Reply With Quote
ES, I'm sure you will find the following read very fascinating.
What Happens after death
Darn I can't get the hyperlinking feature working but here is the address...
h t t p://www.ucg.org/booklets/AD/knowingjesuschrist.htm
(close the http)
I understand that concept well and I believe in it. I guess what I'm trying to get at is this. According to the RCC, there are certain requirements that must be fulfilled for an individual to get to heaven, correct? What are those requirements? What are Sacrements and where do they fall in with these requirements? What happens if a person does not fulfill those requirements? What happens to a Catholic person who is otherwise a "good Christian" but dies on a bad day before they have confessed? Travis mentioned earlier that this person would go through purgatory before going to heaven, am I understanding this correctly?
ES, I'm sure you will find the following read very fascinating.
What Happens after death
Darn I can't get the hyperlinking feature working but here is the address...
h t t p://www.ucg.org/booklets/AD/knowingjesuschrist.htm
(close the http)
Last edited by Phenomanul; 10-27-2006 at 11:45 AM.
Why do Catholics change the name and do the same?
The dissolution of marriages is entirely too common; especially amongst Protestants; here, I believe, the Catholic Church has done a better job of encouraging scriptural adherence.
However, the Catholic Chruch's position is not without its faults: From personal experience my grandparent (fathers side) had their marriage annulled after 20 years; effectively making bas s of my father and his sister in the eyes of the Catholic Church. Dad always resented my grandparents for that. Both remarried, btw.
YOU are the Fundamentalists- that is why I asked you.
If everything is specifically in the Bible- then why is it allowed? To try to turn it around does not answer my question.
Your claim (not mine) is that EVERYTHING you do is directly in the Bible. How do you justify your church's teaching on this issue. Please, give me your scriptural references for it.
First, I never claimed to be a Fundamentalist.
Next regarding divorce:
They cite the "exception" clause "marital unfaithfulness" in Mathew; although that should only allow the innocent party to remarry, IMO; although, obviously, divorcees are granted for many more reasons than that - but those divorces are granted by the state; Protestant Churches don't grant "divorce"; although, obviously again, they do participate in the remarriage of divorcees.
As I've already stated, I feel the Catholic Church does a better job emphasising marriage as a holy, unbreakable union - and divorce rates suggest that is the case.
I have not studied the reason that Protestant Churches will openly remarry divorcees, but I'm betting it falls under the umbrella of "thou shalt not judge".
an annulment is not easy to get, it's definitely not the same as getting a divorce. even a decree of annulment does not officially dissolve the vows, no earthly power can do that.
http://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/annulment.htm
Not THAT tough.
My grandparents got one after twenty years of marriage, two children, a business they ran together and a house they owned. Catholic Church did much more than "grant" a divorce; The Catholic Church decreed that THAT marriage never existed in the first place. Again, made bas s of my dad and aunt.
Thou shalt not judge? then that would allow anything.
Thanks for the link; educational.
I now need to call my Mom (dad is no longer with us); My grandfather got remarried in a Catholic Church - My Grandmother didn't - by reading that link, makes me wonder if maybe she couldn't get remarried in a Catholic Church.
Interesting link Phenomanul, does that site have an explanation on the validity of the "Trinity"?
Maby I'm missing it. Thanks.
Why did they get married in the first place? Their state at the time they took their vows is what matters- for example, if someone was forced into it.
No it wouldn't.
The meaning of my post is that if two professed Christians want to marry, but had been married previously, it is not that church's place to say whether or not those previous marriages ended in accordance with Scripture; that is between those individuals, there former spouse(s) and god. It doesn't mean that the new Union should not be made in the house of the lord and with witnesses.
Again, I repeat, I am making this up as I go hear, literally - I don't KNOW if this is why Protestant churches remarry divorcees, I'm just making an educated guess.
It was during WWII, oh , please don't tell me Po-Po used the "I may not come back" line and knocked her up!!!
...now I have to think, how old is dad? when were they "married"?
It's not? The church has no right to know about the state of the people they are marrying? Don't you require any pre-marriage counseling or meetings with the minister? Doesn't he ask about your divorce?
And my questions are not just for you. I am waiting for those who seem suddenly silent.
