Amtrack offered trains for N.O.

[whottt]

Ignorance of the Cons ution and States rights VS the Fed does not cons ute a scoffing.

[whottt]

I miss have missed that post, because nobody in this forum has come close to proving that the State and Local officials had complete sovereignty over this crisis. What I have seen is that the FEDS neglected to inform Governor Blanco as to its formal procedures in asking for federalizing of the NG and in the evacuation, planning and search and rescue phases

Um...first of all with regards to what FEMA did or didn't allow...heretofore all those accusations were made before the regular military was even in the State...even though this hasn't been cleared up...if it was the Louisiana Guard that turned them back...it is something that might have been attributed to the Fed just on the basis of it being a military operation...when in fact it was under the control of the State of Louisiana.

[Nbadan]

Ignorance of the Cons ution and States rights VS the Fed does not cons ute a scoffing.

Then show me where this was a states rights issue Whott. I have showed you why it was the FEDS responsibility. If you wanna act like the Homeland Security Department never existed before Katrina you go right ahead.

[whottt]

From the office of the Louisiana Attorney General:

Louisiana’s attorney general) said State law “clearly gives the mayor the authority to ‘direct and compel the evacuation of all or part of the population from any stricken or threatened area.’” Wartelle added: “They’re not confused about it. He had the authority to do it.” Either Nagin lied or he didn’t know. Neither speaks well to his expertise

As for the Govenor's authority...holy ...she's in charge of it right now, still, do you really need a link to this?

[Nbadan]

Um...first of all with regards to what FEMA did or didn't allow...heretofore all those accusations were made before the regular military was even in the State...even though this hasn't been cleared up...if it was the Louisiana Guard that turned them back...it is something that might have been attributed to the Fed just on the basis of it being a military operation...when in fact it was under the control of the State of Louisiana.

Then show me a link were its not just CNN, or Wolfe Blitzer doing a opt piece on this matter, and I'll show you 10 that say it was FEMA turning away local assistance

[whottt]

Then show me where this was a states rights issue Whott.

It's called the Consitution of the Unites State of America...The Federal Govenrment has no power over the States other than those granted to it in the Cons ution.

So what you need to do...is show me the section of the Cons ution that allowes the President's authority to Supercede that of the local and state governments...

Such measure do exist, under extremely extenuating cir stances...none of which were enacted. At least with regards to serving as law enforcement within the state. And I'd argue that in some cases it's not even possible for some of those measure to be enacted in the State of Louisiana.

I have showed you why it was the FEDS responsibility. If you wanna act like the Homeland Security Department never existed before Katrina you go right ahead.

You haven't shown me why it's the Fed responsiblity...you have shown me that that you don't even understand what the word Federalism means...

[Nbadan]

From the office of the Louisiana Attorney General:

As for the Govenor's authority...holy ...she's in charge of it right now, still, do you really need a link to this?

Don't act like a fool, whott. We've been through this time and time again. The FEDS should have federalized this crisis two weeks ago, but they didn't and after the fact, when W tried to pass the blame for this fiasco to Blanco, of course she balked.

[whottt]

Then show me a link were its not just CNN, or Wolfe Blitzer doing a opt piece on this matter, and I'll show you 10 that say it was FEMA turning away local assistance

None of which have been verified....I am not claiming I know the answer to who turned who away in that particular instance...all I know is that if it was indeed the Guard that did it...than they were acting under the Orders of the Govenor...not FEMA....FEMA has no authority over the Louisiana Guard.

[whottt]

Don't act like a fool, whott. We've been through this time and time again. The FEDS should have federalized this crisis two weeks ago, but they didn't and after the fact, when W tried to pass the blame for this fiasco to Blanco, of course she balked.

And therefore the FED was not in control of the situation...thank you very much...you have now kicked your own ass.

And just to be clear on this...Federalizing the Guard would not necessarily have given them the authority to serve as Law Enforcement....

