Our mistake was believing Kawhi Leonard was Tim Duncan

[DPG21920]

To the OG posters, was Spurstalk around when Timmy almost went to Orlando? What was the reaction then?

I keep seeing this spouted as some defense of Kawhi and a few things:

1. Tim didn’t leave.

2. Tim sat down face to face with Pop to discuss things like a professional.

3. No one is mad at a free agent trying to look at their options; they are mad with snake behavior behind the scenes and creating locker room issues.

[ginobilized]

I started watching the NBA in 1976. I have seen a lot of players come and go. Many different types.
There is no one like Tim Duncan as a leader, teammate and compe or. Opponents had more respect for Tim than anyone I have seen. Rarely, and unsuccessfully, players would
try to mess with Tim. It never worked. Even Shaq said he was the only unbreakable foe he ever faced. It's not fair to compare anyone to Tim.

There has been so much media and social media spin on the Kawhi situation that it is hard to know what's real and what's not. Time usually tells.

As for Pop, he understood Tim well and built a successful system around him that has adapted as the game changed. He's a great coach. He's no Tim Duncan.
Pop is not made for the millennial generation, no doubt. However, I wouldn't underestimate Pop's strategic skills, smarts and outside the box thinking to pull one more rabbit out of his hat before he retires. He's done it before.
But it seems pretty apparent he either ed up or he read the writing on the wall early and was proactive about it. Either way, it sounds like a done deal.

[SpursDynasty85]

I honestly thought Kawhi was going to be a Tim Duncan type. No one knows the full story including us but if the Spurs expected a bit more loyalty from Kawhi, I dont blame them either. Kawhi is super passive and quiet and Spurs still had Duncan right there with a winning track record and reputation. It didn't help that Leonard's closest relative became ultra aggressive at a time when Spurs were handing out loyalty contracts, NBA free agents were making ridiculous unearned money, and finally their biggest sponsor (Jordan) says you're marketability sucks. Hurricane storm of events that no one could foreshadow I'm sure. Missed by management because the Big 3 were still so much the focus. Lessons learned it is time to probably move on. Spurs are still in good position to retool and try to compete.

[DPG21920]

It wasn't OUR mistake. It was POP's mistake.

He thought Kawhi would feel like Tim about Spurs...Tim always felt Pop as a father, a friend, and the Spurs are his family. That wasn't Kawhi's case.

Kawhi only wanted to become one of the best player in the world, he didn't want a new family.

If you watch videos of his few interviews, he always said he only wants to get better and help the team to win. If you hear him, unlike the Big3 talking about the Spurs as a family, Kawhi never said that.

Some people aren't willing to accept that Pop made a mistake but he already did it. He never read well Kawhi's situation and now the Spurs lost a top-5 player.

What a mistake! SA thought they had a leader and the coach wanted to be close to the player he coaches! What a monster!!!

[Brazil]

the comparaison between Kawhi and Duncan flirting with the idea to go Orlando is dumb... in what parallel universe Duncan faked a never ending injury and cut all relations with FO

[clambake]

move.

[MVPCues]

Tim is like Gandalf, who will rope in the minnions to achieve the main goal; Kawhi is like movie version of Saruman, he appears harmless at first, but was actually cohort with the devil Sauron all the time

Fixed it for you.

[DPG21920]

What’s really funny about people spouting off about “kawhi isn’t tim” and “when tim left there was a leadership void” is you realize what that means? People are saying that in DEFENSE of Kawhi but all that means is he is not a leader. Not being a leader, not being someone who can be a part of a team and build relationships is not a term of endearment or a defense.

