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  1. #26
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    There is no issue with that. you can argue he outplayed both but got the award because Lebron lost. My issue is after they took his cookie he has proven incapable of exacting revenge for it. The true GOATS would make them dudes pay. I am not sure why he has not done so ... I know some will say because he plays the right way blah, blah. But this is not about THAT ... he needs to exert his will over a legit contender. Maybe next time he plays OKC he can dominate Durant and Westbrook. But right now his last 4 or 5 shots at Iggy/Kiwi he has not done so ,,,
    Agreed. He started out aggressive last night like he was going for 40/10/8 then he "let the game come to him" like a beta. Curry walking around with his rang, then came to your house and blows you our in front of Gloria James? A true alpha would have gone out swinging. Where was the fight? Where was the fire? No technical fouls, no flagrants, nothing but pushing 135lbs MVP to the ground.

  2. #27
    Magic 03' Spurs 99' ~O~'s Avatar
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    The commentators last night were such tools. Marv Albert, Webber, David Aldrige. They continuouslly and purposely deflected to save the Cavalier's image and LeBron's image. The Cavaliers are the NBA's team and money maker; manufactured and protected. They were continually deflecting about how awful the Cavs offense and defense was. Instead they would go on to make a statement like "wow, the Cavs have so much depth in Mo Williams and Richard Jefferson this year."(Chris Webber) or "Blatt said he felt great about the team not playing great today. Only if they played sooner such as Sunday". (Marv Albert)..."I respect LeBron and his grittyness (while down 35 points) and this cav team is a great team".(Chris Webber) "I like LeBron pushed Curry there, LeBron is such a tough player". That was definitely a classy play and a true sportsmanship play by LeBron. Definitely a player that should be heralded above all. I wouldn't be surprised if they were savoring the residue of LeBron splooge off their microphones. Jesus Christ.

    Delusion has almost become a sickness among the uninformed and the psychology here is to blind the uneducated and viewers who blindly follow the opinions of others.


    This is the reality of the Cavs team. They are mentally weak. All three of their top 3 best players are sub par defenders. Even LeBron who is actually awarded by the NBA to get away with things on defense. Their stats are skewed. They don't play legit defense and get away with non basketball plays (JR SMITH and IMAN SHUMPERT). Both these players hold and push the defender on screens with a heavy intent on injuring opponents. They are not great defenders in themselves just like they weren't in New York. They just have the "LEBRON PRIVILEGE". Blatant offensive fouls are also ignored when considering their guard's drives to the rim. The NBA limit's the Cavaliers opponents in order to save the Cavalier's and LeBron's image.

    Basic Consumerism psychology.

    The Cavaliers haven't had an offense for two seasons. Same cliche Lebron plays from high post and low post. Its either the high pick and roll at the wing or high post up at 15 feet under the wing. All leading to that corner pass for the patented bail out three by (insert player here). There's also the knack of having an offensive rebounder to bail out their poor shooting (tristan thompson) for second chance points just like the Heat had. Remember, Ray Allen's three was a second chance attempt. Its either desperation isolation Shumpert, Isolation irving, desperation isolation Smith, transition shot by "insert player name here" or luckily someone's open for a three.

    The mental midgets of the East could beat them if they had any shred of gumption, confidence, and will against the Cavs. None of the teams in the east have the depth and the offensive rating to beat the Cavaliers such as the Spurs and Warriors do. The only teams I see capable of doing so is Stan Van Gundy who is actually a mentally tough coach and extends that at ude outwards towards his players.

    Now for actual and factual stats. The Cavaliers are:

    - 17th in the league in field goal percentage, GSW 1, SAS 2
    - 10 in three point percentage, GSW 1, SAS 2
    - 12 in assists, GSW 1, SAS 3
    - 26th in blocks per, GSW 4, SAS 6
    - 26th in steals per, SAS 8, GSW 11

    Advanced & four factors

    - DefRTG, SAS 1, GSW 3, CLE 7
    - OffRTG, GSW 1, SAS 3, CLE 5
    - Interesting: 68% of golden state's shots are assisted on which projects great ball movement; AST% GSW 1 (68%), 5 SAS (61.9%), CLE 12 (59%)
    - AST RATIO GSW 1, SAS 2, CLE 10
    - Player Inpact Estimate SAS 1, GSW 2, CLE 5

    I won't go over the misc and opponent scoring. That's up to you guys but I did look at them. Golden State of course leads in fast break points; SAS is bottom ten. Sas has an advantage in points in the paint but not by much at all.

    San Antonio will have a rebounding edge against Golden State. Golden State takes advantage of points of turnovers and create fast break points easily off those opportunities.

