If you don't vaccinate your children, you are a horrible parent. Period

[RandomGuy]

Sounds scientific!

man none of the stuff SA210 posted was actually science. Just reposts of resposts of stuff copied from other anti-vax websites.

I tried to actually hunt down a peer-reviewed paper through all of that garbage and found... bupkiss.

[RandomGuy]

$50 if you can tell me the main function of vitamin D in the body without looking it up.

Healthy bones?

I know rickets is caused by a lack of vitamin D. Just going to make a slightly educated guess before googling.

[RandomGuy]

Beyond its use to prevent osteomalacia or rickets, the evidence for other health effects of vitamin D supplementation in the general population is inconsistent.[5][6] The best evidence of benefit is for bone health.[7] The effect of vitamin D supplementation on mortality is not clear, with one meta-analysis finding a decrease in mortality in elderly people,[8] and another concluding no clear justification exists for recommending vitamin D.[9] Because it found mounting evidence for a benefit to bone health, though it had not found good evidence of other benefits, the Food and Drug Administration of the United States intends to begin requiring manufacturers to declare the amount of Vitamin D on nutrition facts labels, as "nutrients of public health significance".[10]

In the liver, cholecalciferol (vitamin D3) is converted to calcidiol, which is also known as calcifediol (INN), 25-hydroxycholecalciferol (aka 25-hydroxyvitamin D3 — abbreviated 25(OH)D3). Ergocalciferol (vitamin D2) is converted in the liver to 25-hydroxyergocalciferol (aka 25-hydroxyvitamin D2 — abbreviated 25(OH)D2). These two specific vitamin D metabolites are measured in serum to determine a person's vitamin D status.[11][12] Part of the calcidiol is converted by the kidneys to calcitriol, the biologically active form of vitamin D.[13] Calcitriol circulates as a hormone in the blood, regulating the concentration of calcium and phosphate in the bloodstream and promoting the healthy growth and remodeling of bone. Calcitriol also affects neuromuscular and immune function.[14]

[Shastafarian]

Healthy bones?

I know rickets is caused by a lack of vitamin D. Just going to make a slightly educated guess before googling.

Basically yeah though it was a bit of a trick question because Vitamin D has other important roles. But I knew he'd duck it either way. After all, one can take as much vitamin D as they want with no repercussions!*


* - Not true at all.

[SnakeBoy]

Italy approves hotly contested mandatory vaccine program

MILAN — Italy's parliament on Friday gave final approval to making a slate of childhood vaccinations mandatory for school children up to age 16 — a move aimed at countering an anti-vaccine trend that officials have attributed to misinformation.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/health/heal...D=ansmsnnews11

I thought europeans were supposed to be smarter than us

[rmt]

Guess I must be a horrible parent then since one of mine is not fully vaccinated (has not had one since he had an anaphylactic reaction to the second dose of DTAP at age 6). I hope that all of you preaching from the choir will consider that for some kids the risk is just not worth it.

[SnakeBoy]

Guess I must be a horrible parent then since one of mine is not fully vaccinated (has not had one since he had an anaphylactic reaction to the second dose of DTAP at age 6). I hope that all of you preaching from the choir will consider that for some kids the risk is just not worth it.

There's a difference between not vaccinating for medical reasons and not vaccinating just because of ignorant beliefs

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd/should-not-vacc.html

[rmt]

There have been 2 allergists who wanted to slowly (a little at a time waiting in between each dose) give him the remaining vaccines - they were so bent on vaccinating him just so he could go to public school. If I in my ignorance and following the advice of these doctors did that instead of searching for an allergist willing to give him a medical exemption, would that make me a horrible parent? Note that he took the first dose just fine, but the second dose - what a nightmare.

[spurraider21]

if endangering your child and other children makes you a horrible parent, then yes

[RandomGuy]

I thought europeans were supposed to be smarter than us

They made it 100% mandatory.

That is smarter.

[RandomGuy]

Guess I must be a horrible parent then since one of mine is not fully vaccinated (has not had one since he had an anaphylactic reaction to the second dose of DTAP at age 6). I hope that all of you preaching from the choir will consider that for some kids the risk is just not worth it.

It is worth it. If you have your pediatrician telling you that you should never get any vaccination because they will all produce such a reaction, then that is sound medical advice.

If you had one bad experience, and think all vaccines are identical, then you should seek some professional pediatric advice before deciding to not vaccinate at all.

