Let’s Talk About Defense

[BackHome]

I can understand this season not wanting to make huge changes until we see how the players play together, but I don't understand after they drafted a generational talent, they didn't immediately upgrade the coaching staff, and get at least one new highly qualified proven assistant coach.

I think Pop is taking another loosing season for the team as we really need another high draft pick to get more talent as it's not so easy to acquire a stud player through free agency. Since Pop knows he is leaving soon most good assistants don't want to be in a situation where it's a one year deal as most new coaches bring in there own people. That to me is the biggest question is who is going to replace Pop, because it's damn sure not anyone currently on this coaching staff.

[objective]

Not only is Collins getting destroyed at the rim, he's also a rebounder.

The whole point of playing 'big' with 2 7-footers should be rim protection and rebounding and the supposed bonus of 3 point shooting from Collins. Well the Spurs don't rebound, protect the rim without Wemby and Collins bricks crap 4/5 games.

Collins TRB% this year is 12.3%. Those are pretty bad considering that Wemby is floating around the perimeter and leaking out a lot. His block% is only 2.6%

People knock Wemby for his rebounding but he's delivering TRB of 16.9%, best among any big minute players.

Historically Collins is a new low in rebounding among Spurs centers, and that's considering Duncan as a center when he was the real center.

Poeltl rebounded better as a spur. Collins was better the other years. Aldridge better, Pau was better. Eubanks was better. Gay rebounded every year better except his final year. Splitter rebounded better. , JOFFREY rebounded better than Collins.

If Collins would throw his body around and pick up some fouls and make players earn it at the line instead of easy layups and dunks that would help. Get his mind on grinding for rebounds instead of inventing new ways to turn the ball over.

[BackHome]

I think that is why they only signed him to a two year contract

[Vince Carter's ankle]

-we don't box out and thus give up a ton of offensive rebounds

-for whatever reason Zach Collins plays drop coverage

-Collins can not defend the rim, players can get to the rim and score over him at will

-Tre Jones, McDermott and Keldon can contest all they want, their man still hits a 3 in their face

-Branham is a turnstile in the pick & roll

-we give up a ton of open corner 3s which is exactly the shot you want to eliminate

-Sochan can't guard small guards

-we get killed in pick & rolls and have to overhelp leading to wide open 3s

- our offense is trash leading to our defense not being set on a lot of posessions

I said in preseason that I was concerned about 3-point and pick & roll defense. It looks even worse now. Also teams are not getting hot, our defense is just trash. Players are constantly having career shooting nights against us (Barnes, OG) and teams break their franchise records against us (Pacers).

With that being said we've seen some good sequences on defense against the Suns and Raptors, so I think there's still room to play better D, although my confidence in that is diminshing every game. In the first half against Toronto we played some of the best transition defense that I've seen in years. They couldn't get any fast break buckets. I think this team really needs to find a more intelligent way of collapsing on drivers, we're very good when it comes to getting deflections with active hands and running the fast break. This team is missing a rim protector and point of attack defender.

One of the things to improve pick & roll D and rim protection is Wemby playing Center, but the Spurs obviously don't want him to play there.

you should go to an ophthalmologist

[RC_Drunkford]

you should go to an ophthalmologist

you should go get a job. I speak 4 different languages, what about you?

[Vince Carter's ankle]

you should go get a job. I speak 4 different languages, what about you?

how does this relate to your vision problems?
i speak russian, georgian, french, italian and english
what's next?

[Chomag]

Serious question to those defending Pop's coaching performance and saying that it's not the coaches fault. So when can you start putting the blame on the coaching staff, I'm honestly very curious?

[Big Empty]

Collins is useless i dont know what the coaching staff saw in the offseason that made them extend Collins. He gets manhandled even by regular average centers. We need a Center that can rebound and play defense, and we need a point guard that can stretch the floor to open things up for Wemby. I know im beating a dead horse but Jones should start at point and Collins or Sochan should come off the bench.

[RC_Drunkford]

how does this relate to your vision problems?
i speak russian, georgian, french, italian and english
what's next?

vaffanculo

[rjv]

Collins is useless i dont know what the coaching staff saw in the offseason that made them extend Collins. He gets manhandled even by regular average centers. We need a Center that can rebound and play defense, and we need a point guard that can stretch the floor to open things up for Wemby. I know im beating a dead horse but Jones should start at point and Collins or Sochan should come off the bench.

who would collins come off the bench for? it's not as if the spurs have a lot of options at center.

[NASpurs]

Collins is useless i dont know what the coaching staff saw in the offseason that made them extend Collins. He gets manhandled even by regular average centers. We need a Center that can rebound and play defense, and we need a point guard that can stretch the floor to open things up for Wemby. I know im beating a dead horse but Jones should start at point and Collins or Sochan should come off the bench.

White guy who plays C who stretches the floor

[poopbox]

Where to even start.

1. Dumb lineups, rotations, and player position. We play 3 of our 4 bigs in the starting lineup. Our 4th big, Bassey, is probably a 3rd stringer anywhere else, if that. When one of our bigs comes out, we replace them with either McDermott or Osman, guys who should be playing the 3 are now playing the 4 with an undersized maybe not even a rotational nba player playing the 5. We are getting killed in those bassey + mcdermott or osman at the 4 minutes.

2. Bad defenders in general. Keldon is awful and always has been. Mcdermott, same. Collins...same. Branham is a turnstile. Sochan is a good defender but not good enough to cover when he is on the floor with bad defenders. Devin is a good defender but not good enough to cover when he is on the floor with bad defenders. Victor can cover for damn near the whole team but soon as he goes to the bench whatever points they didn't get with him on the floor they get with him off it. Keldon, Mcdermott, and Collins are the primary people sinking the defense and they all have the same deficiencies on that end. Low IQ when it comes to defense, slow to non existent lateral movement , inability to challenge any shot cause they are not athletic and can't jump very high, terrible rebounders which causes offensive rebounds and the defense to be scrambled way to often.

