Jason Kapono working out for Spurs

[Hoops Czar]

While I agree (along with everybody else) with the persistent need for a big and question the lack of an ability to get one (or the seeming lack of effort to even try)...

Let's be realistic here. Being eliminated in the Conference Semis or Finals is still doing better than 26 or 28 teams.

I know that we are all used to the Championship or Bust mentality from 2000-2008, but as much as the flameout hurt last year, reaching the WCF shouldn't be viewed as a complete failure.

Who said it would be a complete failure? What's abundantly clear is RC traded away RJ for S-jax with the intention not to win a 5th ring, but to save some friggin cash. If he truly cared about the Spurs winning another ring, he would have continued to build on last season's trade deadline acquisition. Instead, RC and Pop spend the offseason signing guards, of which you had plenty of in the first place. How the can you expect to compete with the elite if all the compe ion around you gets better, and you stand pat.

The past 4 years, this team has had the same glaring weakness, and it has still hasn't been addressed to date.

[MaNu4Tres]

So you're saying it's acceptable for a team (supposedly) trying to contend to go nine years without a legit second big? Is that really that difficult to attain? Power forward, in particular -- where their gaping hole has been for the past five years -- is arguably the deepest position in the league.

Um, no. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying it's very hard and almost impossible to attain a quality starting caliber power forward player that's better than what they already have. It's virtually impossible considering the Spurs' cap-space and considering the assets the Spurs have to trade (or pieces they'd be willing to part with; Stephen Jackson is the only real piece that could bring back a decent proven player on a non-rookie contract; At the same time the other team would have to be willing to part with the player the Spurs want, which is going to be very very tough match to find via trade; Plus I doubt I would even part w/Stephen Jackson because the only thing you'll get in return is a decent player on a bad contract that a team is trying to part with).

Power forward, in particular -- where their gaping hole has been for the past five years -- is arguably the deepest position in the league.

Hate to side with Pop an R.C, because there's things I didn't agree with in the playoffs last year and just about every recent playoff run, but during the past 5 years, I'm pretty sure they've tried there hardest to acquire quality bigs with the assets they had available at each point in time during the past 5 years.

For reminder: They traded for Kurt Thomas, they recruited Drew Gooden off waivers, they signed Antonio McDyess knowing they'd be luxury tax payers, they signed Tiago Splitter, they and Tony Parker recruited Boris Diaw and did everything in their power to fit his new contract in with Danny Green and Tim Duncan's this off-season(which some people deemed impossible)--which was smart because Spurs weren't going to be able to attain a better PF in the FA market.

Spurs have done more than you give them credit for the past 5 years, just because they haven't brought in Dwight Howard or Amare in his prime doesn't mean they haven't done anything to bring in a quality 2nd big. They've tried.

[Wild Cobra Kai]

Um, no. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying it's very hard and almost impossible to attain a quality starting caliber power forward player that's better than what they already have. It's virtually impossible considering the Spurs' cap-space and considering the assets the Spurs have to trade (or pieces they'd be willing to part with; Stephen Jackson is the only real piece that could bring back a decent proven player on a non-rookie contract; At the same time the other team would have to be willing to part with the player the Spurs want, which is going to be very very tough match to find via trade; Plus I doubt I would even part w/Stephen Jackson because the only thing you'll get in return is a decent player on a bad contract that a team is trying to part with).




Hate to side with Pop an R.C, because there's things I didn't agree with in the playoffs last year and just about every recent playoff run, but during the past 5 years, I'm pretty sure they've tried there hardest to acquire quality bigs with the assets they had available at each point in time during the past 5 years.

For reminder: They traded for Kurt Thomas, they recruited Drew Gooden off waivers, they signed Antonio McDyess knowing they'd be luxury tax payers, they signed Tiago Splitter, they and Tony Parker recruited Boris Diaw and did everything in their power to fit his new contract in with Danny Green and Tim Duncan's this off-season(which some people deemed impossible)--which was smart because Spurs weren't going to be able to attain a better PF in the FA market.

