Agreed that is why the only solution I see.......... And this only will help with the "unintentional" mistakes not the overall choreographing of the game by the officials, is to simplify the game....... (I would say the about the NFL as well......)
The athletes have improved skills and some of these officials are like a hundred years old… So you have much more going on and @ a higher rate and then you exacerbate that with much more for them to watch for…
Its the bloody star treatment that gets under my skin. I hate it. I hate it.
I also hate how some refs buy the con job of yelling or groaning when going up for a basket. Kobe is the master of this. If I have to see one more constipation grunt <grrrraaaaaaaaaaa> trigger a whistle, I'm going to puke.
Good point of course, but how to "fix" the oh-so-humanness of the individual referee? It ain't gonna happen. Players must take responsibility to avoid too much controversy with the refs (commonly referred to as whining) and understand more clearly the personal bias of each ref so they can try and conform in some way. Isn't that how the world goes round and round?
Picking battles, ie., complaining much less (but complain, oh yes) about blatantly bad calls --not every friggin call--seems to get the respect of the human ref much more than constant whining.
What about this: attempting to attract the foul under the basket as opposed to making a legitimate play. If I were a ref these players would see my back hand often, but I digress.
In short, the refs are in charge, players need to deal with it. However, the league needs more Mark Cuban's to fight the good fight against poor officiating. Mark Cuban is just the wrong guy. Is the ref more likely to listen to, say Gary Payton as opposed to Ray Allen (or someone else with considerable respectability)? Ray Allen is more likely to get the next call than is Gary Payton (constant flapping jaw). Just human nature.
Since refs are small little Stern's, give them their due as being in charge and treat them respectfully on the court. THEN complain.
Well Good Morning pretty lady........
I hate that as well.......... Another thing I hate to see and they always get the call (see: kobe, Wade, etc...) Is the fake and get them in the air and then LEAN IN AND TAKE THE SHOT
Can you Spurs fans drop the whole Mav/Cuban hate thing for one thread? This could be a great discussion if you would leave your personal hate for Cuban aside. Why do some of you feel the need to turn every thread into a bashing of the Mavs thread, don't you already have enough of those?mav fan will cry when he failst o bring the city any championship trophy
Not sure I follow that........ Is that like studdering or something????cuban's a little
mav fan will cry when he failst o bring the city any championship trophy
Hey it's DA_MAN????
Fact is that basketball simply is a much more complicated game which has far more borderline activities going on. How many times have we even heard that players practice illegal moves. Saying basketball is the most poorly refereed sport is naive. It's also far and away the most difficult sport to referee.
Which is harder, 1. trying to see if someone's feet were set as they tried to take a charge, or 2. trying to see through a crowd of 12 people if a lineman is holding someone while dodging 280 pound men running full speed around you?
An example. On Nunn's show he commented that in post play you generally have one ref assigned to the guy with the ball and his defender. He said that there is so much going on upper body with arms that that the ref frequently won't be able to look down and catch that a guy has moved his pivot foot. Maybe if there are 10 refs on the floor, one assigned to each player, they can get all the calls right. Oh yeah and also get a couple of hundred turnovers and free throws too.
And in football you don't think they miss two or three holds a play?
I have heard that many times…..
“It is a game of finesse” ….
“This that and the other”
“It is to complicated”
Well they are the ones that made it complicated… Somehow fools @ the gym and street corners manage to “play a game” without all those complications………
That is why more is not better......
Less is better....... Less complication... Simplify the game……….
How often do you see lineman pleading their cases to the refs?
Then what are the point of even having the rules? Just call the holds and pass interferences when you feel like it? Same thing in basketball, travels need to be called and so do fouls, them are the rules. I don't care if it looks ugly and takes a year for the players in the NBA to readjust to actually playing by the rules. But there were way to many noncalls going on in the NBA for too many years, it is too bad that they let it go as far as they did. The handchecking, treavelling, and dislodging of the defender by backing him down with consecutive offensive fouls needed to go. And obviously the refs are human, and it will take them a while to adjust to calling the games differently, because it obvious that these changes were demanded from above. So I think that they will get better at it, and probably quit calling some of those ticky tack fouls.
