Can we trade/salarydump Bonner now?

[Mel_13]

I don't think they can use the amnesty right now. There's only certain periods where you can use it.

Plus I would rather the Spurs con some other team and gets something in return, a la Jax.

Extremely unlikely to repeat that happy set of cir stances, but if it were to happen it would occur when the Jax trade did, at the trade deadline.

[Drz]

My Bonner signal went off, and I have thusly returned.

During each of the first game, I always find myself thinking just how much better this Spurs team would be if they had a more dynamic PF presence on the roster. A PF with some length and strength that could defend other bigs, rebound, block an occasional shot and hit a midrange J consistently. In short, all the things that Bonner doesn't do.

SenorSpur, let me ask you something. What makes a team better to you? Would a team be better with a player who does the things you mentioned, or would a team be better with a player that helps his team's point differential?

Bonner, as I really, really, really hope everyone knows by now, is in the latter category. Personally, I don't think anyone should give a flying f*** HOW the player helps us win, just that he DOES. And Bonner does. If the Spurs had 5 guys who waddled around and flapped their arms like penguins, but we won every game, hey, great job I'd say.

[SenorSpur]

My Bonner signal went off, and I have thusly returned.


SenorSpur, let me ask you something. What makes a team better to you? Would a team be better with a player who does the things you mentioned, or would a team be better with a player that helps his team's point differential?

Bonner, as I really, really, really hope everyone knows by now, is in the latter category. Personally, I don't think anyone should give a flying f*** HOW the player helps us win, just that he DOES. And Bonner does. If the Spurs had 5 guys who waddled around and flapped their arms like penguins, but we won every game, hey, great job I'd say.

To be fair, if you're going to factor in point differential in this comparison, you have to consider not only how many points the player scores, but how many points he gives up. Be it missed defensive rotations, the inability to keep his man off the offensive glass, thereby leading to immediate putbacks or simply not having the foot speed to keep his man in front of him, thereby giving up easy drives to the basket. When watching Bonner, it's quite obvious opposing teams and coaches know exactly where and how to attack him. The opposition bigs have quite simply abused him and it doesn't really matter who it is. Most of us can recall the ill-fated Memphis playoff series a couple of years ago. It didn't matter what player Bonner was guarding, that player went off - consistently. They attacked him on both ends to the point that the Grizz not only took away Bonner's only offensive strength, they mentally intimidated him and he shrunk into the fetal position. Therefore, the Spurs were playing 4-on-5 basketball, whenever he was on the floor.

As to your question, I don't put too much stock into a player's contribution toward point differential. I go off of what I see. I like players that have more than one tool in their skillset, a player who can do several things well and perhaps even willing to do things other players will not. A player who works hard, embraces good coaching and can provide production (tangible and intangible) that can benefit the team in a positive way. I'll take that any day over a guy who does one thing - and only one thing - well, yet annually chokes in the playoffs.

[ElNono]

You can't even gloat about his regular season prowess so far. Sure, it's early, but the king of plus/minus has yet to put a positive point differential. Which IMO, it's further proof that's Ginobili the one that racks up those +/- numbers for the bench, not Matty Ice.

Even then, as I already pointed out in the past, I don't care if he helps you win an extra 5-10 games in the regular season. This team is good enough without him to make the playoffs anyways, and I much rather give his minutes to somebody that won't completely disappear when the playoffs roll around.

[Drz]

To be fair, if you're going to factor in point differential in this comparison, you have to consider not only how many points the player scores, but how many points he gives up. Be it missed defensive rotations, the inability to keep his man off the offensive glass, thereby leading to immediate putbacks or simply not having the foot speed to keep his man in front of him, thereby giving up easy drives to the basket. When watching Bonner, it's quite obvious opposing teams and coaches know exactly where and how to attack him. ...

Lol! The Spurs are a better defensive team when Bonner is on the floor. Look it up.

As to your question, I don't put too much stock into a player's contribution toward point differential. I go off of what I see. I like players that have more than one tool in their skillset, a player who can do several things well and perhaps even willing to do things other players will not.

This is all fine. You're obviously welcome to like whatever type of player you want to like. Although your "I go off of what I see" comment alludes to why you're not aware of Bonner's defense.

A player who works hard, embraces good coaching and can provide production (tangible and intangible) that can benefit the team in a positive way.

...yet this is where you get asininely ridiculous. Bonner is the epitome of exactly what you just described.

[SenorSpur]

Lol! The Spurs are a better defensive team when Bonner is on the floor. Look it up.


This is all fine. You're obviously welcome to like whatever type of player you want to like. Although your "I go off of what I see" comment alludes to why you're not aware of Bonner's defense.


...yet this is where you get asininely ridiculous. Bonner is the epitome of exactly what you just described.

Yeah, and I see opposing players easily moving him out of position, outrebounding him and scoring at when he's guarding him. There are lies, damn lies and statistics. If Bonner benefited the Spurs so much defensively, he wouldn't have been benched by his own coach in the OKC series and in the second half of the first two regular season games of this season.

Hey, you can apologize for Bonner all you want, but if you think the Spurs are a better team with him on the roster, then you've not been watching the past 4 years of Spurs playoff basketball and it is YOU who are insanely ridiculous. However, you keep making those apologies, they are damn funny.

[DapDaGenius]

Well hopefully Pop reads up on fan's reactions to things through various websites like how Michael Jordan did/does.

[SpurNation]

Early struggles of Tiago is forcing Pop to use Bonner/Blair more than I think he would like to use them until a (hopefully in the near future) trade can be made.

