Trouble in Crawford: "Why did my son die?"

[jochhejaam]

Originally posted by nbadan : Just because Michael Moore posts Cindy's letters on his site, all of the sudden a mother who only wants answers to why her son had to die, is 'in bed' with MM? I suppose since Reuters News Service posts the same letters then Reuters is also in bed with Sheehan and MM?

There's a big difference in those that make and those that report the news Dan. Like Moore is politically neutral.

[hussker]

uh..yeah, just as you have to this point only spouted your opinion. I'm sorry, but can you show me where your data is? Here's a fun little exercise, boys and girls, find the data in the following..

"No satisfaction of an Internet debate. There is no debate. How many people are beating down the borders to get into some of those other countries? It is easy to say that life in another country is just as good when we know that we are only temporary residents and we get to come back. That is my only point. We are fortunate to have choices that other countries' residents do not have."

You don't know much about many other countries if you think we are the only ones with boat loads of immigrants wanting in. I'm not going to invest a lot of time researching world migration stats, (especially since you have thus far provided zero real data) but I'll plug in some quick numbers I got off of the CIA world factbook website.

Net Migration
U.S - 3.31 per 1,000 (pop)
Canada - 5.9
Australia - 3.91
U.K.- 3.91

Also, google Pew Global At udes. This is a recent poll which measured at udes in 16 different countries. One of the questions asked respondents where they would most like to immigrate. I think the U.S. came in 4th or 5th. After Australia, Canada, and Britain.

I love my country, but I am not so narrow-minded as to think it is the only great place to live and that everyone in the world wants to come here.

Those are for "LEGAL" immigrants and those wanting asylum. Bet you cannot get a true number for those illegally getting in and wanting asylum! My point is this...America is still the land of opportunity. It is still the land of freedom. It is still the land of "NO CEILINGS FOR SUCCESS IF YOU ARE DRIVEN". Point of order here. My wife is Japanese, still a Japanese Citizen and proud of her heritage. She is educated beyond what the majority of Americans are and most Japanese WOMEN. She is the only PERSON in her family who 1) Speaks English 2) Lives in the US 3) Has a PhD.
You know why she wants to stay here but retain her Japanese citizenship? Simple: The United States and Japan make up roughly 13% of the World's Population, yet together, have 88% of the WORLD's WEALTH. That wealth is defined well beyond the spectrum of GNP. It deals with GNP and what is in the distribution lines for consumption of goods. She is proud (very proud) to be Japanese. She is fortunate to have th opportunity to come to a country where she can maximize her potential.
In Japan, the Woman has a ceiling for success, regardless of credentials/schooling, etc...
In the United States, that ceiling is unlimited. It is, however, at a cost. What is the cost? Taxes. Legislation. Protection. Legal course for living here if not a citizen. More taxes.

The value gained? FREEDOM. The same FREEDOM that Casey Sheehan enlisted in the USMC for to protect for you, your family, and those who beat down the doors to come here. The same freedom he signed up to protect that allows us to think, speak and act the way we do with protection. The same freedom that most who are on Ms Sheehan's bandwagon have never fought for. The same freedom that gives you the right to either love or loathe the Executive/Legislative/Judicial branches we have here in the United States.

Do other countries have that same freedom? I would say NO. I have been there to those countries. I have seen the results of what some of our "allies" do in the face of protest. We are fortunate to have that right to protest and support as we see fit. People fight and die for that. Not just those who are from here...but those who strive, whether legally or illegally, to get here. Check those numbers dear. That is reality...not something out of a database. Of course, our borders are easier to get into, so I will give you that, but there are many who want to, and do succeed at getting in. Much higher than your sterile numbers.

As far as POLLS go...never trust them. If we did, then Bush would have never been president, let alone a two-termer.

Hugz,
hussker

[hussker]

And oh, by the way, Global at udes are SUBJECTIVE. No objectivity in that whatsoever. Non-data.

[hussker]

and finally, as I said before, you have choices as an American. Take that statement for what it is worth. I am now going back to the Cowboys-Texans game...something unavailable in many of the aforementioned countries...

[hussker]

except on AFN, provided by your tax dollars

[hussker]

for YOUR troops fighting so you can have the freedom of this web board

[hussker]

God Bless the USA

[hussker]

And the best 5$ ticket in sports...a Friday Night Texas HS Football Game

[hussker]

AFN = American Forces Network

[hussker]

Saw it everyday when I was in Afghanistan fighting for the right for you to post on this. You can thank me anytime...by going to you recruiter and enlisting/getting a commission in the armed services so you can fight for something besides a mealy mouthed bunch of hypocrites...