I agree that the star treatment, and at the opposite end of the spectrum the rookie treatment, has gotten out of control and needs to be changed. I also think that the flopping needs to be taken care of, there is way too much of that going on.
I still believe that the officiating is worse in the NFL, maybe because it is easier to screw a team or help a team out with a bad call or nocall. I think that each call carris more weight in terms of the final outcome in football, so each call seems to be more important. I also think that the replay is nice, but it is ridiculous that they even miss calls on the replay, so if they continue to do so I would scrap the replay rule. Too many loose interpretation of the rules also.
Basketball and Football are IMO the hardest 2 sports to ref. I don't envy their jobs. Sometimes when I watch the games I still can't decide after seeing replay a couple of times what the right call is. It is a very hard job.
A foul is a foul, whether it happens two minutes into the first quarter, or with five seconds left in the game.I never thought the issue was as much whether Wade actually got fouled, but whether the officials should have called it at that point in the game.
You all argue for objective officiating, but then want them to consider time left and the score at the end of the game when deciding whether or not to call something. Make up your damn minds.
What part of simplify don’t you understand??? That does not infer do away with all the rules…
I care............
From above???? Would that be stern or God... Or are they one and the same???
Well you probably don't know that it use to be just the opposite... Yea thats right, calling every little foul..... The way you would like it to be..But there were way to many noncalls going on in the NBA for too many years, it is too bad that they let it go as far as they did
And you were not allowed to say a word back then either.......... And the complaining............ Well it didn't come "from above" but from the fans......... Tired of all the constant stopping of the game and the tic tac meaningless contact fouls that are just part of the game...
I think that it needs to be a happy medium between the way that Riley's Knicks played, and the calling of everything. I don't like exactly how it was called in the playoffs this year, but I like the fact that they are trying to call some things that they ignored for a long time. I saw more travels called this postseason that I did during the whole regular season, what a breath of fresh air that was. I saw lots of offensive fouls called for backing done the defender and trying to dislodge the defender, I liked that too. I saw them disallow hand checking, which I also liked to see. Like I said, it will definitely take some adjustment and the officials.
Sure I think that Stern is the reason for the new officiating, but so what? I know that he runs his league like a dictator, but I don't care because I think he does a great job. I believe that he always is looking out for the best interest of his league. He saw that changes needed to be made, and he made them. Too much contact was being called "incidental" contact, that in fact wasn't. Too many littles fouls were called, but can you imagine how difficult it is for the refs to adjust? I'm not going to about the timing of the changes. The changes helped the NBA more than it hurt the NBA.
I guess you have a problem with how Stern runs the NBA, but I personally believe that he might be the greatest commisioner in sports history. He saved this league back in the 80's, and no it wasn't all MJ, Magic, and Larry. Stern absolutely saved the league with the first salary cap, a tough drug policy, and much needed PR when he took over the league. He saved the NBA from near-bankruptcy and distinction.
Cuban is whiny .
Mathis is a convicted taxfraud whose son is on Cuban's payroll.
I didn’t either. Should be the same way as they do in the regular season…. Aaaahh well better then that but more consistent….lol
I agree about the traveling and backing (dislodging: see ShaQ) a defender but I strongly disagree about stern……. I don’t think he is interested in the game, the players or the fans except how it effects the bottom line… Thus the preferential treatment for the stars… The Michael Jordan effect for raising revenue….
I think it was not stern….>>>> but MJ that saved the NBA...... I guess I could give some credit to $tern for leeching off his success as a means to pimp the league…He saved this league back in the 80's, and no it wasn't all MJ, Magic, and Larry. Stern absolutely saved the league with the first salary cap, a tough drug policy, and much needed PR when he took over the league. He saved the NBA from near-bankruptcy and distinction.
