Flynn in major trouble for speaking to Russia about sanctions

[TSA]

To be fair:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...rge-unverifie/

The guy admits it is unverified, but one would be hard pressed to get sufficient evidence to verify it, unless you get something unlikely happening such as the Russian government releasing the file. Not really saying much there.


A better evaluation of the guy, and I just found out he is an ex-intelligence official:




http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/...stopher-steele

Great article, too long to fully post here.

"There was no safe way he could return to Russia to do the actual digging; the vengeful F.S.B. would be watching him closely"

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/...stopher-steele

[Chucho]

Trump/Russia truthers

"The Dossier"

But that FISA warrant showing the Obama camp did spy on Trump and the Left laughed at Trump's claims, but he's being proven right, and just like the Christian genocide, the Leftist media wont report on it.

LOLosing to Trump on rigged elecrtions and conspiracy theories

[clambake]

obama spying would be in cool.

please be real

[djohn2oo8]

[RandomGuy]

Trump/Russia truthers

"The Dossier"

But that FISA warrant showing the Obama camp did spy on Trump and the Left laughed at Trump's claims, but he's being proven right, and just like the Christian genocide, the Leftist media wont report on it.

LOLosing to Trump on rigged elecrtions and conspiracy theories

What was your methodology for evaluating the dossier?

[RandomGuy]

Are we revisiting goldenshowergate?

Question remains for you as well.

How did you evaluate this claim?

[monosylab1k]

The golden shower story is great comedic fodder, but it has all the credibility of pizzagate.

[RandomGuy]

Trump/Russia truthers

"The Dossier"

But that FISA warrant showing the Obama camp did spy on Trump and the Left laughed at Trump's claims, but he's being proven right, and just like the Christian genocide, the Leftist media wont report on it.

LOLosing to Trump on rigged elecrtions and conspiracy theories

Fallacy: Appeal to Ridicule

Also Known as: Appeal to Mockery, The Horse Laugh.
Description of Appeal to Ridicule

The Appeal to Ridicule is a fallacy in which ridicule or mockery is subs uted for evidence in an "argument." This line of "reasoning" has the following form:

1.X, which is some form of ridicule is presented (typically directed at the claim).
2.Therefore claim C is false.

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because mocking a claim does not show that it is false. This is especially clear in the following example: "1+1=2! That's the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard!"

FWIW.

If you can't show some reasonable rationale for rejecting a given claim, then your rejection of the claim is unwarranted.

Real conspiracy theories, such as "9-11 was an inside job" etc, tend to fall apart when examined closely. Either factually wrong, or just as often the underlying assumptions prove to be untenable or easily falsified. I have argued here over such things for well over a decade. Once you start laying things out, and read through the dossier, it becomes more than a bit alarmingly plausible.

[Spurminator]

Appeal to Ridicule

[Spurminator]

Sorry, had to.

[Chucho]

What was your methodology for evaluating the dossier?

Seriously?? Howabout the fact even hardcore an rump outlets like New Fox have laid off it? Probably the most laughable piece of "evidence" crazy Trump truthers keep holding onto.

Conspiracy Theories

[Chucho]

FWIW.

If you can't show some reasonable rationale for rejecting a given claim, then your rejection of the claim is unwarranted.

Real conspiracy theories, such as "9-11 was an inside job" etc, tend to fall apart when examined closely. Either factually wrong, or just as often the underlying assumptions prove to be untenable or easily falsified. I have argued here over such things for well over a decade. Once you start laying things out, and read through the dossier, it becomes more than a bit alarmingly plausible.

What's your basis for thinking it legitimate? And, I'm sure you're aware, that same logic can be applied to all the Libs in here who make the same. exact. posts. but favoring Lib views and agendas.

This is ST, sweetie, just in case you forgot.

[RandomGuy]

The golden shower story is great comedic fodder, but it has all the credibility of pizzagate.

(shrugs)

Hard to say with any certainty.

It is gross and unusual, but there are people who find such things sexual. I don't know Donald J. Trumps sexual preferences beyond what he has publicly expressed, and neither do you.

Given that, I think it unlikely, but possible. Trump is petty and vindictive, such an activity may well have fallen into a category "I hate Obama so much I would pay to see something related to him defiled", rather than sexuality.