    The NBA sort of screwed itself over by taking on advance stats. These are the same stats that expose the teams they want to win to fans who actually follow the analytics. Especially Kobe bryant.





    Curry has been the best player in the world and in the NBA two years now. The LeBron's "past dominance" is only relevant to people "holding on" for the past two years. Curry has done everything required to hold this position while others have faltered or have been deemed inadequate. Curry is the MVP already this season.

    Moving on to even more realism, the San Antonio Spurs Era is the longest era in sports history. This era won't ever end until certain players or characters within the organization dismiss themselves. Popovich and Duncan mostly.

    I personally can't wait for the real clash of ans.

  3. #28
    non-essential Chris's Avatar
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    I agree with the OP; Leonard is definitely the best player in the league right now.

  4. #29
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    The commentators last night were such tools. Marv Albert, Webber, David Aldrige. They continuouslly and purposely deflected to save the Cavalier's image and LeBron's image. The Cavaliers are the NBA's team and money maker; manufactured and protected. They were continually deflecting about how awful the Cavs offense and defense was. Instead they would go on to make a statement like "wow, the Cavs have so much depth in Mo Williams and Richard Jefferson this year."(Chris Webber) or "Blatt said he felt great about the team not playing great today. Only if they played sooner such as Sunday". (Marv Albert)..."I respect LeBron and his grittyness (while down 35 points) and this cav team is a great team".(Chris Webber) "I like LeBron pushed Curry there, LeBron is such a tough player". That was definitely a classy play and a true sportsmanship play by LeBron. Definitely a player that should be heralded above all. I wouldn't be surprised if they were savoring the residue of LeBron splooge off their microphones. Jesus Christ.

    Delusion has almost become a sickness among the uninformed and the psychology here is to blind the uneducated and viewers who blindly follow the opinions of others.


    This is the reality of the Cavs team. They are mentally weak. All three of their top 3 best players are sub par defenders. Even LeBron who is actually awarded by the NBA to get away with things on defense. Their stats are skewed. They don't play legit defense and get away with non basketball plays (JR SMITH and IMAN SHUMPERT). Both these players hold and push the defender on screens with a heavy intent on injuring opponents. They are not great defenders in themselves just like they weren't in New York. They just have the "LEBRON PRIVILEGE". Blatant offensive fouls are also ignored when considering their guard's drives to the rim. The NBA limit's the Cavaliers opponents in order to save the Cavalier's and LeBron's image.

    Basic Consumerism psychology.

    The Cavaliers haven't had an offense for two seasons. Same cliche Lebron plays from high post and low post. Its either the high pick and roll at the wing or high post up at 15 feet under the wing. All leading to that corner pass for the patented bail out three by (insert player here). There's also the knack of having an offensive rebounder to bail out their poor shooting (tristan thompson) for second chance points just like the Heat had. Remember, Ray Allen's three was a second chance attempt. Its either desperation isolation Shumpert, Isolation irving, desperation isolation Smith, transition shot by "insert player name here" or luckily someone's open for a three.

    The mental midgets of the East could beat them if they had any shred of gumption, confidence, and will against the Cavs. None of the teams in the east have the depth and the offensive rating to beat the Cavaliers such as the Spurs and Warriors do. The only teams I see capable of doing so is Stan Van Gundy who is actually a mentally tough coach and extends that at ude outwards towards his players.

    Now for actual and factual stats. The Cavaliers are:

    - 17th in the league in field goal percentage, GSW 1, SAS 2
    - 10 in three point percentage, GSW 1, SAS 2
    - 12 in assists, GSW 1, SAS 3
    - 26th in blocks per, GSW 4, SAS 6
    - 26th in steals per, SAS 8, GSW 11

    Advanced & four factors

    - DefRTG, SAS 1, GSW 3, CLE 7
    - OffRTG, GSW 1, SAS 3, CLE 5
    - Interesting: 68% of golden state's shots are assisted on which projects great ball movement; AST% GSW 1 (68%), 5 SAS (61.9%), CLE 12 (59%)
    - AST RATIO GSW 1, SAS 2, CLE 10
    - Player Inpact Estimate SAS 1, GSW 2, CLE 5

    I won't go over the misc and opponent scoring. That's up to you guys but I did look at them. Golden State of course leads in fast break points; SAS is bottom ten. Sas has an advantage in points in the paint but not by much at all.

    San Antonio will have a rebounding edge against Golden State. Golden State takes advantage of points of turnovers and create fast break points easily off those opportunities.

    The NBA sort of screwed itself over by taking on advance stats. These are the same stats that expose the teams they want to win to fans who actually follow the analytics. Especially Kobe bryant.





