Who has done a better job?
I agree we have screwed up...
We screwed up by pulling out of Vietnam...
We screwed up by letting the Islamic revolution in Iran...
40% unemployment in one of the wealthiest nations in the world...
Slavery was ed...that was a tradition from Europe, Asia, South America and Africa that we had to cure ourselves =of...
Nuking Japan was probably a wrong...but was there any other way to beat the Japanese...we didn't totally beat them with the nukes...only their government.
And we pollute like mother ers...This is hte one thing I can honestly say we are the worst in World History at at a definite threat to the World because of...
I do not feel bad about interfering in the affairs of other countries...Communism is worse than a dictatorship...at least a dictatorship will let you leave...and Communism was an expansionsist movement of conquering and imposing...
You can still be a communist in a Democracy...in a capitalist country...the reverse is not true.
Subversive interference is better than flat out conquering which is what every other world power has done...
And we didn'd declare war on Islam...it declared war on us.
Who is better?
@ whottt not understanding that the US had no business in Vietnam and then saying we might have been wrong with the nukes.
I still maintain that the nukes were terrorism and all nuclear warefare is based on terrorism but the smart choice.
Ah, whatever.
We also ed up letting Guevara and Castro steal every thing from the Cuban citizenry...now Castro lives like a king and has god like control on millions of suffering and opresssed Cubans.
It worked out so well...just ask all those refugees in Florida begging to go back to Cuba.
Yeah, AND???
People are ed up everywhere, and you seemed to acknowledge that, but beyond that, is there a point to what you are saying?
When discussing world politics and history, there are an infinite number of variables, most of which you seem to want to ignore, as do a lot of people who argue/debate politics. This is especially so when the topic is so vague and fuzzy.
My point is that the US meddles in other countries' affairs (at least this is the point you quoted me on).
Do you see Argentina meddling in the US' affairs?
What is your point?
Smeagol does have a point...Argentina doesn't meddle in other countries affairs...take WWII for instance...wouldn't we have all been better off if America had followed Argentina's lead and...................done absolutely nothing except sit there and offer moral support to the Nazis...
Let someone else worry about it...we tried that...by the way. We found out it usually ends up costing more lives when we do that.
You mean we only worry about it when it is in our best interest to be worried?
Like who gives a whott about all the other trouble spots in the world?
There are lives being lost every day but not much is being done because it is NOT in the best interest of the US.
But I guess Iraq is.
Joe...you need to get together with smeagol...according to him all we do is meddle in the affairs of other countries...while you are saying we don't...which is it, liberal?
And a Semper Fi won't save you this time, back it up.
Oh, you mean like you back up all your posts?
And when did I say we don't meddle in other countries affairs..huh, conservative?
My point is that we are in Iraq, which I admit we cannot get out of now and Bush knew once he pulled the trigger we wouldn't be able to pull back.
But I also think the US needs to get involved for humanitarian reasons.
I support military intervention to save lives (yeah, I know...that's the reason we're in Iraq). Not because the country has oil and it will give a much needed strategic military prescence but for the sake of humanity.
I know we can't be everywhere but that is just my opinion.
Whottt say you?
Congratulations, you and I are discussing absolutely nothing of importance, which is the best possible outcome, given your passive and weak opening.
Name for me one political en y that does not meddle in other people's affairs.
Just one.
Saddam invaded another country...lost a war VS virtually the entire rest of the world...including Muslim countries...and then violated the conditions of his cease fire aggreement multiple...thus giving us legal recourse to take him out.
This according to the UN resolutions...the UN pussed out of backing up their own resolutions...we were totally with in the framework of the UN resolutions to take Saddam out.
Not to mention the fact that we were having to base ourselves in Saudi Arabia to enforce the no-fly zone(that propping up a dictator thing we are always accused of)...a top flight recruiting tool for militant Islam...and one mentioned by Usama as a reason for the Sept 11 attacks.
Saddam sitting on billions of dollars made him more dangerous than a country without those resources...while simultaenously being vulnerable to a toppling...
And the only people the sanctions were hurting were the Iraqis...yet another reason cited by Usama...
So what do we do?
Let Saddam off scott free for countless violations and nose thumbings? Lift the sanctions.
Continue them? Ineffective as they were?
Or take him out?
Why is it so ing bad that we took Saddam out...exactly what was he contributing to the world...to that region...
