who will max out amare

[Axe Murderer]

when do you cease geophysical studies and return to south oklahoma?

idk

[Goran Dragic]

i hate when people just predict that everything's gonna be a failure because they know said move won't be enough to win a le. Even if it improves the team they can just say "Ha! This team still didn't win a championship! What a terrible move! I was right all along!" Despite the fact that the Knicks are better now than before they got Amare

Spurfan acts like the concept of "Giving ______ a max contract might not be the ideal scenario but its the best available scenario" is more difficult to grasp than geophysics. If the Knicks chose to give Amare a max contract over Lebron or some then it'd be a different story. Their choices were either A) give Amare the max and at least become relevant again so other players might want to come there or B) follow Mel_13 logic and make no significant moves during the off season that you've been throwing the kitchen sink at for years trying to clear cap space for.

[Pelicans78]

I agree that it happened to work today but Amare and Melo at the 5 and 4 isn't a recipe for long term success. Laundry Fields is a big problem. People think great in Stanford alumni who rebounds really well for a shooting guard but they don't see how detrimental a shooting guard who can't shoot for is to their offense with the spacing all messed up. They need a shooting guard who can curl off screens and score without dominating the ball in the half court. They also need a PG who knows his role and can set everything up while also knocking down open shots.

I also think at this point Mike Woodson has earned a 2 year deal similar to the one Gentry got after the 2008-2009 season when he took over for Porter.

That's true. They just need guys who can space the floor without getting in the way offensively.

Yeah, Lin isn't a good fit at all with them.

[Goran Dragic]

melo has chemistry problems with a lot of players rofl. sorry that lin wants to make the smart play while melo's mind is on another stratosphere thinking of the n!gger play to make rofl rofl

rofl you and D'antoni should meet up and discuss how Lin should be the superstar and Melo should be the role player.

[mavs>spurs]

why couldn't lin be that pg? little just needs to learn his role and stop thinking he's the next asian sensation lol. work on his j and stop trying to be a creator.

[mavs>spurs]

^but there is no cure for both amare and melo's stupid

[Axe Murderer]

Spurfan acts like the concept of "Giving ______ a max contract might not be the ideal scenario but its the best available scenario" is more difficult to grasp than geophysics. If the Knicks chose to give Amare a max contract over Lebron or some then it'd be a different story. Their choices were either A) give Amare the max and at least become relevant again so other players might want to come there or B) follow Mel_13 logic and make no significant moves during the off season that you've been throwing the kitchen sink at for years trying to clear cap space for.

tbh the Spurs have been the luckiest franchise ever by being able to basically draft a championship team. That's why some of their fans don't realize that sitting there and fingering your butthole won't do you any good 99% of the time.

[mavs>spurs]

tbh the Spurs have been the luckiest franchise ever by being able to basically draft a championship team. That's why some of their fans don't realize that sitting there and fingering your butthole won't do you any good 99% of the time.

it does me lots of good, frees up the and cures constipation

[Goran Dragic]

nash was ball dominant in a totally different way that he was always looking to set someone up. melo is now always looking to set amare up? didn't think so. their styles of play clash and you know it!

The "their styles of play clash" argument has always been re ed. Lebron and Wade have styles of play that clash. Gasol, Bynum and Odom had styles of play that clashed. Ginobili and Parker had styles of play that clashed. The teams like the Suns that are always so focused on getting great in role players who compliment the one ball dominant player on the team are the teams that always fall short.

[Goran Dragic]

why couldn't lin be that pg?

Because he's incapable of being productive without dribbling the ball around in circles. Amare and Melo are both capable of scoring off a set play where they play off ball for most of it.

[mavs>spurs]

The "their styles of play clash" argument has always been re ed. Lebron and Wade have styles of play that clash. Gasol, Bynum and Odom had styles of play that clashed. Ginobili and Parker had styles of play that clashed. The teams like the Suns that are always so focused on getting great in role players who compliment the one ball dominant player on the team are the teams that always fall short.

those examples all "clashed" so much that it lead to both team success and individual success..can you say the same about amare and melo? is 17 and 7 off 47% shooting good numbers for amare? are the knicks playing to potential by being the 7th seed with 2 (former) superstars and a top defensive center?

[Pelicans78]

Spurfan acts like the concept of "Giving ______ a max contract might not be the ideal scenario but its the best available scenario" is more difficult to grasp than geophysics. If the Knicks chose to give Amare a max contract over Lebron or some then it'd be a different story. Their choices were either A) give Amare the max and at least become relevant again so other players might want to come there or B) follow Mel_13 logic and make no significant moves during the off season that you've been throwing the kitchen sink at for years trying to clear cap space for.

Amare was playing at a high level before he went to the Knicks and during his first season with the Knicks before the Melo trade. He was living up to his contract. They just need to figure out how to make Amare and Melo coexist offensively especially when TC is back.

They may just need to implement some sort of motion offense with passing the ball around and guys getting open with screens and curls instead of just having guys stand around on the court while Melo, Amare or even that prick Lin try to isolate one-on-one.

[Goran Dragic]

those examples all "clashed" so much that it lead to both team success and individual success..can you say the same about amare and melo? is 17 and 7 off 47% shooting good numbers for amare?

The jury is still out on what will happen with Amare and Melo, since they haven't had a ed wop coach they've had plenty of team success. You're acting like it's a foregone conclusion the two won't be able to work it out.

And as far as individual success statistically, it didn't really. Wade's scoring this year is his lowest since his rookie year, Bynum was an inconsistent role player while Gasol was considered the #2 guy, and Parker or Ginobili put up much better stats when the other one is injured.