From a cost/benefit perspective, some of the deseases you get vaccinated for are pretty life threatening for kids.

I would hate to have to weigh sucha decision if my kid really was that allergic to all vaccines. "die of horrible disease" or "die of anaphalaxis"

[RandomGuy]

There's a difference between not vaccinating for medical reasons and not vaccinating just because of ignorant beliefs

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd/should-not-vacc.html

YUP.

[rmt]

It is worth it. If you have your pediatrician telling you that you should never get any vaccination because they will all produce such a reaction, then that is sound medical advice.

If you had one bad experience, and think all vaccines are identical, then you should seek some professional pediatric advice before deciding to not vaccinate at all.

From a cost/benefit perspective, some of the deseases you get vaccinated for are pretty life threatening for kids.

I would hate to have to weigh sucha decision if my kid really was that allergic to all vaccines. "die of horrible disease" or "die of anaphalaxis"

Ds has been to 3 different pediatric allergists about the vaccines. The first 2 wanted to slowly put the vaccines in (a little at a time spread over several hours). One was from our Miami Children's Hospital - another from a large system of allergists. I didn't accept their solution and found a pediatric allergist who agreed with me that he could be allergic to ANY of the substances COMMON to both (such as the medium they use to carry the vaccine) and was willing to give him a medical exemption. My brothers and I had chicken pox and measles and were fine - there were no vaccines for them back then. The chance of him dying from these diseases is much smaller than him dying from anaphylaxis. And do you know what the last specialist said, "The reason why we vaccinate is to protect kids like my son who can't be vaccinated" - not because they're all gonna "die of horrible disease" Besides they're not fool-proof - I know personally of one girl who got all her vaccines and still got chicken-pox.

[monosylab1k]

Ds has been to 3 different pediatric allergists about the vaccines. The first 2 wanted to slowly put the vaccines in (a little at a time spread over several hours). One was from our Miami Children's Hospital - another from a large system of allergists. I didn't accept their solution and found a pediatric allergist who agreed with me that he could be allergic to ANY of the substances COMMON to both (such as the medium they use to carry the vaccine) and was willing to give him a medical exemption. My brothers and I had chicken pox and measles and were fine - there were no vaccines for them back then. The chance of him dying from these diseases is much smaller than him dying from anaphylaxis. And do you know what the last specialist said, "The reason why we vaccinate is to protect kids like my son who can't be vaccinated" - not because they're all gonna "die of horrible disease" Besides they're not fool-proof - I know personally of one girl who got all her vaccines and still got chicken-pox.

You're an anti-vaxxer too? What a ing shock

[Pavlov]

Ds has been to 3 different pediatric allergists about the vaccines. The first 2 wanted to slowly put the vaccines in (a little at a time spread over several hours). One was from our Miami Children's Hospital - another from a large system of allergists. I didn't accept their solution and found a pediatric allergist who agreed with me that he could be allergic to ANY of the substances COMMON to both (such as the medium they use to carry the vaccine) and was willing to give him a medical exemption. My brothers and I had chicken pox and measles and were fine - there were no vaccines for them back then. The chance of him dying from these diseases is much smaller than him dying from anaphylaxis. And do you know what the last specialist said, "The reason why we vaccinate is to protect kids like my son who can't be vaccinated" - not because they're all gonna "die of horrible disease" Besides they're not fool-proof - I know personally of one girl who got all her vaccines and still got chicken-pox.

So you didn't have the child allergist, you know, check your child for allergies?

[rmt]

So you didn't have the child allergist, you know, check your child for allergies?

He is checked every couple of years. What is your point? They don't check for vaccines - mostly common allergens - both food and environmental.

[SnakeBoy]

So you didn't have the child allergist, you know, check your child for allergies?

Damn you are stupid

[RandomGuy]

Ds has been to 3 different pediatric allergists about the vaccines. The first 2 wanted to slowly put the vaccines in (a little at a time spread over several hours). One was from our Miami Children's Hospital - another from a large system of allergists. I didn't accept their solution and found a pediatric allergist who agreed with me that he could be allergic to ANY of the substances COMMON to both (such as the medium they use to carry the vaccine) and was willing to give him a medical exemption. My brothers and I had chicken pox and measles and were fine - there were no vaccines for them back then. The chance of him dying from these diseases is much smaller than him dying from anaphylaxis. And do you know what the last specialist said, "The reason why we vaccinate is to protect kids like my son who can't be vaccinated" - not because they're all gonna "die of horrible disease" Besides they're not fool-proof - I know personally of one girl who got all her vaccines and still got chicken-pox.