[Jelly]

Those are for "LEGAL" immigrants and those wanting asylum. Bet you cannot get a true number for those illegally getting in and wanting asylum!

As far as POLLS go...never trust them. If we did, then Bush would have never been president, let alone a two-termer.

Hugz,
hussker

Bet you I can! (at least some of those numbers) You can find this in the OECD report (and on the BBC website)

top nations for asylum seekers

1. France (14,049 per year)
2. U.S.A. (9,660)
3. Germany (8,519)
4. Austria (6,621)
5. Canada (5,414)
6. Sweden (5,160)

Germany was ahead of the United States for 18 years (it wasthe #1 nation for that time. We were 3rd, behind France), and only fell behind in 2003.

As far as polls go, they are by far the best measure of public opinion, especially when done scientifically, extensively, across a broad spectrum, and by a reputable organization like Pew. I believe 55,000 people participated in the poll I mentioned.

kisses,
Jelly

btw-
"Bet you cannot get a true number for those illegally getting in and wanting asylum! "

why are you asking me to do all the work?

[hussker]

55,000....so many when you consider the Earth's population. Heck, that is less than College Station population when the Students are gone for the summer! Validity and Reliability are crucial in data compilation. Did you check the CI of your data sources?

[hussker]

The point is, there is no work to do. The only work is deciding if you are on board and supportive of the country you live in or if you are not...Your choice...we have choices and freedom of choice as AMERICANS

[hussker]

I see two others looking on but not posting! Come on, join in! COWBOYS 7 TEXANS 0

[boutons]

LOL... Boutons calls out "shrub loving repugs" whose kids aren't enlisting, and then when he finds one who is, it's Nature weeding out stupid people.

I bet you wouldn't send that same sentiment to an actual soldier's family, would you, you ing coward?

Do the anti-war crowd a favor and keep your opinions to yourself.

I'm referring to the "brave" father, not his dead son, who says he will go fight when he knows he can't go.

[Jelly]

for YOUR troops fighting so you can have the freedom of this web board

hussker,
my father was a career soldier... 35 freakin' years and served two tours in Vietnam. I also have a sister who may end up in Iraq before the years out. Do not dare attempt to lecture me on showing appreciation for our troops.

[Jelly]

Saw it everyday when I was in Afghanistan fighting for the right for you to post on this. You can thank me anytime...by going to you recruiter and enlisting/getting a commission in the armed services so you can fight for something besides a mealy mouthed bunch of hypocrites...

I know all about AFN. I saw it practically everyday while growing up. And I think I'll pass up on the opportunity to thank you and instead will thank my Dad. He is far less condescending and much more polite and has (likely) clocked far more years serving his country with far less arrogance (definitely)

[Clandestino]

when i left europe in 02, afn had 3 channels! actually 4, but it was one of the previous 3 but 12 hrs different! i remember how excited everyone was when it went from 1 channel to 3! hahaha

[Jelly]

And oh, by the way, Global at udes are SUBJECTIVE. No objectivity in that whatsoever. Non-data.

No kidding?? Opinion surveys are subjective? Who'd of thunk it?

[Jelly]

when i left europe in 02, afn had 3 channels! actually 4, but it was one of the previous 3 but 12 hrs different! i remember how excited everyone was when it went from 1 channel to 3! hahaha

well, you were lucky. AFN for us meant all of one channel and back in the day, it didn't even come on until like noon or something. And the biggest hit show was General Hospital which came on at 4pm and was 6 months behind the storyline in the states. Still, everyone was addicted to it.

[Clandestino]

yeah, it was one for several years, then it turned into the 3... dancing in the streets!

[Nbadan]

Saw it everyday when I was in Afghanistan fighting for the right for you to post on this. You can thank me anytime...by going to you recruiter and enlisting/getting a commission in the armed services so you can fight for something besides a mealy mouthed bunch of hypocrites...

Hus, first of all, welcome to the board and back to the US. However, your not the first Vet, nor the only Vet to post on this board. So don't expect any special treatment based solely on your previous military status. Those who you should be pe ioning to go enlist are the 51% of Americans who voted for W on Nov 2nd 2004. Why should others, who other-wise want to proudly serve their nation, have to fight a war which they don't believe is justified?

On the one hand, your wanting us to thank you for fighting for our right to post our opinions in this forum, and in the other you want to take away that right from Cindy Sheehan. So which is it gonna be?

[Nbadan]

[Nbadan]

Listeners of the Glenn Beck show can be proud of the complete lack of respect that they showed Cindy Sheehan and other grieving war-moms in Crawford

[Nbadan]

[Dos]

looks like everyone was melting in those pictures... thank God for Texas heat waves..