2016-17 Training Camp Thread

[tonight...you]

I'm not nearly as keen on semantics as you seem to be.

You're not nearly as keen on accuracy and memory, that's for sure.

[tbdog]

That's not a rule at all. Normally, you can totally re-sign players you waive. It's only a question because the Spurs stretched him and thus could be accused of cheating the cap by re-signing him.

As far as I know, the new cba directly addressed this issue, that you cannot play for the team that traded you or waived you in that season.

[dabom]

You're not nearly as keen on accuracy and memory, that's for sure.

[tonight...you]

Look, I don't want to be a to Chinook, but Jesus Christ! Things are getting misrepresented and I'm supposed to just think, ah... semantics. We were talking about this just an hour ago!

[Chinook]

As far as I know, the new cba directly addressed this issue, that you cannot play for the team that traded you or waived you in that season.

You can't play for a team if they've traded you in the past year (unless you were an expiring or didn't have an option picked up). You can be waived and re-signed just fine, so long as you're not traded.

[dabom]

NVM

[Chinook]

Look, I don't want to be a to Chinook, but Jesus Christ! Things are getting misrepresented and I'm supposed to just think, ah... semantics. We were talking about this just an hour ago!

You seem obsessed with having your words represented as you've intended while also having an issue with others' posts being too verbose. It's extremely inconsistent. If you wrote longer posts, it would be harder to get a meaning you didn't intend. That's why people do it. Sometimes, they're too concerned with people potentially misinterpreting it. And sometimes people are s and do it anyway. But that's the idea.

Anyway, no, I don't care to explore the differences between "posting too much" or "making posts that are too long" or "saying things in too many words". I don't think it's a helpful distinction to make as 1) I won't be posting with any of those in mind and 2) We can totally bury this conversation and pretend like this never happened. I'll keep on posting as I like, and you'll do the same, and when we want to talk to each other, we can do that with no ill will.

[dabom]

1) The Report:

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/view...?f=2&t=1465870

(Basically a recap of chatter from front-office guys during the summer league. Posting the entire Spurs section, but the last point is the most important.)



2) Credibility

Keith Smith is a basketball writer who is a Celtics mod on RealGM (Smitth731). He's basically all of the things you guys like about me and none of the things you guys don't like about me. He's the author of what is easily the most comprehensive spreadsheet out there for NBA salaries:https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1562502222 Like Mark Deeks, he's not the quickest with the news, but he's the most accurate at least when it comes to salaries.

He freely admits he's not a reporter, and if you know of him at all, it's possible that you do because he sort of "broke" a Griffin-to-Boston trade that hasn't happened yet. So right now, he's not on the tier right Woj in terms of dropping bombs. Still, this is Spurstalk, not a court of law.

3) Veracity

I believe Smith did hear the chatter. He has a good track record and does too much other good work for it to make sense for him to damage his credibility about a team/fanbase he probably don't care much about at all. But that's only part of the equation. Who was his source? The big possibility would be RC, since he was there and easily available and would obviously know what the team was thinking. But there were other Spurs' people there, including some FO guys probably and definitely the SL coaching staff. The latter group doesn't really seem to have much credibility, except for maybe Becky. Then there could be their players, but I consider that completely unlikely. Regardless of who said it, I have a hard time believing it. They didn't even know they were going to get Dedmon (although by the time whoever talked to Smith, they did, obviously), I don't think they'd be crazy enough to plan on starting Willie Reed, and he was the runner up.

4) Implications

Like OMG. It's strange to think Pau would be okay with this. But if it were something the Spurs would say during the SL, then you'd have to think they talked to him about it prior to signing him. Whether it works out that Pau comes off the bench or not, it sure does suggest that he's not obsessed with starting. But it does make sense. Off the bench, the Spurs are looking to play one-in-four-out, so he'd probably get a sh'ton of low-post touches he wouldn't necessarily be able to have with the starters. I'd probably be hurt defensively, however, playing without at least one of Green or Kawhi a lot of the time.

For the bench, it would change my projection of their offense. I'd actually expect it to be closer to how the starters roll, with Anderson playing the Kawhi role on offense and Pau playing the LMA role. I don't know how much I would like that. Manu would just sort of be there, like Parker is with the starters. Mills should be fine. And Bertans/Simmons would probably get touches. But I don't think there's a consistent plan of attack with that unit. Just seems like a lot of iso's and jump-shooting. Should help stave off worry about the bench not having talent or go-to offense, though.