Sooo you opinion shopped until you got the result you wanted, and 66% of the doctors chose an option you didn't like.

Does that sum it up?

[RandomGuy]

Ds has been to 3 different pediatric allergists about the vaccines. The first 2 wanted to slowly put the vaccines in (a little at a time spread over several hours). One was from our Miami Children's Hospital - another from a large system of allergists. I didn't accept their solution and found a pediatric allergist who agreed with me that he could be allergic to ANY of the substances COMMON to both (such as the medium they use to carry the vaccine) and was willing to give him a medical exemption. My brothers and I had chicken pox and measles and were fine - there were no vaccines for them back then. The chance of him dying from these diseases is much smaller than him dying from anaphylaxis. And do you know what the last specialist said, "The reason why we vaccinate is to protect kids like my son who can't be vaccinated" - not because they're all gonna "die of horrible disease" Besides they're not fool-proof - I know personally of one girl who got all her vaccines and still got chicken-pox.

So two specialists said it was possible that your child could be vaccinated, with a modest modification of the regimen.

Despite what conservatives and libertarians seem to think, ethical choices do not happen in a vacuum. Your choices affect others.

Your choice to have an unvaccinated child running around means a couple of things ethically:

Your child is at risk of dying from something.
Your child is at risk of spreading something to someone else, who could end up dying.

You have made the choice with being comfortable with balancing the risk between allergic reaction and vaccinating.

Are you comfortable with possibly causing someone else's death?

[Pavlov]

He is checked every couple of years. What is your point? They don't check for vaccines - mostly common allergens - both food and environmental.

but just speculate on others?

[rmt]

So two specialists said it was possible that your child could be vaccinated, with a modest modification of the regimen.

Despite what conservatives and libertarians seem to think, ethical choices do not happen in a vacuum. Your choices affect others.

Your choice to have an unvaccinated child running around means a couple of things ethically:

Your child is at risk of dying from something.
Your child is at risk of spreading something to someone else, who could end up dying.

You have made the choice with being comfortable with balancing the risk between allergic reaction and vaccinating.

Are you comfortable with possibly causing someone else's death?

RG, I think that you should reserve judgement until you have a child who has had a vaccine and goes into an anaphylactic reaction right in front of you - gasping for breath, breaking out in hives all over, curled up in a ball while the pediatrician frantically searches for needle and epinephrine. I hope you realize that your child could sit beside another child (from a foreign country) with any number of diseases in say DisneyWorld and be exposed to said disease compared to my child in a classroom in which all the other kids are supposed to be vaccinated. I say supposed to be vaccinated because guess what I learned at work last week - they let homeless and migrant kids (e.g. from Haiti when they had that earthquake) in without being vaccinated (and they can continue to be unvaccinated their entire tenure [there's no checking]) - of course, better they're in school than on the streets - regardless of what disease they could possibly pass on to the other students. So who knows who your kid is sitting next to.

My main concern is for my child - and his possibility of dying from anaphylaxis is greater than from chickenpox or measles.

[rmt]

but just speculate on others?

speculate on other what? I try to go as natural as possible with him - no sunscreen, no toothpaste (just electric toothbrush), no lotion/moisturizer (coconut oil instead). Anything he tries is applied to a small patch of skin first, wait, then a bit to the tongue, wait, then a bigger portion, wait, etc. with epipen, benadryl and prednisolone nearby.

[Pavlov]

speculate on other what?

You just guessed about the allergy to components of vaccines.

[rmt]

Any component of the vaccine he had the reaction to is suspect (he could be allergic to). Therefore if any of those components are in the chickenpox or MMR vaccine (including the carrier), then those are also suspect. The pediatric allergist compared the ingredients of the DTap vaccine to those of the chickenpox and MMR.

[Pavlov]

Any component of the vaccine he had the reaction to is suspect (he could be allergic to). Therefore if any of those components are in the chickenpox or MMR vaccine (including the carrier), then those are also suspect. The pediatric allergist compared the ingredients of the DTap vaccine to those of the chickenpox and MMR.

You repeat yourself and myself.