[daslicer]

I never believed Kawhi was anything like Duncan. I think anybody who believed that really doesn't know how to read people and lacks awareness. Duncan was highly intelligent person evident by his degree in psychology from WF. Go read the chapter of a book Duncan wrote dealing with psychology to get an idea of how intelligent he is. Kawhi just strikes me as a dumb guy on the levels of Adam Sandler's water-boy character. It's funny how the media hypes of Kawhi to be intelligent simply because he's quiet but I see a guy who has no substance in any of his interviews. Duncan is an introvert but like others have said he was a very social person with his teammates. Kawhi on the hand is an introvert who has never reached out to any of his teammates and doesn't want to reach out to them. Like others have said Duncan had great leadership skills while Kawhi doesn't. Kawhi's fanboys will scream "Kawhi doesn't want to have relationships with his coach or teammates and just wants to play ball." well that's a sign of someone who can't lead. To be a leader you have to have relationships with you co-workers.

[RD2191]

Enjoy the lottery spurm fans.

[Brazil]

Enjoy the lottery spurm fans.

aren't you a spurm fan

[poop]

Some did make that mistake. I didn't. Tim is not a quiet guy. He just doesn't talk to the media. If you look on the sidelines, you could see how vocal Tim was, and how much he cared about his teammates. That was never Leonard. It doesn't make Kawhi a bad guy, but he's not Tim. No one is.

Good point

[daslicer]

Enjoy the lottery spurm fans.

I fine with that TBH the spurs can be a 10 win team for the next 30 years and it wouldn't phase me. Unlike you I was never a bandwagon fan so I could appreciate all the 5 les and what they meant. Those 5 les will last a lifetime for me.

[DPG21920]

Enjoy the lottery spurm fans.

We will - what do you have to enjoy in life?

[RD2191]

aren't you a spurm fan

I fine with that TBH the spurs can be a 10 win team for the next 30 years and it wouldn't phase me. Unlike you I was never a bandwagon fan so I could appreciate all the 5 les and what they meant. Those 5 les will last a lifetime for me.

We will - what do you have to enjoy in life?

[SuperCam]

aren't you a spurm fan

[daslicer]

right back at you.

[SPURt]

I keep seeing this spouted as some defense of Kawhi and a few things:

1. Tim didn’t leave.

2. Tim sat down face to face with Pop to discuss things like a professional.

3. No one is mad at a free agent trying to look at their options; they are mad with snake behavior behind the scenes and creating locker room issues.

I’m not defending Kawhi at all. I wanted to get a perspective on how the media and fans reacted to Tim’s free agency. The media cycle is much different now. I agree, to this point based on what we’re hearing from “sources”, Kawhi has conducted himself in a way less professional manner.

I was looking for hope that this may be journalist hype. It sounds like the media was packing Tim’s bags too.

[cutewizard]

I started watching the NBA in 1976. I have seen a lot of players come and go. Many different types.
There is no one like Tim Duncan as a leader, teammate and compe or. Opponents had more respect for Tim than anyone I have seen. Rarely, and unsuccessfully, players would
try to mess with Tim. It never worked. Even Shaq said he was the only unbreakable foe he ever faced. It's not fair to compare anyone to Tim.

There has been so much media and social media spin on the Kawhi situation that it is hard to know what's real and what's not. Time usually tells.

As for Pop, he understood Tim well and built a successful system around him that has adapted as the game changed. He's a great coach. He's no Tim Duncan.
Pop is not made for the millennial generation, no doubt. However, I wouldn't underestimate Pop's strategic skills, smarts and outside the box thinking to pull one more rabbit out of his hat before he retires. He's done it before.
But it seems pretty apparent he either ed up or he read the writing on the wall early and was proactive about it. Either way, it sounds like a done deal.

------------------------------------------------------------

[cutewizard]

I never believed Kawhi was anything like Duncan. I think anybody who believed that really doesn't know how to read people and lacks awareness. Duncan was highly intelligent person evident by his degree in psychology from WF. Go read the chapter of a book Duncan wrote dealing with psychology to get an idea of how intelligent he is. Kawhi just strikes me as a dumb guy on the levels of Adam Sandler's water-boy character. It's funny how the media hypes of Kawhi to be intelligent simply because he's quiet but I see a guy who has no substance in any of his interviews. Duncan is an introvert but like others have said he was a very social person with his teammates. Kawhi on the hand is an introvert who has never reached out to any of his teammates and doesn't want to reach out to them. Like others have said Duncan had great leadership skills while Kawhi doesn't. Kawhi's fanboys will scream "Kawhi doesn't want to have relationships with his coach or teammates and just wants to play ball." well that's a sign of someone who can't lead. To be a leader you have to have relationships with you co-workers.