For the starters, it sort of allows them to keep their offense from last year. Dedmon doesn't have Tim's upside offensively, but if he can board and finish, he should be able to be more effective than Tim was at the end. Parker gets another PnR partner, which might help him drive more easily. Green gets a dump-off man on his ill-fated drives. For the folks wanting that big roll-man/finisher, you'd be getting your wish. Defensively, the idea of funneling to Dedmon seems interesting. Dude's a talented shot-blocker, and you'd hope Danny and Kawhi would put him in easy-help positions. He can show on the PnR and recover, so that's an improvement over Duncan. But he's also a foul-machine, at least for a potential starter. Tim's best defensive attribute was that he contested so well without fouling. Would be an adjustment.

For Dedmon, I think this would hurt him. The SL won't have the spacing the bench was projected to. I think he's getting third-big minutes no matter where he is in the rotation, so instead of being a pillar of offensive ball-movement as he would be off the bench, he would be the fifth option that'd really only get touches if the third option can't find a way to score. He'd have to live as a garbage man, which is cool, but not as glamorous. Could still end up closing out games if he plays his role well enough, though.

I wonder if he'll ever respond to this.

[tonight...you]

You seem obsessed with having your words represented as you've intended while also having an issue with others' posts being too verbose. It's extremely inconsistent. If you wrote longer posts, it would be harder to get a meaning you didn't intend. That's why people do it. Sometimes, they're too concerned with people potentially misinterpreting it. And sometimes people are s and do it anyway. But that's the idea.

Anyway, no, I don't care to explore the differences between "posting too much" or "making posts that are too long" or "saying things in too many words". I don't think it's a helpful distinction to make as 1) I won't be posting with any of those in mind and 2) We can totally bury this conversation and pretend like this never happened. I'll keep on posting as I like, and you'll do the same, and when we want to talk to each other, we can do that with no ill will.

[Chinook]

Cool. So who's your guy for the last spot?

[tonight...you]

Cool. So who's your guy for the last spot?

I don't have a gut feeling yet. Right now it's Lapro, or Arci just for that 3rd PG position, but I wouldn't be surprised to see that spot to remain open also.
After a few pre-season games, I'm sure we'll all have a better feel for things. I like Garino, after watching him D up some guys, but he looked a lot better in the Olympics than in college and I wonder why...

[Chinook]

I don't have a gut feeling yet. Right now it's Lapro, or Arci just for that 3rd PG position, but I wouldn't be surprised to see that spot to remain open also.
After a few pre-season games, I'm sure we'll all have a better feel for things. I like Garino, after watching him D up some guys, but he looked a lot better in the Olympics than in college and I wonder why...

I would kind of be surprised if the spot was left open, now that they have five candidate for the Toros and only four allotments. They seemed to have given money to the rookies to make being in Austin more palatable, so their plan looks to be to have them there. I have no idea if they gave Richards any money, but with the Toros lacking bigs, it would be best if he were assigned there. Obviously, losing the 20th man is hardly a tragedy, but still, it seems best to hold onto them for a least a little while. They all have some use to the big club.

For Garino, I think he played better because he was playing with better teammates. Role-players tend not to have as big of a struggle as stars, as their roles tend not to change, while many college stars end up having to face the fact that they can't dominate against better guys. Look at Jimmer for an example.

[tonight...you]

I would kind of be surprised if the spot was left open, now that they have five candidate for the Toros and only four allotments. They seemed to have given money to the rookies to make being in Austin more palatable, so their plan looks to be to have them there. I have no idea if they gave Richards any money, but with the Toros lacking bigs, it would be best if he were assigned there. Obviously, losing the 20th man is hardly a tragedy, but still, it seems best to hold onto them for a least a little while. They all have some use to the big club.

For Garino, I think he played better because he was playing with better teammates. Role-players tend not to have as big of a struggle as stars, as their roles tend not to change, while many college stars end up having to face the fact that they can't dominate against better guys. Look at Jimmer for an example.

Yeah... I like that kid (Garino). We'll see how the cookie crumbles soon enough.

[Chinook]

Yeah... I like that kid (Garino). We'll see how the cookie crumbles soon enough.

, yeah. Monday.

