Bottom Line: Can you trust a guy who's never had a beer in his life?

[mavs>spurs]

lol whenever romney gives millions to charity, it doesn't matter because he still has more! he should just give it ALL away if he were really a good person! as a matter of fact, all billionaires should work 18 hour days and build their businesses for free!! let's just all be able to go into walmart and grab whatever we want, that'll work right?

[ElNono]

So you're saying Mitt is for wealth redistribution and handouts to the poor?

[mavs>spurs]

i'm saying that mitt isn't this big bad evil greedy richer like the left tries to make him out to be, and that wealth redistribution doesn't work. once you start engaging in total redistribution and socialism, people would rather not work hard and get things for free and the rich scale back their 15 hour work days to 8 without the extra incentive. overall it creates less total wealth and you end up like communist russia which failed if you don't remember.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

What about a guy who's never had a job in his life?

[hitmanyr2k]

lol whenever romney gives millions to charity, it doesn't matter because he still has more! he should just give it ALL away if he were really a good person! as a matter of fact, all billionaires should work 18 hour days and build their businesses for free!! let's just all be able to go into walmart and grab whatever we want, that'll work right?

Who said he should give it all away? You're making a big deal about well-off people giving to charity and posting a story where Mitt helps another Mormon family like it's supposed to mean he's a good person. Michael Jordan has given a load of money to charity. Does that mean we should use Jordan's charity giving as THE example that he's a good person? no

[Viva Las Espuelas]

It's not my fault his Mormon faith requires giving to charity. I'm just saying he still gets a tax deduction for giving that money.

will he go to if he doesn't? are there charity enforcing squads in the mormon faith that makes sure the members do? what's their penalty for not donating? links please

[mavs>spurs]

Who said he should give it all away?

You did, when you dismissed and diminished his contributions. How much do you feel he should have to give away to charity and the government in order to get your respect? Because between taxes/charity, he was almost at 50% last year. Do you feel like the rich should give away over 50% of their income? that's socialism and redistribution buddy. it really doesn't work.

[ElNono]

Mitt is greedy rich and unlike boutons, I don't see anything particularly wrong with that. I would however argue that having a 15% capitals gains rate is an incentive to go with the high speed trading and the like instead of actually being an incentive for direct job creation or long term investment. And completely agree that both Barry and Mitt are much of the same in that department.

[hitmanyr2k]

You did, when you dismissed and diminished his contributions. How much do you feel he should have to give away to charity and the government in order to get your respect? Because between taxes/charity, he was almost at 50% last year. Do you feel like the rich should give away over 50% of their income? that's socialism and redistribution buddy. it really doesn't work.

I dismiss any charity given by multi-millionaires because it's not like it's going to do any harm to a rich person giving away money that's a drop in the bucket to them. You're trying to pump up Romney as some do-gooder because he gives away money and has a feel good story where he helps another family apart of his church. You can be that gullible if you want to. Giving away money you could burn doesn't make you a good person. It makes for great PR and image building (sure didn't hurt Romney that Ryan brought it up in the debate ).

[Viva Las Espuelas]

geez. imagine what you'd say if he didn't give to charity.
i guess you're biased to all chicago teams.......

[mavs>spurs]

I dismiss any charity given by multi-millionaires because it's not like it's going to do any harm to a rich person giving away money that's a drop in the bucket to them. You're trying to pump up Romney as some do-gooder because he gives away money and has a feel good story where he helps another family apart of his church. You can be that gullible if you want to. Giving away money you could burn doesn't make you a good person. It makes for great PR and image building (sure didn't hurt Romney that Ryan brought it up in the debate ).

so to keep it fair let's ask you this then, did you give up 27% of your income last year to charity? just a drop in the bucket to you like mitt's 4 mil was right?

[hitmanyr2k]

i'm saying that mitt isn't this big bad evil greedy richer like the left tries to make him out to be, and that wealth redistribution doesn't work. once you start engaging in total redistribution and socialism, people would rather not work hard and get things for free and the rich scale back their 15 hour work days to 8 without the extra incentive. overall it creates less total wealth and you end up like communist russia which failed if you don't remember.

I'm sick of hearing this garbage as well People are working harder and being more productive than ever in this country and their wages are stagnating and their benefits are getting cut constantly. I'm sick of the big bad socialism argument. This is the typical business model Americans are dealing with today....

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...173543531.html



You can't beat 99 cent wages in China but what the , let's give more tax cuts to these assholes and stupidly think things are going to change in this country in regards to jobs getting shipped overseas

[hitmanyr2k]

so to keep it fair let's ask you this then, did you give up 27% of your income last year to charity? just a drop in the bucket to you like mitt's 4 mil was right?

If I had the kind of wealth Romney had and I was making money just sitting on my ass I wouldn't give two s about 4 million dollars in charity lol. If his charity is going to the Mormon church why should I give a ? Got a breakdown of where his charity went to? Who did it benefit?

