2024 NBA Off-Season Thread (FA, Trades, Extensions, Rumors)

[Ice009]

NYK saying yo' aprons though. Their tax bill is now estimated at $35MM this year, and they have $170MM+ committed going out all the way to 2027-28. Yikes.

So the Knicks will be paying 35M in luxury tax this season? That doesn't seem like much for a team with deep pockets. When you say $170M + committed, is that future luxury tax playments?

Make sure to @ me when that happens.

I don't get a chance to read a lot here. Did you call this before and people didn't agree?

[scott]

So the Knicks will be paying 35M in luxury tax this season? That doesn't seem like much for a team with deep pockets. When you say $170M + committed, is that future luxury tax playments?

$170MM committed through 2027-28 meaning that's how much salary is tied up in players that far out. For that 2027-28 season, the bulk of that ($147MM) is tied up in just 3 players: KAT, OG, Brunson. The cap is expected to be $187MM that year, so it will be interesting to see how they manage to build the team from there. You'd assume they're going to be looking to resign Bridges, but who knows.

I don't get a chance to read a lot here. Did you call this before and people didn't agree?

No, I just don't think it will happen, but it doesn't really matter. My point is that 7 years is too far in the future to place to much emphasis on what happens now impacting how that pick ends up looking for us in 2031. It's so far out, that Minny could completely implode and trade Ant and still have time to draft some new star and be good again by then. 7 years in the future is just too far out. 7 years ago, Kawhi Leonard was coming off back-to-back Top 3 MVP in voting, DPOY 2 of the last 3 seasons on a Spurs team that went 61-21 and were a Zaza dirty play away from another le.

[spurraider21]

I like this move for MIN, especially so if they’re able to re-route Randle for picks and an expiring. Supposedly Miami and ATL had separate discussions with the Knicks for randle.

white donte on ~ 3/35 for a contender is such an incredible value

[exstatic]

Darn, so the Warriors not resigning Klay, and this T-Wolves trade, you think the second apron is the reason for it and that they may not have happened if this rule wasn't in place? Do you think the Warriors would have re-signed Klay if not for the second apron?

Also, wasn't KAT supposedly good friends with Anthony Edwards? You think the Wolves consulted with AE before making this trade?

I wonder if there would ever be a chance if Edwards wants out in a couple of years if he'd/they consider trading with the Spurs to get that first round pick back. That pick could be a lot better for the Spurs that I was thinking even just a month ago. Man, things can happen quickly in the NBA.

I don't think it's a great trade for either team. Then again, it could work out for both teams. Have to see how the players mesh on their new teams.

I absolutely do. Think about it. Like a year or two ago, Lacob paid $450-500M in salary and taxes. He ain’t cheap. He just sees the cliff ahead for the aging Warriors, and doesn’t want the multi offender penalties to kick in.

[LeBowen]

I absolutely do. Think about it. Like a year or two ago, Lacob paid $450-500M in salary and taxes. He ain’t cheap. He just sees the cliff ahead for the aging Warriors, and doesn’t want the multi offender penalties to kick in.

Ridiculous amount of tax aside, being over second apron is worth it only for top contenders that are content with their roster.

If you're over, you can't aggregate salaries in trade. Can just do 1:1 trades.
Can't sign and trade if it doesn't get you under second apron. You also lose trade exceptions from S&T.
First year of being over second apron means you can't trade a pick 7 years away (like TWolves did this year) and staying there for more than one year automatically puts that pick at the end of the first round.

Right now, being over second apron is worth it for the Celtics and maybe the Knicks.
We'll see if OKC will go over in two years when extensions for Chet and Williams kick in.

