NBA: Bill Simmons Trolling Lakers

[Cry Havoc]

Bill Russell, Lew Alcindor, Walt Bellamy, Jerry Lucas, Nate Thurmond, or Wes Unseld? Sure he sometimes got matchups with 6'9" guys like Bob Pet but look at the trotted out in todays NBA. Humphries, Stiemsma, Bonner and all other manner of utter trash has started at the 5 in the NBA. Big man talent is and has been for quite some time.

Before Chamberlain teamed with Greer, teams were constantly parading guards to double hard on him. Rebounding became beat the out of Wilt time. Mind you this isn't modern pussyball. Hacks, bumps, shoves and the like were tolerated. He wasn't given the Shaq treatment where he was allowed to bowl people over and slam it. Quite the contrary as he was treated much like Rasheed Wallace if even that well. He scored with finger rolls, hooks, and a turnaround jumper to compensate. He was the greatest rebounder in history by far despite that .

This notion that Chamberlain was playing with a stacked deck is not accurate.

Not that I disagree with much of your post here, but it's worth noting that Rodman has a higher rebound rate than wilt, and it's a decent margin, to boot.

[ezau]

Bill Russell, Lew Alcindor, Walt Bellamy, Jerry Lucas, Nate Thurmond, or Wes Unseld? Sure he sometimes got matchups with 6'9" guys like Bob Pet but look at the trotted out in todays NBA. Humphries, Stiemsma, Bonner and all other manner of utter trash has started at the 5 in the NBA. Big man talent is and has been for quite some time.

Before Chamberlain teamed with Greer, teams were constantly parading guards to double hard on him. Rebounding became beat the out of Wilt time. Mind you this isn't modern pussyball. Hacks, bumps, shoves and the like were tolerated. He wasn't given the Shaq treatment where he was allowed to bowl people over and slam it. Quite the contrary as he was treated much like Rasheed Wallace if even that well. He scored with finger rolls, hooks, and a turnaround jumper to compensate. He was the greatest rebounder in history by far despite that .

This notion that Chamberlain was playing with a stacked deck is not accurate.

Good post, but, come on man, Bill Russell? Not to disrespect him, but he would get totally exposed in today's NBA. I'd put the likes of Duncan, Robinson, Shaq, Jabbar, and Olajuwon as far as big men are concerned ahead of Wilt.

[spurraider21]

ppl calling Robertson a stat padder as if they watched him play

[Deuce Bigalow]

1. MJ
2. Russell
3. Magic
4. Bird
5. Kareem
6. Kobe
7. Shaq
8. West
9. Oscar
10. Duncan
11. Mikan
12. Wilt
13. Hakeem
14. Lebron
15. Pet /Baylor/Dr J/Moses

tbh

[spurraider21]

hakeem 13

...among other things, namely your entire list

[Deuce Bigalow]

hakeem 13

...among other things, namely your entire list

Hakeem has no case over the guys I listed maybe except for Mikan because of the era.

[spurraider21]

what makes West better than hakeem, tbh

or duncan for that matter. inb4 west's free throw %

[scanry]

Cool, so you do value the fact he ranked Kobe # 8 on the All time list?

Above Shaq and Olajuwon?


http://www.basketball-reference.com/...s_pyramid.html

Swap Magic with Russel and Big O with Shaq and that list looks pretty good tbh.

You cannot overlook Shaq's work ethic. That alone should go against his ranking.

[scanry]

1. MJ
2. Russell
3. Magic
4. Bird
5. Kareem
6. Kobe
7. Shaq
8. West
9. Oscar
10. Duncan
11. Mikan
12. Wilt
13. Hakeem
14. Lebron
15. Pet /Baylor/Dr J/Moses

tbh

DB i think it's safe to say that Timmy has surpassed the Piano Mamba tbh. Don't even get me started on Shaq.

[Deuce Bigalow]

9 NBA Finals
37.9 ppg in '69 Finals earning FMVP in a loss
10 All-NBA First teams
4 2nd place MVP finishes
8 top 5 MVP finishes
scoring le
assist le
most points in finals history
most 30-point games in finals history
most 30 ppg finals series
highest single playoff series scoring average
led playoffs in scoring 3 times
led playoffs in assists per game 3 times

[scanry]

ppl calling Robertson a stat padder as if they watched him play

Son D Rob did stat pad his way to the scoring le.