Much more likely is something more conventional, but certainly extra-martial and unflattering.

[RandomGuy]

Seriously?? Howabout the fact even hardcore an rump outlets like New Fox have laid off it? Probably the most laughable piece of "evidence" crazy Trump truthers keep holding onto.

Conspiracy Theories

So you didn't really evaluate the claim.

Did you read the full dossier?

[RandomGuy]

What's your basis for thinking it legitimate? And, I'm sure you're aware, that same logic can be applied to all the Libs in here who make the same. exact. posts. but favoring Lib views and agendas.

This is ST, sweetie, just in case you forgot.

Not all bad things about liberals or democrats are false.

Are all bad things about conservatives or Republicans automatically false?

[Chucho]

Not all bad things about liberals or democrats are false.

Are all bad things about conservatives or Republicans automatically false?

I didn't say that. I said it got dropped by the anti-Trump truther network, New Fox, faster than a stillborn fetus out of Courtney Love's ****.

[Chucho]

We can't say khunt on this board??? We can call a Filipina pedophile rapist a Fillipina pedophile rapist, but we can't use the c word in it's full linguistic integrity?

[TSA]

Question remains for you as well.

How did you evaluate this claim?

For starters were you aware Steele was never in Russia to collect intel and instead paid third parties to gather intel for him?

[Chucho]

For starters were you aware Steele was never in Russia to collect intel and instead paid third parties to gather intel for him?

[DisAsTerBot]

Seriously?? Howabout the fact even hardcore an rump outlets like New Fox have laid off it? Probably the most laughable piece of "evidence" crazy Trump truthers keep holding onto.

Conspiracy Theories

Tell us about sandy hook

[Splits]

Tell us about sandy hook

[RandomGuy]

[QUOTE=Chucho;8984374
This is ST, sweetie, just in case you forgot. [/QUOTE]

It is indeed. And somewhere on the other side of this scrolling text is a real, thinking person. Most of the time it is a lot of stupid back and forth, with myself just as guilty as the next guy, if not more so sometimes.

BUT

Occasionally something level-headed and worth a happens. You have occasionally put a lot of time/thought into a post or two (I have one bookmarked that I keep meaning to get back to, it seems a shame to let your effort go to waste), so I will take a step or to in that direction.

[RandomGuy]

How did you evaluate this claim?

For starters were you aware Steele was never in Russia to collect intel and instead paid third parties to gather intel for him?

Not really an answer to my question. Be happy to answer your question though, after you answer mine, it is easy enough.

I was just wondering how you got to where you were. Evaluation of the claim can go side- by side I guess.

What do you think and why, is always a good thing to go over, and evaluating self-bias is always helpful.

[RandomGuy]

Are all bad things about conservatives or Republicans automatically false?

I didn't say that. I said it got dropped by the anti-Trump truther network, New Fox, faster than a stillborn fetus out of Courtney Love's ****.

I didn't say you did.

I was just trying to get some intellectually honest answers. I am happy to admit that Dems can up, and do things that I disagree with. A good conversation about this has to start with a willingness on both sides to admit that their preferred party and people are not infallible.

If that can't happen, might as well stop. The topic seems important enough to treat seriously.

IF the claim really is that weak, that will out fairly quickly under any serious scrutiny. That is how one blows stupid conspiracy theories out of the water, it really doesn't take long, in my (lengthy) experience.

[TSA]

How did you evaluate this claim?



Not really an answer to my question. Be happy to answer your question though, after you answer mine, it is easy enough.

I was just wondering how you got to where you were. Evaluation of the claim can go side- by side I guess.

What do you think and why, is always a good thing to go over, and evaluating self-bias is always helpful.

Steele paid by Trump opposition to compose dossier
Steele wasn't even Russia to gather intel, paid others (who?) to gather intel for dossier
Same dossier used by previous administration to get FISA (Page spoke with Russian spy in 2013, FBI never accuses Page of wrongdoing)
Little of the dossier has been corroborated except the Page part...and that part means little since the FBI did nothing in 2013

It's just another piece that is unraveling for the previous administration after they were caught spying on a Presidential candidate.

So were you aware Steele was never in Russia gathering intel?