[Maddog]

I think Minnesota may realize they're odds to win it all is not great as currently constructed and have no long term flexibility-
I don't think this trade makes them a whole lot better but gives them more long term flexibility (though cap space is probably overrated)

Minnesota is also receiving the first-round pick that the Pistons owe the Knicks, according to Steve Popper of Newsday (Twitter link). That first-rounder is for 2025, but is top-13 protected. If it lands in its protected range, it would roll over to 2026 (top-11 protected) and 2027 (top-nine protected) before turning into a ’27 second-round pick

[CGD]

I really don’t like KAT, but on paper I think this is a good trade for both teams. The Knicks pushed the chips in with that Brunson discount, and also got off two pieces that really didn’t fit anymore (DiVezenzo became a weird fit after Bridges and I think the want to give McBride more play). The writing was on the wall for MIN from a strictly financial perspective.

[baseline bum]

Champagnie? No arguments from here there... but what does that have to do with anything?

Forgot that name for Randle never crept upstairs and was more and NBA forum thing to scoff him back when Laker fan was hyping that scrub. Randle is a loser.

[Mr. Body]

Look over at the Brandon Ingram situation. Dude's not getting that money. I don't know if KAT would have gotten that bag nowadays. He's a legacy huge contract player that we may not see as much going forward.

I don't know. Teams often can't help themselves. Boston is going all-in with blimped-out contracts. It's won them a chip, but they'll be in trouble.

The purpose of the CBA was to stop those big tickets (for 'pretty good' players, at least). With Ingram and Klay Thompson it worked. I think before long teams will get back into the awful habit, but we'll see.

[R. DeMurre]

Look over at the Brandon Ingram situation. Dude's not getting that money. I don't know if KAT would have gotten that bag nowadays. He's a legacy huge contract player that we may not see as much going forward.

I don't know. Teams often can't help themselves. Boston is going all-in with blimped-out contracts. It's won them a chip, but they'll be in trouble.

The purpose of the CBA was to stop those big tickets (for 'pretty good' players, at least). With Ingram and Klay Thompson it worked. I think before long teams will get back into the awful habit, but we'll see.

The fact that the majority owners of the Celtics sold right after winning a championship is a pretty damning sign... you'd think after winning a chip, multimillionaires would at least be excited about the possibility of a repeat, but in this case they saw it as the best time to cash out and avoid all of the inevitable financial difficulties and tough decisions that'll have to make in the near future.

[baseline bum]

The fact that the majority owners of the Celtics sold right after winning a championship is a pretty damning sign... you'd think after winning a chip, multimillionaires would at least be excited about the possibility of a repeat, but in this case they saw it as the best time to cash out and avoid all of the inevitable financial difficulties and tough decisions that they'll have to make in the near future.

Celtics not having a Jokic or a Doncic or an SGA means it'll be really hard for them to keep that team on top when it was so good because of how strong its role players were. This CBA really seems like it's going to help teams with franchise carrying level #1 options that you can keep retooling around while wrecking teams built on depth.

[R. DeMurre]

I don't think it's possible to judge the NY/Minn trade yet, because I'm not convinced the T-Wolves are keeping Randle long term. His contract will be easier to trade than KAT's, and if they're sure that Ant is their #1 guy, they can focus on building around/complementing him, getting assets For Randle, and staying financially flexible. Finding someone to unload KAT on might have become a 2 step process in Connelly & Lloyd's minds, because finding anyone willing to take on that contract is not an easy task.

[baseline bum]

I don't think it's possible to judge the NY/Minn trade yet, because I'm not convinced the T-Wolves are keeping Randle long term. His contract will be easier to trade than KAT's, and if they're sure that Ant is their #1 guy, they can focus on building around/complementing him, getting assets For Randle, and staying financially flexible. Finding someone to unload KAT on might have become a 2 step process in Connelly & Lloyd's minds, because finding anyone willing to take on that contract is not an easy task.

IDK we have seen repeatedly that any contract is tradeable if the guy has a pulse (eg not Luol Deng racking up DNPs). I think the Knicks are getting Towns with the idea of trying to win a le in the next two years, and then they'll salary dump him when Bridges is up for a new contract. Plus as bad as Towns contract looks right now, the cap having big jumps every year from the new TV & streaming deal will tamp that down sticker shock significantly by 26-27 when NYK would probably be looking to dump him.

