I already demonstrated that this is false, but keep on preaching, whott.Sandman...I think it's fair to describe AJ as a pass first PG...he damn sure wasn't a scoring PG, nor was he a defensive PG....
He was a pass first guy, he just wasn't a very good one, hence the 5.5.
It's funny...5.5 I think is a little under Parker's career average and that's probably the worst part of his game...all you need to know is that the best part of AJ's game is the worst part of Parker's and Parker still puts up better numbers...and he hasn't even been the primary ball handler yet in his career.
If Tony Parker was here in the mid 90s, this team would've won at least 7 championships. Avery was the weakest link for years. the Spurs tried repeatedly to find a replacement and when no one was available, they went to an 18 year old, french kid in the second round.
That should explain it to you right there, it's pretty black and white for those of you on the fence.
Avery was the tiest starting point guard in the NBA. It's ing do ented.
Guess it was just an oversight the Spurs' management was going to give Manu AJ's number until Harris ranted.
Why would I want AJ in the HOF? He's not a HOF.I'd be willing to bet that in the deepest darkest corner of the mind of the AJ fan...they'd be willing to give up every championship the Spurs have if it could get AJ into the HOF.
He is worthy of the honor of a retired jersey, which is not at all the same thing. And I support the Spurs above all else. I knew AJ was through as a player when the Spurs released him, so I wasn't bothered by that. I don't root for the Mavericks even though AJ's their coach. I didn't like that the Spurs traded Malik Rose, but my loyalty is to the Silver and Black, not to Rose.
Keep on propping up those strawmen!
It was no oversight...
As Pop was handing Manu the jersey he told him and I quote, "The last guy to wear that number hit a championship clinching shot".
Pop and the Spurs had no intention of retiring that jersey...and once Don Harris made a big stink about it Pop was on the spot and his friendship with AJ was on the line...
It was a total and complete coup, and prior to that AJ wasn't near as hated as he is now.
So all they did is make sure that AJ is going to go down as the joke jersey retireee and the least liked player up there...
If we are talking pass-first, then those three would definitely have to set the standard by which all others are judged. A 7.5 apg average is a significant drop from their standard, but could still be considered above average. I guess I personally have a hard time reconciling "pass-first" with a player who had average assists totals outside of a span of 5 years, but if we are limiting the discussion to his stint as the Spurs starter, the point is valid.
I don't know...I just know AJ fans are fascist....and this whole jersey retirement thing is one of the most fascist wrong ever imposed upon Spursfans...
There are more people against this jersey retirement than any other player up there.
All I gotta say is this completely opens the door for Bruce, Manu, AND Parker. All of them have probably contributed more to this organization than AJ did, regardless of what kind of warm spot they had in people's hearts.
, if we're retiring fan favorites, put Willis' number in the rafters.
The reason I'm doing that is because the jersey retirement is about his time as a Spur, not his career.but if we are limiting the discussion to his stint as the Spurs starter, the point is valid.
Conversely, the Spurs would have no grounds to retire the jerseys of Moses Malone or Dominique Wilkins, two HOFers who spent one of their last seasons as Spurs.
Avery Johnson’s number to be retired by the Spurs
Art Garcia | Mavs.com
Posted: Oct. 2, 2007
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Though his current NBA home is in Dallas, the playing career of Avery Johnson will always be associated with San Antonio. Soon, there’s going to be a permanent reminder.
Johnson is receiving an early Christmas gift in the Alamo City with the retirement of his jersey by the Spurs. The ceremony to place No. 6 in the rafters of the SBC Center is set for Dec. 22 during San Antonio’s game against the Los Angeles Clippers.
Spurs coach Gregg Popovich and owner Peter Holt told Johnson about the honor this summer. Johnson, along with David Robinson and Sean Elliott, were considered the heart of San Antonio’s first championship team in 1999. The numbers of Robinson and Elliott are already hanging in the arena.
“That’s a really special deal,” Johnson said Tuesday after the first practice of training camp. “I got that call from Peter and Pop this summer, and it’s something to really be excited about. I don’t think I ever would have thought when I started playing in the NBA I’d get my jersey retired.”
Johnson is San Antonio’s all-time assists leader, and ranks in the top seven in scoring, games played and steals. His baseline jumper in Game 5 of the 1999 NBA Finals clinched the Spurs’ first le.
“I’m ecstatic about that,” said first-year Mavericks assistant Mario Elie, also Johnson’s backcourt partner on the 1999 Spurs. “Avery is an amazing man, father and part of the community. I just remember how much joy he had when he hit that shot and we won the championship.
“I had the pleasure of playing with three of those guys up there, and I knew it was only a matter of time for Avery. We both have such a special relationship because of the hard road we took to the NBA, and it’s going to be hard for me to hold back the tears when it happens.”
Johnson had one request for the ceremony.