    Curry has been the best player in the world and in the NBA two years now. The LeBron's "past dominance" is only relevant to people "holding on" for the past two years. Curry has done everything required to hold this position while others have faltered or have been deemed inadequate. Curry is the MVP already this season.

    Moving on to even more realism, the San Antonio Spurs Era is the longest era in sports history. This era won't ever end until certain players or characters within the organization dismiss themselves. Popovich and Duncan mostly.

    I personally can't wait for the real clash of ans.
    Some interesting points but some of it contradictory. What does it matter that fellows like yourselves are taking a deep dive in analytics when the most famous announcer in the sport and his announcing team on the featured network for NBA games ignore them?
    And TNT is the best we have ESPN/ABC are worse.
    Sure it's fun to argue those things with hoop heads here just like it's fun to break down lyrics with the backpacker crew or movies with film buffs but neither group drives sales in those industries common fans do just like casual NBa fan does.

    That is why LeBron is still protected and Kobe gets voted in the ASG ... in the end most people dont care about this like we do. So i laugh at those that say Kobe wont be top 20 in 5 years or Lebron is old news because except in small circles that wont change anytime soon.

    For most part thread is right you win the last game you play. None of this matters to most.

  5. #30
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    Have you guys been living under a rock?

    Kawhi is the best SF & two-way player in the league while Curry is the best offensive juggernaut in the league. Durant is better than LeBron but his beta ass can't STILL outplay him head-to-head.#theservant

  6. #31
    non-essential Chris's Avatar
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  7. #32
    Your pain: it runs deep! Sybok's Avatar
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    It's silly i dont get this Kobe/LeBron connection. outside of being the best of the recent wing players since MJ ... they play differently. Different positions. pretty much different eras (with some overlap obviously). Lebron's greatness as NOTHING to do with Kobe's ... and Kobe's flaws and failures have nothing to do with James's.

    Both are found wanting when compared to Jordan. I just think some (including me) are surprised that LeBron's reign as the best player on the planet may be over and that he may be stuck at two rings forever.
    If he drops dead today due to complications of steroid use, or LenBiasitis ...he will be a all-time great.
    But two rings is wiltlike for a player of his caliber ... and there is a reason many place KAreem, MJ etc. over Wilt.
    Because they never saw Wilt play.

  8. #33
    Believe. Dancelot's Avatar
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    LeBron was pretty good in Trainwreck. I think the bar is low, his comp is Shaq/Penny in blue chips, Mj in Space Jam, GP, Kidd, David VC etc. in Like Mike. Out of hoopers he did probably the best work.

    On a related note I thought John Cena was funny and also not bad at his serious part in the movie ...

    LOL the Sybok troll doing the same thing he is accusing Kobe fans of.
    You forgot the Oscar worthy performance by Durant in thunderstruck

  9. #34
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Everyone said this last year too. When playoff Lebron doesn't step up then I will put dirt on that grave. People still don't see how he coasts now? He carried a ridiculous burden offensively & defensively for so many years that he can't do that night in, night out any longer.

    Yet after the playoff run (especially the finals), everyone saw the real Lebron yet again

  10. #35
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Everyone said this last year too. When playoff Lebron doesn't step up then I will put dirt on that grave. People still don't see how he coasts now? He carried a ridiculous burden offensively & defensively for so many years that he can't do that night in, night out any longer.

    Yet after the playoff run (especially the finals), everyone saw the real Lebron yet again
    We did. And then when it was winning time he faded. It could absolutely be due to fatigue ...how many players have ever made so many straight Finals? How many of those guys have carried the load James has? his greatness is indisputable. Saying Lebron may not be the best player on the planet anymore or not the GOAT is not like saying he sucks, isnt great etc. But as fan of hoops ... I am concerned that when he actually says before a game "he has plans for curry and company" and then goes out and puts up a 16 on 16 shots performance ... that is a concern. Beating up on the East in May wont mean much to me and shouldnt to him because we know he owns the east. he already has taken the best shots from PG, Rose, Jimmy Butler etc and surpassed them all. Same to Durant and even Kiwi in Round one. To re-assert himself as the best player today he should have a Lebron level game against Iggy or Kiwi when it matters.

    By the way just last week I was still calling him the best player Deeps, read my posts. that was right before the Spurs game ...but when you add this last performance to the one versus the Spurs... it is concerning. But of course you defended him then too ...
    Last edited by Killakobe81; 01-19-2016 at 05:17 PM.

  11. #36
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    Curry is pretty easily the best player in the NBA, I don't think many people would argue otherwise, tbh..

    Lebron was past his prime, last year, yet many people here and elsewhere tried to argue against it due to his raw counting stats and weak compe ion in the 2015 East..he has more miles on him than any player in league history in a 5-6 year stretch IIRC, and his style of play has been very demanding on his body..