[R. DeMurre]

IDK we have seen repeatedly that any contract is tradeable if the guy has a pulse (eg not Luol Deng racking up DNPs). I think the Knicks are getting Towns with the idea of trying to win a le in the next two years, and then they'll salary dump him when Bridges is up for a new contract. Plus as bad as Towns contract looks right now, the cap is having big jumps every year from the new TV & streaming deal that will tamp that down sticker shock significantly by 26-27 when NYK would probably be looking to dump him.

I agree for the most part, with the caveat that the extremely punitive nature of the second apron will change the dynamic of unloading guys that are seen as good but overpaid, which I think is sort of the consensus on KAT. NY definitely is thinking they have a legit shot in the next two years.

[baseline bum]

I agree for the most part, with the caveat that the extremely punitive nature of the second apron will change the dynamic of unloading guys that are seen as good but overpaid, which I think is sort of the consensus on KAT. NY definitely is thinking they have a legit shot in the next two years.

I think KAT's talented enough that he'll still be movable. Someone else not at the aprons will see him as a missing piece and it'll be a short contract by then.

With this CBA I still can't believe Utah didn't move Marakkanen and try to tank. With how important a #1 guy is going to be in it, and Lauri will never be that, they should be Brooklyn level tanking for Flagg this year and Dybantsa and Boozer the next. Especially when secondary prizes like Harper, Traore, or Bailey could end up that #1 guy too.

[LeBowen]

Look over at the Brandon Ingram situation. Dude's not getting that money. I don't know if KAT would have gotten that bag nowadays. He's a legacy huge contract player that we may not see as much going forward.

I don't know. Teams often can't help themselves. Boston is going all-in with blimped-out contracts. It's won them a chip, but they'll be in trouble.

The purpose of the CBA was to stop those big tickets (for 'pretty good' players, at least). With Ingram and Klay Thompson it worked. I think before long teams will get back into the awful habit, but we'll see.

Ingram would've gotten that money if he could stay healthy and was still NOLA's best player.
Small markets still have no choice but to max their franchise players, even if they're not worth it.

Imo, 30% max after making just one all-NBA selection for 0-6 year players is way too low of a threshold. Requirements should've been higher.
Max->supermax difference shouldn't count against the cap if the player is still on the team he was drafted by. Would reward teams that actually build the right way.

IDK we have seen repeatedly that any contract is tradeable if the guy has a pulse (eg not Luol Deng racking up DNPs). I think the Knicks are getting Towns with the idea of trying to win a le in the next two years, and then they'll salary dump him when Bridges is up for a new contract. Plus as bad as Towns contract looks right now, the cap having big jumps every year from the new TV & streaming deal will tamp that down sticker shock significantly by 26-27 when NYK would probably be looking to dump him.

Theoretically, he's a perfect fit alongside Brunson and three elite defenders.
Him, Markkanen and Porzingis are the only elite 7ft shooters.

With Randle being on an expiring deal getting someone good, but overpaid was their only option.
Otherwise they would've had to settle for a lesser player.

DiVincenzo was also reportedly unhappy for some reason, idk if Knicks twitter is to be trusted.

Porzingis was just a cherry on top if we talk Celtics being a matchup nightmare for everyone in the East.
On paper KAT looks like a perfect counter, we'll see how it goes.

Their entire starting lineup will be between 27 and 29 this season.
Three year contention window sounds about right for thiis roster.

[baseline bum]

Theoretically, he's a perfect fit alongside Brunson and three elite defenders.
Him, Markkanen and Porzingis are the only elite 7ft shooters.

With Randle being on an expiring deal getting someone good, but overpaid was their only option.
Otherwise they would've had to settle for a lesser player.

DiVincenzo was also reportedly unhappy for some reason, idk if Knicks twitter is to be trusted.

Porzingis was just a cherry on top if we talk Celtics being a matchup nightmare for everyone in the East.
On paper KAT looks like a perfect counter, we'll see how it goes.