Spurs have done more than you give them credit for the past 5 years, just because they haven't brought in Dwight Howard or Amare in his prime doesn't mean they haven't done anything to bring in a quality 2nd big. They've tried.

Stop. Your rationality is killing me.

What people don't realize is that sometimes, there isn't an answer. Making a trade for another premier big would likely expose another fatal flaw with what you sent out in return.

[timtonymanu]

Um, no. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying it's very hard and almost impossible to attain a quality starting caliber power forward player that's better than what they already have. It's virtually impossible considering the Spurs' cap-space and considering the assets the Spurs have to trade (or pieces they'd be willing to part with; Stephen Jackson is the only real piece that could bring back a decent proven player on a non-rookie contract; At the same time the other team would have to be willing to part with the player the Spurs want, which is going to be very very tough match to find via trade; Plus I doubt I would even part w/Stephen Jackson because the only thing you'll get in return is a decent player on a bad contract that a team is trying to part with).




Hate to side with Pop an R.C, because there's things I didn't agree with in the playoffs last year and just about every recent playoff run, but during the past 5 years, I'm pretty sure they've tried there hardest to acquire quality bigs with the assets they had available at each point in time during the past 5 years.

For reminder: They traded for Kurt Thomas, they recruited Drew Gooden off waivers, they signed Antonio McDyess knowing they'd be luxury tax payers, they signed Tiago Splitter, they and Tony Parker recruited Boris Diaw and did everything in their power to fit his new contract in with Danny Green and Tim Duncan's this off-season(which some people deemed impossible)--which was smart because Spurs weren't going to be able to attain a better PF in the FA market.

Spurs have done more than you give them credit for the past 5 years, just because they haven't brought in Dwight Howard or Amare in his prime doesn't mean they haven't done anything to bring in a quality 2nd big. They've tried.

But it's easy to get a Dwight and Amare. Spurs just have to try hard.

[spurspokesman]

That's the point AND the frustration. This staff keeps auditioning smalls, when they should be searching for bigs.

l
This. Its really getting depressing at this point. Thank god for distractions lol.

[timtonymanu]

I guess working out Butch and Carter, both bigs, doesn't amount to anything. Oh it's because they're scrubs, right?

[TD 21]

Um, no. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying it's very hard and almost impossible to attain a quality starting caliber power forward player that's better than what they already have. It's virtually impossible considering the Spurs' cap-space and considering the assets the Spurs have to trade (or pieces they'd be willing to part with; Stephen Jackson is the only real piece that could bring back a decent proven player on a non-rookie contract; At the same time the other team would have to be willing to part with the player the Spurs want, which is going to be very very tough match to find via trade; Plus I doubt I would even part w/Stephen Jackson because the only thing you'll get in return is a decent player on a bad contract that a team is trying to part with).

And in the process, you're basically saying that it's acceptable for them to not have found a credible second big for nine years. It's very hard and almost impossible to attain a Howard (unless you're the Lakers), not to acquire a run of the mill starting power forward.

This goes back to my point in the Blatche thread about them being gun shy. They don't have the balls to make a significant trade, because they're content with status quo and don't want to risk messing it up, even if there's the potential for improvement. Splitter is an excellent trade chip and as the centerpiece of a package, they could easily acquire a clear cut starting power forward. He should have been traded for the same reasons Hill was.

Hate to side with Pop an R.C, because there's things I didn't agree with in the playoffs last year and just about every recent playoff run, but during the past 5 years, I'm pretty sure they've tried there hardest to acquire quality bigs with the assets they had available at each point in time during the past 5 years.

For reminder: They traded for Kurt Thomas, they recruited Drew Gooden off waivers, they signed Antonio McDyess knowing they'd be luxury tax payers, they signed Tiago Splitter, they and Tony Parker recruited Boris Diaw and did everything in their power to fit his new contract in with Danny Green and Tim Duncan's this off-season(which some people deemed impossible)--which was smart because Spurs weren't going to be able to attain a better PF in the FA market.