[Bruno]

Bonner is less of an issue than in the past years.

Part of the problem with Bonner was that Pop considered him as an important part of the team and was ignoring the fact that he was a playoffs choker. It seems that this year, Pop has seen the light and he isn't relying on him. Bonner has gone from a player that hurt the team to an useless player. It's a step in the right direction and I just hope Pop won't go back to his old habits and put back Bonner as a key part of Spurs' rotation.

Trading Bonner between now and the trade deadline won't be easy given that he has a negative trade value. However, he will be in June a very good trade asset almost as good as a $4.5M trade exception.

[racm]

Bonner's a spot minute stretch 4 whose biggest boon was limiting the minutes on TD/Horry back in 07. The problem was that Pop played him big minutes in games that count.

Now that he's back to his 5-10 minute spots (as it should be), the Spurs can now afford to win ugly again.

[Drz]

Yeah, and I see opposing players easily moving him out of position, outrebounding him and scoring at when he's guarding him. There are lies, damn lies and statistics. If Bonner benefited the Spurs so much defensively, he wouldn't have been benched by his own coach in the OKC series and in the second half of the first two regular season games of this season.

He was benched because OKC was one of the few teams that played against him effectively. They have a surplus of bigs on the court, so the stretch 4 has less of an effect, and the defender they used stayed off him more to help keep the paint clogged.

Then again, the two games he didn't play against OKC were when the Spurs crashed. Coincidence? Or is basketball a team game, and the 5-man unit performance is more important than the stats of one individual player? Food for thought.

Hey, you can apologize for Bonner all you want, but if you think the Spurs are a better team with him on the roster, then you've not been watching the past 4 years of Spurs playoff basketball and it is YOU who are insanely ridiculous. However, you keep making those apologies, they are damn funny.

He's been bad in the 595 minutes he's played in the postseason. He's been amazing in the 10,634 minutes he's played in the regular season. Which one tells us more about the type of player he is .... well, you're en led to your thoughts, but I hope you can look at those numbers and come up with the correct conclusion.

[SenorSpur]

He was benched because OKC was one of the few teams that played against him effectively. They have a surplus of bigs on the court, so the stretch 4 has less of an effect, and the defender they used stayed off him more to help keep the paint clogged.

Then again, the two games he didn't play against OKC were when the Spurs crashed. Coincidence? Or is basketball a team game, and the 5-man unit performance is more important than the stats of one individual player? Food for thought.

He's been bad in the 595 minutes he's played in the postseason. He's been amazing in the 10,634 minutes he's played in the regular season. Which one tells us more about the type of player he is .... well, you're en led to your thoughts, but I hope you can look at those numbers and come up with the correct conclusion.

Everyone knows playoff basketball is where one earns his bones and where reputations are either won or lost. It is also in the playoffs where opposing coaches design defensive schemes to take away a player's strengths, while exposing their weaknesses. Bonner is easily exposed because he possesses only one discernible skill. Combine that with the fact that he's mentally weak and you get a player who is easily taken out of his comfort zone and one whose production annually declines in the playoffs.

For some reason, you keep trying to prove what an indispensible weapon Bonner has been for this team during the regular season. It doesn't matter if he drains 5 3-pointers in a January game against some random opponent. It doesn't matter because everyone knows what will occur once the playoff begin. You're wasting your time trying to prove anything to the contrary.

I have already arrived at, what I believe, is the apporpriate conclusion about Bonner and it didn't take me four years to get there. I know what he is and more importantly, what he isn't. The rest of the NBA knows it too. The frustration is that Pop acts as though he's the only man on earth who doesn't see the obvious. THe other frustrating part for me is that, despite Bonner's numerous limitations and annual playoff failings, he continues to occupy a roster spot.

Bonner may not be the only "elephant in the room" on this roster, but he certainly is one of the most significant. You know where I stand and I know where you stand. Let's move on.

[dunkman]

Only if they really need the roster spot, otherwise it's better to keep him. And his expiring contract (considering that his next season is only partially guaranteed) will be an asset approaching the mid-season trade deadline.

[ElNono]

The whole "OKC figured him out" is baloney, tbh... Bonner was statistically among the worst Spurs players during the entire playoffs (something DrZ agreed with). Looking back, he was sucking all the way back to around March.

Obviously, the Spurs were trouncing teams despite Bonner's poor production, so it's easy to try to rewrite history now.

Also, equating playoffs and regular season for player comparison is a false equivalence. There's effectively different tournaments with fairly different formats. There's obviously much more preparation towards your opponent during the playoffs, where you'll face them up to 7 times in a row and your entire season depends on beating them.

[ElNono]

Bonner is less of an issue than in the past years.

Part of the problem with Bonner was that Pop considered him as an important part of the team and was ignoring the fact that he was a playoffs choker. It seems that this year, Pop has seen the light and he isn't relying on him. Bonner has gone from a player that hurt the team to an useless player. It's a step in the right direction and I just hope Pop won't go back to his old habits and put back Bonner as a key part of Spurs' rotation.

Trading Bonner between now and the trade deadline won't be easy given that he has a negative trade value. However, he will be in June a very good trade asset almost as good as a $4.5M trade exception.

Agree with this.

[BackHome]

Bonner sucks we all know he can put up a good 3 point % during the regular season but come playoff time he chokes. If i were a team that needed to win a few more games to make the fans happy then I would pick him up but not to try to add to win a ring.