3. And probably the most important, Pop doesn't have a clue how to coach nba defense it todays nba. Like, can anyone tell what the actual plan is that the players are supposed to execute on defense? I can't. Every time a player goes to the rim 3 guys follow him. Whenever a team runs a pick and roll two guys go with the roller or two guys stay with the ballhandler. We dont deny ANYTHING. Screens, pindowns, backdoor cuts, we do not make any attempt to take away ANY offense playcall or offensive tendency of the other team. Like when Kawhi was here and we played the wolves, he would be around the left block alot, cause that is where Kat really wanted the ball. By putting Kawhi in that area alot it just flat out deterred kat from even trying to post up around there since he was so scared Kawhi would come rip the ball from him, and that took a large chunk of the wolves offense away. We don't do anything like that right now, and I think we don't because Pop just generally has no clue how to coach defense now. This team hasn't had a good defensive season since Kawhi left and it gets worse every year. I don't think we will ever be an even average defensive team going forward as long as Pop is the coach as he seems to not have a clue about defense, or have a clue about rotations either. Playing 3 of your 4 bigs in one lineup is beyond dumb and should be a fireable offense when your 4th big might not even be a real nba rotational player.

This is the price you pay when you let your 70 year old coach with 5 rings continue to hang around and coach games like he doesn't give a about winning...because he doesn't give a about winning.

[Vince Carter's ankle]

vaffanculo

ne tremble pas, chérie

[The Truth #6]

I still come back to what the theme is for this year: is it actually improve our defense, is it that the young guys gel together, or is it let Victor do whatever he wants?

Obviously nobody wants Victor to get his feelings hurt, but I would prefer to focus on defense and if the younger players can't keep up, or if the s***** older defenders can't adapt, then so be it. But play our better defenders. At least as an experiment. It would be frustrating as well in different ways, but if they were actually to make defense of priority, I could at least understand it. I'm also curious if Sidy will get a chance to play. I know he's so limited offensively it would be ugly, but if he could at least be part of a team that helps stop these 40-point hemorrhages, honestly, I would see that as an improvement.

[rjv]

I still come back to what the theme is for this year: is it actually improve our defense, is it that the young guys gel together, or is it let Victor do whatever he wants?

Obviously nobody wants Victor to get his feelings hurt, but I would prefer to focus on defense and if the younger players can't keep up, or if the s***** older defenders can't adapt, then so be it. But play our better defenders. At least as an experiment. It would be frustrating as well in different ways, but if they were actually to make defense of priority, I could at least understand it. I'm also curious if Sidy will get a chance to play. I know he's so limited offensively it would be ugly, but if he could at least be part of a team that helps stop these 40-point hemorrhages, honestly, I would see that as an improvement.

sidy should see his first action with the Austin affiliate starting tomorrow night.

[The Truth #6]

Sure, the obvious retort is that our best defenders are still crappy at defense, but whatever, just spitballing... and I would like to see Pop emphasize it. (Responding to my own post)

[RC_Drunkford]

No Messina, no Udoka = no defense

[SouthernFryd]

Defense, Blocking out, entry passes, handling pressure defense, shot selection, Guarding the 3 point line.

None of this has to do with talent. Any NBA level player can do all these...and do them well. It's not about talent.

These things the coaching staff are responsible for implementing. And if the team is not doing these things...the fault lies there. And if players are not willing to do these things, it's up to the coaching staff to rectify it.

The Spurs are being coached terribly right now...or not being coached at all. Which, may be a strategy in and of itself. To possible get another good draft pick? To let young players learn the NBA game on the job? Something else?

Either way, it's basically a screw you move to the fans. With the long-term goal of being loved again if it works? IF there even is a long term goal/strategy in all of this. Spurs fans... , any NBA fans, can be fickle that way. I'm guilty of that myself.

Except when it comes to Pop.

, It could just as easily be they just don't really care. There are wars all over the world POP needs to pay attention to and comment on.

[spurraider21]

[spurraider21]

every time an opposing ball-handler is in the paint, we act like we are playing against prime wilt chamberlain in a league without a 3 point shot. here are some stills just from the clips from that tweet


did keldon really have to leave randle here? are wemby and collins not enough to deter a brunson shot?



apparently donte needs 5 guys to stop him.



why are all 5 collapsing on a guy behind the rim? what are keldon and branham accomplishing here?


on a play like this where he gets beat and a rotation happens, Tre has to be sprinting to get to the open shooters, and vassell needs to be positioning himself between the two shooters so he can respond to whichever one catches the ball and force an extra pass, theoretically buying time for somebody else (preferably tre) to rotate to the second player. instead, vassell half heartedly collapses into the paint?


its not Tre's fault they overhelped here, but if he sees that, he has to position himself in between the two shooters, not just stay glued to one and give the other one a wide open catch and shoot


just lol. so much overhelping (the eventual shooter is off-screen here, near the top of the arc)

[spurraider21]

what is sochan doing in this one? sags off porter for absolutely no reason. is he that worried about an entry pass to poeltl?

[TDomination]

man that video and screen shots are cringe worthy.
awful, just awful defense.

pitiful really

[spurraider21]

that doesnt include plays we've seen with much simpler breakdowns. ie even when there isnt glaring overhelping, the guy who ends up helping is coming from the strong side, leaving a shooter wide open just one pass away with no real possibility at any rotation/recovery

[NASpurs]

Playing 90s defense in 2023

[R. DeMurre]

Keldon cheating off of his guy at the 3 pt line to help Wemby in the paint is basketball comedy. Completely absurd.