Spurs have done more than you give them credit for the past 5 years, just because they haven't brought in Dwight Howard or Amare in his prime doesn't mean they haven't done anything to bring in a quality 2nd big. They've tried.

Who said anything about players of that caliber? I specifically said, run of the mill starters. All the names you mentioned were stop gaps. I realize for a few years there, they flat out didn't have the assets to get it done; I'll give them that. But the last few (especially now), they do. No excuse.

Spurs fans have become brainwashed into thinking that because the Spurs rarely do anything of significance, that it's nearly impossible to. Did anyone have the Lakers acquiring Nash? Of far less significance, but still a solid move in it's own right, was the Celtics acquiring Lee. Nobody had that one either. They didn't go, "it's going to be difficult to get these players, so we'll just go with what we have". Trying isn't enough; this is professional sports, not youth sports. It's a results oriented business and they have failed miserably when it comes to filling this hole for going on a decade. They just got away with it for the first half because their first big just so happened to be the best player in the world. And they deserve zero credit for squeezing in under the tax. All the credit goes to Duncan for that.

[MaNu4Tres]

So which PF should the Spurs gone after via trade that's better than Diaw/Splitter?

Once you do come up with names, is it realistic? Could it have happened if R.C just made the call?

And no Blatche and Patterson aren't upgrades over Diaw/Splitter (the only other two bigs on the roster that will see relevant minutes in the playoffs).

[benefactor]

And in the process, you're basically saying that it's acceptable for them to not have found a credible second big for nine years. It's very hard and almost impossible to attain a Howard (unless you're the Lakers), not to acquire a run of the mill starting power forward.

This goes back to my point in the Blatche thread about them being gun shy. They don't have the balls to make a significant trade, because they're content with status quo and don't want to risk messing it up, even if there's the potential for improvement. Splitter is an excellent trade chip and as the centerpiece of a package, they could easily acquire a clear cut starting power forward. He should have been traded for the same reasons Hill was.


Who said anything about players of that caliber? I specifically said, run of the mill starters. All the names you mentioned were stop gaps. I realize for a few years there, they flat out didn't have the assets to get it done; I'll give them that. But the last few (especially now), they do. No excuse.

Spurs fans have become brainwashed into thinking that because the Spurs rarely do anything of significance, that it's nearly impossible to. Did anyone have the Lakers acquiring Nash? Of far less significance, but still a solid move in it's own right, was the Celtics acquiring Lee. Nobody had that one either. They didn't go, "it's going to be difficult to get these players, so we'll just go with what we have". Trying isn't enough; this is professional sports, not youth sports. It's a results oriented business and they have failed miserably when it comes to filling this hole for going on a decade. They just got away with it for the first half because their first big just so happened to be the best player in the world. And they deserve zero credit for squeezing in under the tax. All the credit goes to Duncan for that.

[TD 21]

So which PF should the Spurs gone after via trade that's better than Diaw/Splitter?

Once you do come up with names, is it realistic? Could it have happened if R.C just made the call?

And no Blatche and Patterson aren't upgrades over Diaw/Splitter (the only other two bigs on the roster that will see relevant minutes in the playoffs).

Typical cliche response in these situations. So by my saying they haven't done their jobs in this respect, it means I should do it for them?

I'm not advocating all of them (it shouldn't be too difficult to differentiate), but these are the ones I think they'd have anywhere from a realistic shot at acquiring to they could have them in a second if they wanted them: Smith, Thomas, Boozer, Varejao and Millsap. In some cases, it would take a third team to acquire them, no question. Knock the fit, contract, etc., of a lot of them all you want, just remember, three are clear cut better than Splitter (four than Diaw) and all are arguably better fits than Splitter. Also, before you go bringing up the future cap space, does it matter? Other than Thomas, it's not like they'll be able to sign a better player in free agency anyway.

Who said Blatche/Patterson are upgrades over Diaw/Splitter? I meant I'd rather have them than Bonner/Blair as the fourth big.