“We’re not having it when the Mavericks play them,” he said, referring to a break in the Mavs' schedule. “Pop and I both agreed to that, so I’m really excited about that. It’s going to be a special night for me and my family, and all of the people that invested in me.”
http://www.nba.com/mavericks/news/Av...er_100207.html
But if the rest of his career does not support those numbers, is that indicative of him or the system he was playing in?
I am a huge UCLA and Cowboys fan, but I know that Aikman would not have won those Super Bowls on another team. He was the ultimate system QB.
So the question is, did AJ make the system, or did the system make AJ?
I'm glad they aren't doing it at a Mavericks a game.
For one, it lets AJ soak up his moment without having to act tough for his team. Regardless of whether you think he deserves it, the guy should at least be able to enjoy the night.
Secondly, I had to see a team get worked-up to beat another team over a ring ceremony / retirement / something similar. I like for the reasons to come on the court, not for some pissed off Maverick team wanting to make a big deal of their coaches retirement ceremony on ANOTHER team.
Woot.I think he deserves it.
they should've retired his jump shot
In his speech Avery definitely needs to thank Harris for making this all possible.
Why?
His total betrayal speaks volumes of what kind of person he is. You don't steal your former teams style, get beat in the process and then get your jersey retired. Re ed. You SA folk either have too much class or are soft.
It was Pop's idea.
Try again.
Pop + timvp + David Robinson + Peter Holt > whottt + Sequ
this was posted in response to this:
While AJ wasn't the 3rd stringer on that Warriors team (an unfortunate exaggeration), it's a joke to use Johnson's time in GS as some sort of validation of how good he was as a player.And there's a reason he couldn't hold a job as a 3rd stringer on any team that didn't have an All Time Great NBA bigman.
AJ was signed to be the back-up in GS. A 10 minute a game back-up, and he was only signed to a one year guaranteed deal, because the cheap Spurs wouldn't even guarantee him one year.
The ONLY reason AJ was a starter in GS was because Hardaway shredded his knee before the season started. That's why he was the starter, because of injury. And even though Hardaway's future was in doubt as a player, GS still didn't put up a fight to keep Avery from signing with the Spurs after Pop got the gig.
A well deserved award. Spurs fans can't begrudge AJ taking a good opportunity for his second career. Of course they will, because most of them hopped on the bandwagon after 2005.
If you need stats to tell you AJ > Nazr, it might be too late.
30% is a lot larger than "slightly". And I've already covered how AJ owned Kidd, Nash and KJ.
AJ destroyed the best trio of point guards of all-time, yet Spurs fans in here want to label him a scrub. That'd be like if Nazr owned Wilt, Russell and Robinson and then Spurs fans said he was a bench warmer along for the rid.
AJ's role changed from year to year. In 1995, he was a pass first point guard. In 1999, he played a role similar to how Tony Parker plays now ... minus the scoring and defense
Would you say Nazr = Parker?
I applaud you for recognizing his intangibles.
Talent alone doesn't win championships. You don't win championships without intangibles. That's why the Mavs and the Suns are the Mavs and the Suns. The dirty little secret is the Spurs used to be in the same boat. Luckily, AJ helped the Spurs get out of that boat and onto the land where only champions roam.
Sincerely,
The same guy who said, "They're sending a boy to do a man's job" and, "let him make his own number".
God it's sweet AJ got his ing ass beat into the dirt and was humiliated almost as badly in the playoffs the last 2 years as he was by Sam Cassell and Derek Fisher...
It did wonders for his ty at ude...
As long as AJ is going to be humble...I have no problems with him getting in on mascot appeal...
I will continue to be outraged at those who claim he deserves be up there based on his play though....I will continue to question their knowledge of the game.
By the way...
Pretty sure Pop is trying to avoid an ugly scene...it's kind of already been promised to AJ that his jersey was going to be retired the day they took the number back from Manu...
And with every passing year he becomes less popular...not only because he coaches the Mavs...but also because Parker ing owns him as a PG and makes any statistical argument for his jersey being retired more and more of a joke with each passing game.
If he gets any less popular the Spurs are going to be caught between a rock and a hard place trying to pull off his jersey retirement....
Luckily for AJ, Pop choked against him 2 years ago...if we'd have won that series, AJ wouldn't have a prayer of getting up there...
No one gets more scorn than a loser...that win over us is the only thing that saved his jersey retirement hopes...at least with the win he still maintained a shred of respect in SA.
Timvp...will you be wearing a shirt paying tribute to his classy statements about Manu and Parker when you attend his retirement...or will you just kind of...forget about it and think it better left swept under the rug?
Wouldn't want AJ's actual words to be correctly attributed to him, now would we?
The sheep might then correctly conclude he's every bit the asshole Damon Stoudamire was...and we wouldn't want that(reality)...
Not only that...but that Warrior team had Chris Webber on it...
He's not going to be a HOF'er, because he's choking whining cancerous ...but game wise, he was definitely a HOF caliber bigman.
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