[Nbadan]

Functions of Federal coordinating officer

In order to effectuate the purposes of this Act, the Federal coordinating officer, within the affected area, shall--

Quote:

1. make an initial appraisal of the types of relief most urgently needed;
2. establish such field offices as he deems necessary and as are authorized by the President;
3. coordinate the administration of relief, including activities of the State and local governments, the American National Red Cross, the Salvation Army, the Mennonite Disaster Service, and other relief or disaster assistance organizations, which agree to operate under his advice or direction, except that nothing contained in this Act shall limit or in any way affect the responsibilities of the American National Red Cross under the Act of January 5, 1905, as amended (33 Stat. 599) <36 U.S.C. §§ 1 et seq.>; and;
4. take such other action, consistent with authority delegated to him by the President, and consistent with the provisions of this Act, as he may deem necessary to assist local citizens and public officials in promptly obtaining assistance to which they are en led.;
5. State coordinating officer When the President determines assistance under this Act is necessary, he shall request that the Governor of the affected State designate a State coordinating officer for the purpose of coordinating State and local disaster assistance efforts with those of the Federal Government.

It's #4 right there, the requirement to "assist local citizens and public officials in promptly obtaining assistance to which they are en led," that places any blame the White House is trying to shift to Blanco squarely back on them. The federal government has advisory responsibilities under the Stafford Act. The "it's her fault because she didn't ask" excuse ignores the law.

Section 402 of the Stafford Act also states that the President may "provide techical and advisory assistance to affected State and local governments."

[whottt]

Assistance being the key word...Assistance...Assistance...

Yeah you can fault FEMA and the FED for not knowing the magnitude of the diaster...but you must also place that blame on State and Local Governments and their own EPO...in fact they deserve a greater portion of that blame...because it is their own backyard...not the FEDS.


Who is supposed to have a greater knowledge of New Orleans and Louisiana? The FED? Or the those governments? Who is supposed to have a greater knowledge of your personal life Dan? You? Or the Fed?

If the State and Local Authorities were incapable of adequately ascertaining the magnitude of the Storm how the is the FED supposed to do it better?

The FED is not the Government of the State of Louisiana and the City of New Orleans.

[Nbadan]

We can argue semantics all day, but the fact remains the same. The FEDS, some say purposely, neglected their responsibility by not informing Governor Blanco of her rights under the Stafford Act to be coach by public officials on the proper procedures to obtaining FED assistance.

[whottt]

Louisiana Att General is charging the owners of a nursing home with involuntary manslaughter...

It's W's fault.

[whottt]

We can argue semantics all day, but the fact remains the same. The FEDS, some say purposely, neglected their responsibility by not informing Governor Blanco of her rights under the Stafford Act to be coach by public officials on the proper procedures to obtaining FED assistance.

Ok...so blame the Fed because Blanco and Nagin are ty, ignorant, and incompetent leaders and they left them in charge and honored the intent of the cons ution...


I agree with you on that point...the Fed left a bunch of ups in charge...and it contributed greatly to this disaster.

But the point of this argument...is whether or not the Fed was or is totally in charge of this operation...and they aren't.

[SpursWoman]

Louisiana Att General is charging the owners of a nursing home with involuntary manslaughter...

those mother ers....out of all of the human atrocities I've heard so far, that one is in the top 2 that upset me the most. I hope they fry.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

This is a rumor with little basis in fact. Mayor Nagin insisted in an interview on Meet the Press that he never got a call from Amtrak officials willing to help. In fact, when he check on availability, all the raillines were occupied until October.

You are such a dumbass. It's been covered here, the offer was extended to the department of La. Homeland Security, an office that is run under Gov. Blanco's command.

The offer was never passed on to the mayor.

In fact, when he check on availability, all the raillines were occupied until October.

The last Amtrack train rolled out of NO at 2 PM Sunday afternoon. That left a good 8 hours before the weather deteriorated that they could have used the lines.

Haha, Dan talking about "rumors with little basis of fact." That description covers your entire history of posts on this forum.

[Nbadan]

Ok...so blame the Fed because Blanco and Nagin are ty, ignorant, and incompetent leaders and they left them in charge and honored the intent of the cons ution...


I agree with you on that point...the Fed left a bunch of ups in charge...and it contributed greatly to this disaster.

