't good enough. Or, if they do, it's in very specific roles and duties for very limited number of plays.
This is why a lot of players crap out, I feel. Some cannot scale down. They're volume shooters who cannot become specialists. Others have terrible flaws, but could become good if they could work them out. One great thing about the Spurs these last years is that they've taken flawed players and really worked with them. We're seeing it with Wesley now. I feel the same about Hood-Schifino. If a team works with him, sets aside non-productive time and does it on and off the court, he could be what you need.
What do you guys think about Garland? He's just 23 and is a perfect point guard for modern NBA.
His size wouldn't be an issue considering the rest of our projected roster.
The only issue is that he already signed a max which kicks in this summer. 33-36-38-41-44 million over the next 5 seasons.
Still, the cap will rise and he'll definitely be worth at least 30 a year.
22/8 on great efficency while playing together with chucker Mitc and poor spacing. Could easily be a 25/10 guy for us.
He's a bad fit on the Cavs because him and Mitc can't defend together and they can't afford to have two of them on 60+ million per season with no good wings on the roster and Mobley's extension coming up.
Keldon can't land us a good point guard in the draft, but I'm sure Cavs would be willing to take him for Garland and Spurs wouldn't have to give up much else because of Keldon's team-friendly deal that would serve as an additiona asset for the Cavs.
Other than Garland, maybe we could take advantage of dumpster fire in Minnesota next summer if Edwards asks out, but they'd ask for a lot. Beyond those two, there aren't any realistic deals to be had that fit the timeline.
And I'm not going to pretend that I know much about the upcoming drafts.
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