[DeadlyDynasty]

TD21

[TD 21]

TD21

Thinking Howard is indisputably better than Robinson because he got to one Finals as a lead dog.

Pretending to be some cool, laid back guy, then losing it when I expose him for not knowing .

[DeadlyDynasty]

Thinking Howard is indisputably better than Robinson because he got to one Finals as a lead dog.

Pretending to be some cool, laid back guy, then losing it when I expose him for not knowing .

Saying Robinson would've made it to the Finals w/o Duncan
Dwight taking his team farther without HCA than Davey ever took his team w/ HCA.
pissing into the wind
get on by everybody again then claiming victory

[TD 21]

Saying Robinson would've made it to the Finals w/o Duncan
Dwight taking his team farther without HCA than Davey ever took his team w/ HCA.
pissing into the wind
get on by everybody again then claiming victory

Lacking reading comprehension
Best player on reigning champs missing playoffs

So because you're a dumb Lakers fan who doesn't want the Spurs to improve, it doesn't mean they shouldn't be trying to? Yeah, that makes a ton of sense.

Get back downstairs with the other 30 something re s who think it's fun to act like a 10 year old.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Lacking reading comprehension
Best player on reigning champs missing playoffs

So because you're a dumb Lakers fan who doesn't want the Spurs to improve, it doesn't mean they shouldn't be trying to? Yeah, that makes a ton of sense.

Get back downstairs with the other 30 something re s who think it's fun to act like a 10 year old.

Take a look at this thread, b...there's only one re posting in it and he's on the wrong side of a bukkake right now (AGAIN).

I'll give you a minute to marinate on it and guess who that person is though.

[Dex]

Stop. Your rationality is killing me.

What people don't realize is that sometimes, there isn't an answer. Making a trade for another premier big would likely expose another fatal flaw with what you sent out in return.

Why can't the Spurs turn Matt Bonner and Dejuan Blair into Dwight Howard or LeMarcus Aldridge!?

[KobeSynco_TimQuattro]

[TD 21]

Take a look at this thread, b...there's only one re posting in it and he's on the wrong side of a bukkake right now (AGAIN).

I'll give you a minute to marinate on it and guess who that person is though.

No, there's two: you and the fat boy. At least he was smart enough to leave before he caught another beating though.

b . . . so now you're a wigger
thinking the Spurs shouldn't try to improve
pretending to be gone, when you're clearly still lurking

[itzsoweezee]

that guy is done. washed up. why are the spurs wasting time on him?

[mexpurs21]

Just no

[Dr. John R. Brinkley]

For one, I think they should just play Splitter a lot more. That's the easiest way to improve the big man situation because he's already on the team.

Secondly, while I understand the need to improve the big rotation I'm not expecting them to get a great player without giving up something. What I do think is reasonable is that they should be trying to develop and/or take a chance on a big man with a high upside albeit with some risks. They drafted the guy from England (who seems so far away from contributing that I can't even remember his name) so I know the intent is there but I don't think they are making it enough of a focus.

[Obstructed_View]

While I agree (along with everybody else) with the persistent need for a big and question the lack of an ability to get one (or the seeming lack of effort to even try)...

Let's be realistic here. Being eliminated in the Conference Semis or Finals is still doing better than 26 or 28 teams.

I know that we are all used to the Championship or Bust mentality from 2000-2008, but as much as the flameout hurt last year, reaching the WCF shouldn't be viewed as a complete failure.

Matt Bonner and smallball using up the final years of Tim Duncan's career was the complete failure. It's underscored with every big body passed up in favor of someone who can hit from 30 feet away.

[gospursgojas]

I remember this guy got a max contract didnt he? Toronto?

[Russo21]

Im fine if we sign Kapono if it means a Bonner trade is in the works :-)

[jjktkk]

Matt Bonner and smallball using up the final years of Tim Duncan's career was the complete failure. It's underscored with every big body passed up in favor of someone who can hit from 30 feet away.

Do you have a list of all these big bodies the Spurs passed up on?