Are we really so evil for taking out a dictator that soght WMD and control of the middle east?
And I hate to tell you this...but if we wanted cheap oil we had a lot better chance of getting it from Saddam than we will from any government that replaces him....all we had to do was buddy up to Saddam...arm him to the teeth...and we'd have had the cheapest Oil ever.
And now those billions of dollars are going to US companies!! YES!!!!
Um...Iraq's ability to produce Oil has been severely damaged by this war...
If all we want is Oil...we'd be sucking up to Iran right now...
We'd give them Israel...
How much Oil you think we could get for giving them high grade nukes...
As much as China is getting?
C'mon all we care about is Oil...
Figure it out.
I agree with everything Extra Stout said. Though for a conservative, I'm surprised how admiring ES is of Europe's public infrastructure.
Huh?
We are talking about countries meddling in other countries affairs the way the US has done since WWII.
WTF has political en ies meddling in people's affairs have to do with anything?
I never said the US has to be passive to everything that goes around in the World. And Argentina was not attacked in WWII and our boats were not being sunk by Uboats. At the time we were governed by a dictator of our own, who happened to sympathize with Hitler.
But please don't compare taking down crazy Hitler to taking down Salvador Allende.
Not sure I follow you.
I thought you said you weren't a socialist?
Man that was the ing coldwar...I don't think America has ever claimed to be a friend of Socialism or Communism...if that's what you are then I totally understand why you hate us...
You are smart to hate us, because we are your arch ing enemy if that's what you are.
And I don't think we ever claimed we weren't...communism was at War with us just as much as we with it...and we had every right to defend ourselves against it.
You act like no one intereferes in our policy...I just saw Europe try to with our Presidential race...the Nazis still with it...the Muslims with it...Israel s with it...
Everyone s with it...don't act like we are the only ones that do that.
Everyone tries to subvert our elections and foreign policy here...
You don't think the Russians backed political parties and groups here in the US? You are silly.
Honestly, I don't believe the "World" hates the U.S.A.
If you paid attention to our last political race, Usama was recruiting Democrat votes with threats...
We told him to get ed....IF he had succeeded it would have been due to the idiots on our own soil...
Please don't put words in my mouth. I never said "all the US does is meddle in other countries affairs". But is is known to do have done it a number of times.
Look whottt, my biggest thing with the US is not military. I'm against the war with Iraq, but I'm happy Saddam was deposed. And if democracy can be installed in the Middle East because of what the US did, I will be the first one to say I was wrong. I'm not as stubborn as some of the ST.com posters, who cannot accept when they are wrong. I have done it more than once, and I would do it again.
My biggest problem with the US has to do with trade barriers. America is always telling the World they support free trade and that everybody has to open their countries to commerce. Well, guess what? that's ing baloney.
The US (and europe for that matter) will impose tariffs on a number of products if local producers of that product have a big enough lobby in DC. Today I opened the paper and I read that the US is imposing tariffs on Brazilian OJ. The US, togetgher with Europe, pays huge subsidies to their farmers literally killing the chance 3rd World farmers have to compete in the Wordl economy.
I also read that Chuck Schummer wants China to open their economy to American companies two weeks after they made it impossible for that Chinese oil company to buy Unocal.
I can live with the US imposing their political will by force if they would only level the playing field when it comes to international trade.
It's funny I have to fight with you on these matters when the fact is when I'm in Argentina I'm the one who always defends the US.
I am not a socialist. I don't like socialism and I hate communism. I have dealt with communists much more often than you have. My country is full of them. In Argentina, we have a leftist government the likes of which you would never ever have in the US. Even if that lunatic Michael Moore became president.
That does not mean I don't like it when the US helps a dictator tumble a democratically elected president. The irony is Chile would never be where it is if it weren't for Pinochet.
I don't hate you. How many times do I have to say this. Just because I don't agree with some US policies doesn't mean I hate you. Can you please take note of this for you next posts?
I don't hate you.
Allende's government was socialism, not communism. Are you telling me the US wants to topple all the socialist European governments?
If you guys hate communism so much, why don't you kill Fidel once and for all. I would second that.
So all these people assassinated an American president?
Huh?
Again have these groups sent covert militia into the US and helped kill a president?
I concur.
I agree. I said dislike and I believe that is true. You guys need to get out of the US and hear first hand how people see you.
[I can already see the responses from some of you: "Who the cares what the rest of the World thinks of us?"]
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