[Axe Murderer]

come to think of it, I can't think of any championship team that was just built through the draft other than the Spurs

[mavs>spurs]

there are some on this board (bump i believe) who believe that an nba coach is the most overrated, doesn't matter at all positions in pro sports. i'd like to see you guys work it out how d'antoni is responsible for all the knicks problems while coaches simultaneously don't have any effect at all.

[Pelicans78]

The two can work out, but they're gonna need a coach who can help them work it out. D'Antoni had no interest in trying. But Melo has to adjust his game as well. Denver shouldn't have need Billups just to get out of the first round with Melo and Nene on the same team.

[Pelicans78]

there are some on this board (bump i believe) who believe that an nba coach is the most overrated, doesn't matter at all positions in pro sports. i'd like to see you guys work it out how d'antoni is responsible for all the knicks problems while coaches simultaneously don't have any effect at all.

He wasn't responsible for all of the problems, but he wasn't part of the solution either. Knicks have had their best stretches when Amare and Melo both weren't on the floor together.

[Goran Dragic]

there are some on this board (bump i believe) who believe that an nba coach is the most overrated, doesn't matter at all positions in pro sports. i'd like to see you guys work it out how d'antoni is responsible for all the knicks problems while coaches simultaneously don't have any effect at all.

NBA coaches can have a much larger negative effect than they can a positive effect. Seeing that you agree with D'antoni's ed logic regarding PG oriented offense trying to explain how D'antoni was responsible for the Knicks' problems by letting guys like Toney Douglas, Iman Shumpert and Lin chuck up way too many shots or dominate the ball way too much seems like an exercise in futility.

At the time of D'antoni's firing, the Knicks had the 2nd worst 3 point percentage in the league with the 2nd most 3 point attempts. Given that the coach during that span was the same coach who refused to show any interest in Rondo because Rondo couldn't chuck 3s, you'd be re ed to think that wasn't a stubborn coach trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.

Also, this stat makes it pretty stupid to pretend D'antoni wasn't the problem:

Record with D'antoni: 18-24
Record with Woodson: 16-6

I'm sure that's just coincidence though.

[mavs>spurs]

Hold up. I'm not denying that D'antoni was a problem. I'm not a lin fan either, I've been one of his biggest haters back when everyone on this board was slobbing his knob. The proof is out there floating around all over spurstalk servers, look it up if you want. What I'm saying is that in THIS thread:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...rated+position

YOU all said that nba coaches were overrated and don't do anything at all, that it's a players league. But i see how you remembered that thread and pre-emptively covered your ass with "they can have a big negative effect, but not a positive effect! i was just saying they can't have a positive effect!"

[Goran Dragic]

They may just need to implement some sort of motion offense with passing the ball around and guys getting open with screens and curls instead of just having guys stand around on the court while Melo, Amare or even that prick Lin try to isolate one-on-one.

I agree, and god knows D'antoni was never gonna implement a motion offense that ran sets other than "PG runs a pick and roll with the PF or C while the other 3 players stand around and camp 25 feet from the basket"

[Goran Dragic]

Hold up. I'm not denying that D'antoni was a problem. I'm not a lin fan either, I've been one of his biggest haters back when everyone on this board was slobbing his knob. The proof is out there floating around all over spurstalk servers, look it up if you want. What I'm saying is that in THIS thread:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...rated+position

YOU all said that nba coaches were overrated and don't do anything at all, that it's a players league. But i see how you remembered that thread and pre-emptively covered your ass with "they can have a big negative effect, but not a positive effect! i was just saying they can't have a positive effect!"

Way to own yourself, look at all of my posts in that thread:

Tbh baseball managers are less important than NBA head coaches

Baseball s always say " managing a baseball game is extremely difficult " when it's not at all.

They only "dial the right hitting or pitching" matchups to a certain extent. Aside from choosing a pinch hitter no more than a few times a game, they submit a lineup before the game and chew on sunflower seeds for the next 3 hours.

Ron Washington managed to be a successful manager while also being a coke head.

This is why I think being an NBA head coach is harder than an MLB manager. NBA head coaches have to make sure their players actually show up to the game sober and make sure they aren't hung over.

Another overrated job is when an NFL head coach has two beast coordinators so he doesn't have to do jack , Raheem Morris being the best example of this. All he did was scream African battle cries during the huddles and Tampa's front office eventually realized he wasn't doing anything to actually help.

So point out where I personally said NBA coaches are overrated and don't do anything at all

[Goran Dragic]

But i see how you remembered that thread and pre-emptively covered your ass with "they can have a big negative effect, but not a positive effect! i was just saying they can't have a positive effect!"

the negative/positive effect thing had nothing to do with that thread, especially since I never said NBA coaches don't do anything. I was actually disagreeing with what BUMP and DD were saying in that thread.

[Goran Dragic]

lol pretending that this statement "NBA head coaches have to make sure their players actually show up to the game sober and make sure they aren't hung over" wasn't a sarcastic response implying that both positions basically do nothing

that's your comeback?

"Maybe your comment itself wasn't anything at all like what I accused you of saying, but it obviously had a sarcastic meaning to it which was what I was accusing you of saying!"

It wasn't sarcastic at all. Your arguments are getting desperate after discovering I never said that NBA coaches do nothing.

[Goran Dragic]

So point out where I personally said NBA coaches are overrated and don't do anything at all

Still waiting on this.

[Goran Dragic]

You didn't try to debate Bump's opinion in that thread at all. You went with the flow and made jokes like the making sure they don't show up hungover thing.

"True. He's another coach who does nothing but yell ENERGY! DEFENSE! While the perimeter players on his team are chucking up 3s and ignoring Dwight."

You continue to prove my point. If I thought every NBA coach does nothing, I wouldn't have felt the need to point out a specific coach who does nothing. It would be illogical.

I also find it funny the premise of your argument is a thread where BUMP DD and I were trying to simply make as many racial jokes as possible.