I married in a Catholic Church,and my oldest child is only twelve; I don't know about pre-marriage counseling, or other stipulations to getting married in a Protestant one - I'm sure they vary.
I don't regard the UCGIA as legitimately Christian, primarily because it rejects the Trinity, but also because it requires adherence to the ceremonial practices of the Old Covenant, and because of its heretical and racist British-Israelism.
So therefore I cannot find anything they say fascinating.
Interesting link Phenomanul, does that site have an explanation on the validity of the "Trinity"?
Maby I'm missing it. Thanks.
That was captured earlier in the thread.
I don't mind reading interdenominational material... regarding the topic we were discussing however, they do make some interesting points I had never considered. As far as being Doctrinally wrong or right I would have to do further study, and I would inherently agree with your assessment. Nevertheless, some of the perspectives on the afterlife are a little insightful -- at least from an apologetics standpoint.
In the end though -- you're right -- the word 'fascinating' was made in poor choice.
Last edited by Phenomanul; 10-27-2006 at 01:19 PM.
If you're referring to me I've got nothing to hide. My father in particular does not marry folks if they've not received proper counseling. The classes he gives take 6 weeks to administer.
Anyhow the exception as 101A alluded to earlier is found in the same chapter of Matthew that I was quoting from on the subject of children.
Matthew 19:8-9 -- Jesus replied, "Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning. I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery.
The faithful party then would not be considered as being in sin were they to marry again.
You may have to pardon me for being a little closed-minded.
I have a line between calling a group "interdenominational" and calling them a "cult."
For general (but not infallible) reference, I use the Apostles', Nicene, and Athanasian creeds as a guideline. I believe those draw a useful boundary between which beliefs are core to the faith and which are disputable.
If a group does not uphold those creeds, while I might want to learn what they believe in order to be on guard, I will not partake of any of their teachings for edification, insofar as their basic belief system is utterly infused with gross error. It would be like eating meat I know is tainted with E. coli. It might seem like it tastes OK at first, but I'll be sick as a dog later.
I have the gist of what Jehovah's Witnesses believe, but I'm not going to read stuff from the Watchtower for insight in my daily living.
I believe this was already pointed out but Fundamentalists != Protestants.
Anywho... Most Protestant churches I know of require pre-marital counseling and mentorship if you desire to be married by the church. If you get divorced and remarried outside of the church, the church is certainly not going to reject you and your spouse for it. We are all sinners in one way or another. I can't speak to any knowledge about those that are divorced and remarried within the church, unfortunately. I know of one case, that of our worship minister, and it was clearly a case of unfaithfulness on his ex-wife's part.
The Bible doesn't explicitly address email fraud or other modern era issues. Humanity's inherent nature however is explicitly described in the Bible insomuch as it declares that basic corruptions tend to manifest themselves repeatedly no matter the 'era'. Greed, envy, lure of power, deceit, unfaithfulness, etc...
With regards to questions about what the 'future' holds in store... you're right, we don't know everything. But that doesn't mean we need to read things in scripture that aren't there. We can pray and seek understanding from above; maybe GOD will further reveal His mysteries to us.
ES mentioned Abraham's paradise as a basis for the RCC's 'limbo' teaching, but that place is implicitly regarded as being in existence before Christ's resurrection; not after Christ became a bridge for humanity.
H- you NEVER answered my question. Will your father marry a divorced person- a simple yes or no. Is it unlawful to get remarried in your church?
Are you claiming that he only remarries people who got cheated on? What if the spouse leaves without cheating?
I am amazed that people in this thread claim to know NO ONE who is divorced and got re-married in a Protestant Church. I am Catholic and I know tons of them. I even know divorced Catholics who re-married Protestants in Protestant churches. Thise churches had no problem with it. Why?
Last edited by ploto; 10-27-2006 at 02:03 PM.
It does not explicitly say that. It merely says the opposite is sinful.
I am also sure- Biblical scholar that you are- that you know that phrase (which by the way is NOT in Mark and Luke) is not translated directly that way and its meaning has been up to interpretation as to what acts it is exactly referring to.
Last edited by ploto; 10-27-2006 at 02:22 PM.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