Their entire starting lineup will be between 27 and 29 this season.
Three year contention window sounds about right for thiis roster.

Agreed, you're not moving Randle for anyone on a good contract. And agreed that Towns seems like a great fit. Terrible #1 option, but having him as maybe third option behind Brunson and Bridges that team could be pretty nasty. I'm surprised how much Knicks fans seem to hate this deal given how feast or famine Randle has been in his time in NYK. Randle doesn't strike me as someone who'd be useful without getting a ton of looks while Towns can just camp at the three point line and keep the lane open for Brunson and Bridges.

[LeBowen]

Agreed, you're not moving Randle for anyone on a good contract. And agreed that Towns seems like a great fit. Terrible #1 option, but having him as maybe third option behind Brunson and Bridges that team could be pretty nasty. I'm surprised how much Knicks fans seem to hate this deal given how feast or famine Randle has been in his time in NYK. Randle doesn't strike me as someone who'd be useful without getting a ton of looks while Towns can just camp at the three point line and keep the lane open for Brunson and Bridges.

The only thing Brunson/Bridges/Hart/OG/KAT lineup is missing is MDA.
If it was Harden instead of Brunson, would've been his wet dream.

Obviously a hot take right now, but I think Thibs has to make ECF this year or he's gone.
If injuries plague them again, they'll pin it on his coaching style.

[baseline bum]

The only thing Brunson/Bridges/Hart/OG/KAT lineup is missing is MDA.
If it was Harden instead of Brunson, would've been his wet dream.

Obviously a hot take right now, but I think Thibs has to make ECF this year or he's gone.
If injuries plague them again, they'll pin it on his coaching style.

Agreed 100%. I think he's gone if they don't make the Finals. They don't have time to around with this new CBA and its effective hard cap where you strike when the iron is hot and then a couple years later gotta rebuild.

[Leetonidas]

This will make for an entertaining Christmas day game at least. Wonder who Thibs will have try to guard Victor

[scott]

Forgot that name for Randle never crept upstairs and was more and NBA forum thing to scoff him back when Laker fan was hyping that scrub. Randle is a loser.

Oh, gotcha. Yeah I didn't know that was his nickname. I also agree Randle is a loser.

I'm just of the opinion that shedding KAT is addition by subtraction, similar to someone like Harden. But if it's just to subs ute KAT minutes with Randle minutes... lol.

Wonder if NYK is going to run KAT at the 5. If so, Embiid might go for 100.

[scott]

The fact that the majority owners of the Celtics sold right after winning a championship is a pretty damning sign... you'd think after winning a chip, multimillionaires would at least be excited about the possibility of a repeat, but in this case they saw it as the best time to cash out and avoid all of the inevitable financial difficulties and tough decisions that'll have to make in the near future.

Sell high! Those Celtics owners did it right, from a business POV.

[scott]

Agreed, you're not moving Randle for anyone on a good contract. And agreed that Towns seems like a great fit. Terrible #1 option, but having him as maybe third option behind Brunson and Bridges that team could be pretty nasty. I'm surprised how much Knicks fans seem to hate this deal given how feast or famine Randle has been in his time in NYK. Randle doesn't strike me as someone who'd be useful without getting a ton of looks while Towns can just camp at the three point line and keep the lane open for Brunson and Bridges.

I hope they try to fit KAT into a #3 role, because it will be hilarious to watch them implode. No doubt in my mind KAT is going into that team thinking he's the #1 option.

[Pauleta14]

Always interesting to observe players in their last contract years tbh

Randle could end up being a key addition if he's fit when POs come, I don't see Wolves extending him before, if ever.

Not the thread, but same reason I'm intrigued by Tre and Champagnie"s situations, they both need to show the best version of themselves

[kobyz]

I really want the Spurs to push for Coby White, he might be a odd man out in Chicago with the investment they took on Josh Giddy and the longjem at that position, i think with his combination of scoring, shooting and playmaking he's absolutely the type of PG we need around Wemby, Castle, Vassell and Jeremy if he pans out