[boutons_deux]

"Barry and Mitt are much of the same"

false equivalence

Barry wasn't born rich and privileged. Barry hasn't lived his entire live in the financial sector wheeling and dealing in the shadows, and feloniously hiding his income offshore.

One of the reasons Gecko hides so much of his income offshore is that he's hiding it not only from the IRS but also it from Mormon, Inc. His Queen "You People" Ann says she cries when she has to give up so much to Mormon, Inc.

[ElNono]

It doesn't matter "how they grew up", bot... we're here now, and they're both cut from the same cloth...

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Romney gives 4mil to "charity" because he believes that's how he gets into Mormon heaven and his own planet after death or whatever he believes. Giving money to your Church because you think getting into heaven is contingent on it isn't as selfless as giving to charity.

Also, my concern regarding taxes more than anything is reducing the national deficit. Mitt Romney giving $4m to the Church and getting a 650k deduction might do great things for less fortunate Mormons, but the only effect it has on the national deficit is a 650k increase. The fact is that America's wealth is so concentrated towards the top that the only way the national deficit is paid off is if taxes on the rich go up. That's not exactly socialist wealth redistribution since that wealth should go towards paying our bills.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

will he go to if he doesn't?

According to Mormon belief, yes.

[mavs>spurs]

Romney gives 4mil to "charity" because he believes that's how he gets into Mormon heaven and his own planet after death or whatever he believes. Giving money to your Church because you think getting into heaven is contingent on it isn't as selfless as giving to charity.

Also, my concern regarding taxes more than anything is reducing the national deficit. Mitt Romney giving $4m to the Church and getting a 650k deduction might do great things for less fortunate Mormons, but the only effect it has on the national deficit is a 650k increase. The fact is that America's wealth is so concentrated towards the top that the only way the national deficit is paid off is if taxes on the rich go up. That's not exactly socialist wealth redistribution since that wealth should go towards paying our bills.

if he were that cold and doing it only to get into heaven then he would have just cut a check to the church for whatever % of his income required to get into heaven and not wasted several hours of his time and additional funds to go visit that family, spend time with them, and pay for the kids tuition. that sounds pretty genuine and caring to me, taking the time to actually go visit.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

if he were that cold and doing it only to get into heaven then he would have just cut a check to the church for whatever % of his income required to get into heaven and not wasted several hours of his time and additional funds to go visit that family, spend time with them, and pay for the kids tuition. that sounds pretty genuine and caring to me, taking the time to actually go visit.

I'm sure we could find examples of Obama, or Bush, or any other recent president doing that kind of stuff.

And like I implied but didn't outright explain, I don't fault Mitt for not giving more to charity like some dumbasses are doing in this thread, but I don't give him credit for giving to charity either. Charity is a choice and it stops being charity when the giver expect credits and gra ude for it. The net effect of his 4m donation for non-Mormons was 650k more in debt the government will need to pay off another way.

Both sides of this argument are wrong imo. Mitt himself has nothing to do with America's current tax code so the fact he pays a low rate isn't a valid criticism when every tax payer pays the lowest rate they can. Warren Buffet also pays a low rate while criticizing how much of a joke the tax code is for rich people, and it's stupid to expect him to pay a higher rate when he doesn't have to. The criticism I have of Mitt is a tax code he wants that makes it so he pays even less in taxes.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

I also have no idea why people still respond or acknowledge Boutons. I put him on ignore awhile ago. I can't even understand half the stuff he posts anymore with all the nicknames/catch phrases he uses.

[boutons_deux]

"the fact he pays a low rate isn't a valid criticism"

It's not that he pays 15% on his "carried interest" loophole and capital.

It's that he refuses to show his tax returns (if they're all all true and legal, what's the problem? obviously it's a HUGE problem for him), and that he has $10Ms hidden offshore, if not $100Ms, hiding it from the IRS and Mormon, Inc.

[MannyIsGod]

Which candidate hs never had a job?

[doobs]

Mitt is greedy rich and unlike boutons, I don't see anything particularly wrong with that. I would however argue that having a 15% capitals gains rate is an incentive to go with the high speed trading and the like instead of actually being an incentive for direct job creation or long term investment. And completely agree that both Barry and Mitt are much of the same in that department.

Beg pardon? Short-term capital gains, i.e., investments held less than a year, are taxed the same as ordinary income.

[TeyshaBlue]

I also have no idea why people still respond or acknowledge Boutons. I put him on ignore awhile ago. I can't even understand half the stuff he posts anymore with all the nicknames/catch phrases he uses.

Good idea, tbh

[mavs>spurs]

Beg pardon? Short-term capital gains, i.e., investments held less than a year, are taxed the same as ordinary income.

no they're not they're taxed at the 15% capital gains rate.