[SAGirl]

I would kind of be surprised if the spot was left open, now that they have five candidate for the Toros and only four allotments. They seemed to have given money to the rookies to make being in Austin more palatable, so their plan looks to be to have them there. I have no idea if they gave Richards any money, but with the Toros lacking bigs, it would be best if he were assigned there. Obviously, losing the 20th man is hardly a tragedy, but still, it seems best to hold onto them for a least a little while. They all have some use to the big club.

For Garino, I think he played better because he was playing with better teammates. Role-players tend not to have as big of a struggle as stars, as their roles tend not to change, while many college stars end up having to face the fact that they can't dominate against better guys. Look at Jimmer for an example.

I kind of expect them to pick somebody. Pop hasn't had trouble the past couple of seasons going in with a full roster.

Contract issues completely mystify me, but it's not like they have cap space to pick up somebody random midseason, and if they do pick up a vet minimum, they had no trouble cutting ppl in the past (Butler and Ray, Daye the season before). I kind of think part of the reason they didn't pick up Bonner was to not have to face the decision to cut him midseason. He was close to being the cut last season. I do think Pop wrestled with that decision a small degree at least, and if he was in position to cut Bonner this season again, then it was time to let him go. Bertans made his skills completely redundant and if there was a need to cut somebody, Bonner would have been the first to go. That is sort of how I see the Bonner situation. In terms of who they pick up, I tend to think guard, but a lot depends on how Murray himself is looking. Pop may want somebody just to compete with him and push him to be better.

Other than that, Garino could be useful considering the small ball league, possible injuries, JSimms possibly not being solid after all, etc. There is Bertans there to, but since he said he's playing the 4, I am taking him at his word. It's possible in a Bertans, Anderson lineup they can crossmatch and do whatever and it doesn't matter what you call each, but technically for Pop he's a 4. With Anderson it doens't matter what we call him, but in lineups with other perimeter players, Bertans is likely a 4, so maybe there is a spot for another wing.

It's hard to tell without seeing these guys play in preseason games. I don't think bottom line that there is anyone clearly ahead. Do you?

[ceperez]

I don't have a gut feeling yet. Right now it's Lapro, or Arci just for that 3rd PG position, but I wouldn't be surprised to see that spot to remain open also.
After a few pre-season games, I'm sure we'll all have a better feel for things. I like Garino, after watching him D up some guys, but he looked a lot better in the Olympics than in college and I wonder why...

The more experienced player will likely stick. Spurs need a 3rd point guard. This guy will likely stick: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXP7yxsWRaA

Garino will likely go to Toros. He already expressed that he would. I would love to have an additional 3 and D player though,

[ace3g]

GP Sports Argentina ‏@GPSportsArg

Manu, Pato y Nico en acción! #TrainingCamp.(vía @spurs) #TeamGPSports

[tbdog]

You can't play for a team if they've traded you in the past year (unless you were an expiring or didn't have an option picked up). You can be waived and re-signed just fine, so long as you're not traded.

Well if I am wrong, I am wrong. But isn't there a fine line between getting waived and resigned and restructuring a deal? Couldn't teams waive expensive contracts that would not be claimed off the waiver wire then resigned to have less of a burden on the cap?

[SpursFan86]

[tonight...you]

The more experienced player will likely stick. Spurs need a 3rd point guard. This guy will likely stick: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXP7yxsWRaA

Garino will likely go to Toros. He already expressed that he would. I would love to have an additional 3 and D player though,

Agreed on all points. I think I said my initial thought would be him, or Arci with Lapro being a more certain prospect, in my eyes. At least to begin the season.

[cd98]

he shouldn't worry so much about conditioning. Standing and waiving a towel doesn't take that much out of you.

[ace3g]

San Antonio Spurs Verified account ‏@spurs











GP Sports Argentina ‏@GPSportsArg

Manu, Pato y Nico en acción! #TrainingCamp.(vía @spurs) #TeamGPSports

[tonight...you]

That's nice to read!

[tbdog]

From those pics. Parker, Green, LMA, Gasol are on team black. Mills, Simmons, Manu, Leonard, Dedmon are on team white. Now we know Leonard will be a starter, but I am pretty sure this means Parker will continue to start over Mills.

[Chinook]

Well if I am wrong, I am wrong. But isn't there a fine line between getting waived and resigned and restructuring a deal? Couldn't teams waive expensive contracts that would not be claimed off the waiver wire then resigned to have less of a burden on the cap?

Yes. But that's not very common for a lot of reasons, not the least of which are that owners don't want to spend more money and that GMs don't want to expose players they like to other teams by waiving them.