  12. #37
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Sure, Curry is the best, but people acting like Lebron (esp regs season Lebron) is washed out are foolish. They will be a tough out in the finals (again) - esp if healthy.

  13. #38
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    Well, ya, a post-prime Lebron is still the 2nd best player in the NBA..

    Curry is a legendary player, no shame in being behind him, at this point..

  14. #39
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Curry is pretty easily the best player in the NBA, I don't think many people would argue otherwise, tbh..

    Lebron was past his prime, last year, yet many people here and elsewhere tried to argue against it due to his raw counting stats and weak compe ion in the 2015 East..he has more miles on him than any player in league history in a 5-6 year stretch IIRC, and his style of play has been very demanding on his body..
    great avvy love Mike Milligan. Dude was different but every bit as good as Thorton in Season one as the "foil" ... loved his dialogue.

    As for LeBron agree with all of that and have not called him washed up only have said what Harlem said and just added that it is official he wont be GOAT ... Deeps had an issue because I based it on these past two big games and end of last year's finals. And if you look back ...he wasnt very efficient (by his standards in last year's Finals) it was more a mix of Kobe and Magic tbh ...but I thought it was just wear and tear. But he hasnt done much to validate that. Again I saw him destroy the Celts and created a thread only about two months ago saying he was still the best.

    But national TV marquee match-ups do matter to me and it's harder to stay on that side of the argument with Curry and even Kiwi closing in ...

  15. #40
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    As far as "tough out" ... barring injury, I see no way LeBron can lead that team to a winning more than 1 or 2 games vs Spurs or Dubs. But out of my respect for James is that I dont see them getting swept. His best shot is to clinch the ECF early and then blitz the GSW/SAS winner early like they did the dubs last year.
    Last edited by Killakobe81; 01-19-2016 at 06:22 PM.

  16. #41
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    I would not say james is the second best player in the nba

  17. #42
    You have no idea UZER's Avatar
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    Curry is not the best player in the league. He has the deadliest skill by a long shot, but that doesn't make him the best player.

  18. #43
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    Curry is not the best all around players on gs
    Green is
    Curry best shooter

  19. #44
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    Well, ya, a post-prime Lebron is still the 2nd best player in the NBA..

    Curry is a legendary player, no shame in being behind him, at this point..
    On a game-to-game basis Kawhi/Durant perform better than LeBron since he has stopped putting any effort on defense like Kobe at the tail end of his prime. LeBron's best game is still better than Kawhi/Durant's but it seems like he can no longer takeover a series against a legit contender b/c he can't sustain it.

  20. #45
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    Curry is not the best all around players on gs
    Green is
    Curry best shooter
    Iggy is actually their best all around player. Draymond is a turnover machine & can't create his own shots in a half-court set like Iggy.

  21. #46
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    As for LeBron agree with all of that and have not called him washed up only have said what Harlem said and just added that it is official he wont be GOAT ... Deeps had an issue because I based it on these past two big games and end of last year's finals. And if you look back ...he wasnt very efficient (by his standards in last year's Finals) it was more a mix of Kobe and Magic tbh ...but I thought it was just wear and tear. But he hasnt done much to validate that. Again I saw him destroy the Celts and created a thread only about two months ago saying he was still the best.

    But national TV marquee match-ups do matter to me and it's harder to stay on that side of the argument with Curry and even Kiwi closing in ...
    Folks bring up the Finals as if it was an anomaly but ignore the Bulls series when he had a HEALTHY Kyrie against a beat-up Bulls team & shot 39% along with committing 27 turnover in 6 games. He was a buzzer beater away from being down 1-3 but he made the shot & the Bulls fell apart w/ Pau being injured while Rose eventually regressed to the point of being outplayed by Delly in the clincher (Kyrie got injured in Gm 6).

    Jordan had a better showing when he came out of retirement mid-season & didn't DOMINATE up to his standards in 95. Right now Bron is at best looking like 97-98 Jordan who was at the tail end of his prime.
    Last edited by Kawhitstorm; 01-19-2016 at 09:46 PM.

  22. #47
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    On a game-to-game basis Kawhi/Durant perform better than LeBron since he has stopped putting any effort on defense like Kobe at the tail end of his prime. LeBron's best game is still better than Kawhi/Durant's but it seems like he can no longer takeover a series against a legit contender b/c he can't sustain it.
    Your takes are really horrible man, SMH...

  23. #48
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    Your takes are really horrible man, SMH...
    Nobody asked you about Jamal Crawford's shot selection.

  24. #49
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    At times, It's just cringe worthy man, no offense.

  25. #50
    6X ST MVP
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    Another Kobe rider trying to semen shield their fallen hero.

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