------------------------------------------------

Agree.

[Pavlov]

It wasn't OUR mistake. It was POP's mistake.

He thought Kawhi would feel like Tim about Spurs...Tim always felt Pop as a father, a friend, and the Spurs are his family. That wasn't Kawhi's case.

Kawhi only wanted to become one of the best player in the world, he didn't want a new family.

If you watch videos of his few interviews, he always said he only wants to get better and help the team to win. If you hear him, unlike the Big3 talking about the Spurs as a family, Kawhi never said that.

Some people aren't willing to accept that Pop made a mistake but he already did it. He never read well Kawhi's situation and now the Spurs lost a top-5 player.

Kawhi's kind of pathetic tbh.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

It was all there for anyone to see.

Recall the times when Pop over the past 2-3 years talked about dumb stuff like "who cares about basketball, NASA found new planets today", or when they were on the losing streak last year and instead of figuring out how to stop it, Pop had them sit and watch videos about the civil rights movement, as if his $500/bottle of wine per night ass would know anything about the plight of minorities in this country.

Meanwhile, the press would ask Kawhi what he thought and he'd say he just wanted to keep improving and become the best basketball player in the world and win more les.

As much as Pop talks about players needing to get over themselves, Pop never got over himself or the idea that all of his players should march to the beat of his drum or else. Kawhi's had a singular focus and drive to be the best player in the world since he was drafted, and Pop was too busy virtue signaling to adjust how he handled Kawhi or the organization as a whole.

Not laying this all at Pop's feet, but how he's gone about his comments to the press and how he's handled the team since they won that le in 2014 is just tone deaf relative to Kawhi's focus.

[ducks]

think it would be best pop would just retire from coaching the spurs

[RD2191]

It was all there for anyone to see.

Recall the times when Pop over the past 2-3 years talked about dumb stuff like "who cares about basketball, NASA found new planets today", or when they were on the losing streak last year and instead of figuring out how to stop it, Pop had them sit and watch videos about the civil rights movement, as if his $500/bottle of wine per night ass would know anything about the plight of minorities in this country.

Meanwhile, the press would ask Kawhi what he thought and he'd say he just wanted to keep improving and become the best basketball player in the world and win more les.

As much as Pop talks about players needing to get over themselves, Pop never got over himself or the idea that all of his players should march to the beat of his drum or else. Kawhi's had a singular focus and drive to be the best player in the world since he was drafted, and Pop was too busy virtue signaling to adjust how he handled Kawhi or the organization as a whole.

Not laying this all at Pop's feet, but how he's gone about his comments to the press and how he's handled the team since they won that le in 2014 is just tone deaf relative to Kawhi's focus.

great post

[Pavlov]

It was all there for anyone to see.

Recall the times when Pop over the past 2-3 years talked about dumb stuff like "who cares about basketball, NASA found new planets today", or when they were on the losing streak last year and instead of figuring out how to stop it, Pop had them sit and watch videos about the civil rights movement, as if his $500/bottle of wine per night ass would know anything about the plight of minorities in this country.

Meanwhile, the press would ask Kawhi what he thought and he'd say he just wanted to keep improving and become the best basketball player in the world and win more les.

As much as Pop talks about players needing to get over themselves, Pop never got over himself or the idea that all of his players should march to the beat of his drum or else. Kawhi's had a singular focus and drive to be the best player in the world since he was drafted, and Pop was too busy virtue signaling to adjust how he handled Kawhi or the organization as a whole.

Not laying this all at Pop's feet, but how he's gone about his comments to the press and how he's handled the team since they won that le in 2014 is just tone deaf relative to Kawhi's focus.

What makes you think Pop wasn't always like this before 2014?

Doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Everyone seems to be dealing with this news with the aid of his own confirmation bias. I can only judge the actual actions or nonactions of Kawhi as weak sauce.