But the point of this argument...is whether or not the Fed was or is totally in charge of this operation...and they aren't.

Blaming the local officials for this is like blaming a 2 year old because his parents ed up. The FEDS were the only en y that had the resources to deal with a disaster of this magnitude.

[Nbadan]

You are such a dumbass. It's been covered here, the offer was extended to the department of La. Homeland Security, an office that is run under Gov. Blanco's command.

The offer was never passed on to the mayor.



The last Amtrack train rolled out of NO at 2 PM Sunday afternoon. That left a good 8 hours before the weather deteriorated that they could have used the lines.

Haha, Dan talking about "rumors with little basis of fact." That description covers your entire history of posts on this forum.

Only a moran would try and disprove a rumor with other rumors.

[Nbadan]

those mother ers....out of all of the human atrocities I've heard so far, that one is in the top 2 that upset me the most. I hope they fry.

Calm down SW, remember, there's plenty of blame to go around.

[Nbadan]

As long as we're busy pointing fingers and charging people with crimes, What about the crimes that led to the nightmare at the Superdome?

From part 2:

"The special needs area mainly contained people from local nursing homes. They included people who were wheelchair bound, delusional, diabetic and who had a wide range of other ailments and complications. Some were in an unresponsive vegetative-like state, while others needed constant oxygen supply and took wild, frightful gasps. Tuesday, when I came across the section, there were about 80 special needs persons. There were four health care providers who were quite literally overwhelmed with the situation.

I decided to help out and began taking orders from the health care professionals. There was a lot of confusion about how to assist the "patients," especially the unresponsive ones, as many were simply dumped at the Superdome and we did not know their names or care orders.

The people in the special needs section were given priority when evacuations from the Superdome first started. By Tuesday evening, all but 30 immobile special needs persons remained, and they were laid out on military issued cots.

Two highly dedicated and deeply concerned military nurses remained with the patients that evening. They told me something that sent shivers down my spine. They very somberly said they wanted to help me. So they informed me that after midnight, the generators were expected to fail and plunge the Superdome into unannounced pitch darkness. They added when that happened, the soldiers would withdraw because they would be incapable of maintaining order or defending themselves. The nurses urged me to find a hiding place inside the stadium or to head out in the waist-deep water that surrounded the Superdome and seek shelter elsewhere. That night, I kept pacing between the special needs area and the small concourse outside the Superdome. "

Link

[Vashner]

They city and state didn't want food and water into the dome. I am sure some charges will be filed against the gov and mayor and people at the state DHS office.

[Vashner]

We can argue semantics all day, but the fact remains the same. The FEDS, some say purposely, neglected their responsibility by not informing Governor Blanco of her rights under the Stafford Act to be coach by public officials on the proper procedures to obtaining FED assistance.

Translated from cry baby to Texan = I am giong to derail this thread cause I am loosing let's bash Bush yea!

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Only a moron would screw up the spelling of moron.

It's not a rumor, it's been reported numerous places. I don't see you linking your "he checked, the railways were booked for months" BS, but that doesn't stop you from claiming it as so.

Gotta love it. Liberal playbook 101: when punked in an argument, kick and scream about the source of the rebuttal, meanwhile claiming your own "facts" without even a hint of a source for them.

[Nbadan]

Only a moron would screw up the spelling of moron.

It's not a rumor, it's been reported numerous places. I don't see you linking your "he checked, the railways were booked for months" BS, but that doesn't stop you from claiming it as so.

Gotta love it. Liberal playbook 101: when punked in an argument, kick and scream about the source of the rebuttal, meanwhile claiming your own "facts" without even a hint of a source for them.

My source is Mayor Nagin himself. If you care to look over the transcript from this week's Meet the Press I'm sure you will be plenty satisfied. What is your source again?

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

WWLTV radio this morning, and it has already also been linked in this thread.

Until I see you prove otherwise, what I heard on the radio is just as legit as what you saw on Meet the Press.

And again, the story this morning was that the state screwed up the Amtrak situation, do you need a diagram on that one? No comprende?