He's like a rich man version of Dwight Howard. Ain't goin cut it as the first option and sub par low post game.

[Deuce Bigalow]

West's playoff stats: 29-6-6 (47/81)
Finals stats: 31-5-5 (46/83)

Dude was a playoff beast. There's a reason why he was called Mr. Clutch.

[spurraider21]

Son D Rob did stat pad his way to the scoring le.

He's like a rich man version of Dwight Howard. Ain't goin cut it as the first option and sub par low post game.

Robertson =/= David Robinson

[spurraider21]

West's playoff stats: 29-6-6 (47/81)
Finals stats: 31-5-5 (46/83)

Dude was a playoff beast. There's a reason why he was called Mr. Clutch.

why is west ahead of wilt?

[Deuce Bigalow]

why is west ahead of wilt?

I value the postseason the most and West was the better playoff performer and especially in the Finals. But Wilt was such a good regular season player making him probably the greatest if we ignore playoffs/finals.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Robertson =/= David Robinson

Nah

Big O playoffs stats before being past his prime in Milwaukee ('62-'67): 30-9-9 on 46/87

Game 7 '63 EDF vs Boston: 43-6-6 on 11/24, 21/22

EDIT: Thought you meant he was like D-Rob in the playoffs nvm

[spurraider21]

scanry responded to my oscar robertson post with stuff about david robinson, i was just pointing out we're talking about different people

[spurraider21]

i dont know how people pretend to be able to evaluate players they never watched... just using basketballreference would make people believe KG > Duncan

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Not that I disagree with much of your post here, but it's worth noting that Rodman has a higher rebound rate than wilt, and it's a decent margin, to boot.

Rebounding rate didn't begin to be calculated until 70-71 so you only get TOSB Wilt who took a reduced role with the Lakers with those numbers. They do have rebounding totals though.

Rodman's greatest year was 1991 when he grabbed 1530 rebounds.

Chamberlain's was in 1961 where he grabbed 2149. He grabbed over 1900 rebounds 7 times and above 1530 rebounds, Rodman's best, 12 times.

The denominator on the efficiency stats is possessions and I don't think there were 40% more possessions in 1961.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You are so cute! Big O was a stat padder & a career loser, who was carried to his only le in a weak era by Kareem.

As someone else pointed out, you never watched Robertson play. He was the first big guard and a tremendous rebounder. The Royals had some good years when they had Lucas and Robertson they just lost to the Celtics like everyone else did.

Milwaukee traded for Robertson because Jabbar was not getting it done. Just like he didn't get it done after Robertson left through the ABA talent poor era.

[Thread]

Bill is still mighty flat eared over '10. He had to sit there in Staples and take that. He was banking on a new front for his Celtics, a new domination of the old.

Uh, uh.

[midnightpulp]

1. MJ
2. Russell
3. Magic
4. Bird
5. Kareem
6. Kobe
7. Shaq
8. West
9. Oscar
10. Duncan
11. Mikan
12. Wilt
13. Hakeem
14. Lebron
15. Pet /Baylor/Dr J/Moses

tbh

Not surprised the worst all-time list I've ever seen comes from Deuce.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Good post, but, come on man, Bill Russell? Not to disrespect him, but he would get totally exposed in today's NBA. I'd put the likes of Duncan, Robinson, Shaq, Jabbar, and Olajuwon as far as big men are concerned ahead of Wilt.

Exposed by Vucevic? Marc Gasol was All NBA first team. Dwight Howard? I don't buy that Bill Russell couldn't do just fine. I don't have him in my top 10 all time though.

I think you massively underrate Chamberlain.

You obviously discount all the scoring les and rebounding les. Career averages and career totals. I can give credence to Jabbar being the championships and scoring total but the rest is absurd.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I value the postseason the most and West was the better playoff performer and especially in the Finals. But Wilt was such a good regular season player making him probably the greatest if we ignore playoffs/finals.

Chamberlain averaged 35 points and 26 rebounds in the playoffs with Philadelphia. He won a championship there with the only team of the era to beat the Celtics.

How many did West win in that time period? None. It wasn't until proven champion Chamberlain was brought in that he was able to hoist the trophy.

[ambchang]

I value the postseason the most and West was the better playoff performer and especially in the Finals. But Wilt was such a good regular season player making him probably the greatest if we ignore playoffs/finals.

So why would Kobe be on the list? 25% shooting in Game 7 a mark of dominance for you?