And the salary cap............???? Today’s solutions are tomorrow’s problems....
I am sure the people in New York miss the good O’ days……. I wonder what happens to all that money that goes over the cap???
It is your opinion that stern is the NBA messiah, that’s fine……. I on the other hand see him simply as the greedy miser that believes all this league needs is a new dress policy and more celebrities to exploit and make some money on…….
And perhaps you think I am a bit harsh on your Messiah but keep in mind he is his position solely to make money…. Not the betterment of mankind…
EXACTLY!
When refs refuse to call the late foul consistantly it does appear to be unfair when they do call it. The no-call foul can decide the outcome of a close game -- which is exactly what the refs try to avoid by not calling the foul.
Nah, you can't just toss that out there and hope no one calls you on it. What are tomorrow's problems as you see them caused by the CBA?And the salary cap............???? Today’s solutions are tomorrow’s problems....The luxury tax money goes back to the teams.I wonder what happens to all that money that goes over the cap???Nah, he's just the best sports commissioner today. Not that the bar is set too high.It is your opinion that stern is the NBA messiahBut Cuban is out there for the betterment of mankind?keep in mind he is his position solely to make money…. Not the betterment of mankind…
Cuban is in his position to:
1) Serve his ego.
2) Win a championship.
In that order, as #2 accomplishes #1.
that's the keyword. Consistently. I didn't have a problem with them calling a foul at that point in time. But if you make that call on one end, make it on the other. And if you make a call like that time in that game, make it in other games. I am pretty damn sure that in close games that go down to the wire throughout the regular season and the playoffs, you had more blatant touching than what you seen in game 5 but did not get a call for reasons we all are led to believe they don't call those type of fouls at the end of games.!
When refs refuse to call the late foul consistantly it does appear to be unfair when they do call it. The no-call foul can decide the outcome of a close game -- which is exactly what the refs try to avoid by not calling the foul.
That's where the inconsistency comes in which leads to many frustrations for basketball fans. It's been going on for years and sadly, it's getting worse.
Even still, not suggesting that the "no-call" is fair, because it really isn't. Leaves it up to the discretion of the ref which is unfair. Is there such a thing as a discreet foul--only one FT? Ermmm, no. Like AHF says, a foul is a foul is a foul, and they all should be called, even during the final moments. Gives no room for disparity and keeps players honest also.
Certain calls should never be called, such as when Tony Parker had a fistful of Dirk's jersey in the closing seconds of game 4 or 5 I believe. I call like that shouldn't decide the game, and I'm glad they didn't call it. I still don't think the call Wade got at the end of the game was a fair one either. A game shouldn't be decided with free throws because of a ticky tac call.
I guess my point is that ALL fouls should be called, regardless of time lapse. I remember that jersey pulling foul, was a desperation end-of-the-game foul that should be paid attention to, in my book of "End Of The Game Very Fair Rules". Pull on my jersey and I deserve to be at the line shooting for my team no matter what the time clock says.
And that foul to Wade was a pushing foul, saw the pic from behind and there was definitely pressure. Plus Dirk is a wimp and deserved the call, lol...
How bout guaranteed contracts???? I guess you love those, I know Houston, Webber, Marbury, Grant and Jerome James do..
Age limit??? Who’s business is that all of a sudden??
I guess you can show me where I said that about Cuban>???
Cuban is in his position to:
1) Serve his ego.
2) Win a championship.
Why I would guess every owner could confess to some of that…. Add a few bucks into the mix and a fella could have fun with a job like that…..
And while I am @ it let me mention a few more things ….
I don’t like people being fined because they say $tern and his employees are not doing a good enough job………
I don’t like his pompous ass telling other people how to dress……. Especially when they are wearing the gear his league sells…………
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