Pacers' Stojakovic becomes free agent

[NBA Junkie]

are you really this dumb? webber got traded for nothing because he has a bad knee, plays no defense and he makes brad millers jumping ability look like jason richardson. plus hes nothing but a jumpshooter and he even shoots threes. can you understand that? i hope so

Do you honestly believe the Kings got the best available deal when Webber was dealt to Philly? You're out of your in' mind.

Of course, this is coming from the same guy who thinks that the Wolves are just going to give away Kevin Garnett for Brad Miller, Kenny Thomas, and Bonzi Wells. Kevin McHale may be idiotic, but he also realizes that Garnett is still a valuable piece to a teams success.. Now I'll just sit back and wait for your come back with some lame ass about how the Wolves are better off with the junk that you're proposing because their team is poor.

You sure you're not really Ron Artest? You share the same irrational thoughts he has.

[trueD]

Do you honestly believe the Kings got the best available deal when Webber was dealt to Philly? You're out of your in' mind.

Of course, this is coming from the same guy who thinks that the Wolves are just going to give away Kevin Garnett for Brad Miller, Kenny Thomas, and Bonzi Wells. Kevin McHale may be idiotic, but he also realizes that Garnett is still a valuable piece to a teams success.. Now I'll just sit back and wait for your come back with some lame ass about how the Wolves are better off with the junk that you're proposing because their team is poor.

I never thought much about comparing Web to Garnett, but the hard truth is neither have won a ring - despite Web having an opportunity in 2002 with talented players around him and KG in 2003, both are league veterans with heart. Web was unable to make players around him better, despite his individual talent. Don't know if that applies to KG or not.

The biggest difference between Web & KG is most teams would be willing to pay the 20 mil for KG.

As for Peja becoming free agent, it's laughable that he can miss multiple games with a pinky injury, miss the last four games of the P.O.'s with a knee injury that "is fine" now and believe he "will get his big payday" immediately following. His value has dropped oodles in the last two years because of his whiney hurt arse and lack of true compe ive spirit, imo. I defended him right up until he missed those crucial games with Indiana in the P.O.'s. Sad times. The player with no heart spoke and hopefully others listened.

P.S. Can't ever remember him missing games in Sac because of a knee problem, anyone else?

Phoney Phaker.

[DirkAB]

Web was unable to make players around him better, despite his individual talent. Don't know if that applies to KG or not.

How do you say that? Webber before he hurt his knee was an elite player in the NBA, he made those around him better. Either you don't remember how good he was, or you just didn't appreciate how good he was, either way it's a shame.

[trueD]

How do you say that? Webber before he hurt his knee was an elite player in the NBA, he made those around him better. Either you don't remember how good he was, or you just didn't appreciate how good he was, either way it's a shame.

Guess I'm still pissed.

He had an opportunity to make others better when his knee was bummed by deferring and distributing from the top (since he couldn't bang down low anymore). We weren't gonna win the championship but he could have scored big points in that respect, possibly keeping his place in Sacramento. I loved Web's game pre-injury, but his ego on the court was Kings' undoing post injury, imho.

His "eliteness" only got us so far, and like Minnesota big bucks were expended on the hope he would make a difference, other than just putting Sacramento on the "elite" side of the NBA for a short time. That was nice and all - howevr two Divisions and one WC champs just wasn't doing it for me anymore. And it wasn't going to get any better.

Then comes the Peja for Artest trade, we just plain got lucky there.

[TheSanityAnnex]

That entire Kings team back then made eachother better. That is what the whole scheme of the Princeton is based on; moving the ball to get your teammate an easy shot ie: making your teammates better.

[DirkAB]

Guess I'm still pissed.

He had an opportunity to make others better when his knee was bummed by deferring and distributing from the top (since he couldn't bang down low anymore). We weren't gonna win the championship but he could have scored big points in that respect, possibly keeping his place in Sacramento. I loved Web's game pre-injury, but his ego on the court was Kings' undoing post injury, imho.

His "eliteness" only got us so far, and like Minnesota big bucks were expended on the hope he would make a difference, other than just putting Sacramento on the "elite" side of the NBA for a short time. That was nice and all - howevr two Divisions and one WC champs just wasn't doing it for me anymore. And it wasn't going to get any better.

Then comes the Peja for Artest trade, we just plain got lucky there.

In other words, Webber is your scapegoat for not winning the championship. Honestly, that is exactly what that sounds like, and it isn't fair to him.

BTW, the Kings were still a better team with an injured Webber than what they have been ever since. How was this possible with such a gimped up ego-maniac? He made those around him better, period.

[trueD]

BTW, the Kings were still a better team with an injured Webber than what they have been ever since. How was this possible with such a gimped up ego-maniac? He made those around him better, period.

Stat time!

2003/2004 regular season:

39-19 (67%) pre Web return
12-12 (50%) post Web return

2004/2005 regular season:

34-20 (63%) pre Web trade
16-12 (57%) post Web trade

Most notable is the drop in in wins of 17% in 2003/2004 upon Web's return, coupled with the rise of losses by 6% after Web was traded, totalling 11% total improvement without Web in the lineup, post injury.

[Bob Lanier]

That doesn't mean that he didn't make the players around him better; just that he disrupted the rhythm of a timing-oriented team by changing the offensive scheme.

Make no mistake; he was and is a gimped-up egomaniac, but he did make things easier for a number of players.

[DirkAB]

Stat time!

2003-2004 regular season:

39-19 before Web's return on March 2 (42%)
12-12 after Web's return on March 2

2004-2005 regular season:

Is that Webber's fault? Or Adelman's for not easing him into the lineup, or yanking him out of the game when he disrupted the team? Good Lord, I hope Webber wasn't picking his own minutes or running the show, that is what a coach is for.

[trueD]

Stat time!

2003/2004 regular season:

39-19 (67%) pre Web return
12-12 (50%) post Web return

2004/2005 regular season:

34-20 (63%) pre Web trade
16-12 (57%) post Web trade

Most notable is the drop in in wins of 17% in 2003/2004 upon Web's return, coupled with the rise of losses by 6% after Web was traded, totalling 11% total improvement without Web in the lineup, post injury.

Here's the stats I promised.

[trueD]

That doesn't mean that he didn't make the players around him better; just that he disrupted the rhythm of a timing-oriented team by changing the offensive scheme.

Make no mistake; he was and is a gimped-up egomaniac, but he did make things easier for a number of players.

But did Web have a right to change the offensive scheme simply so he could be "worked" into the lineup?

Kings offensive scheme was working s until Web came back. Peja was lighting it up and having the best season of his career - All NBA 2nd teamer, All Star, and I think the seasons highest scorer for much of the first half.

Peja ended the year with 24.2/6.3/2.1. In 2004/2005 Peja was 20.1/4.3/2.1. Last year before he left Sac 16.5/5.3/1.7.

Say it was because he played less and less games, doesn't matter. The decline is apparent. Peja was relegated to "stand on wing and wait" status while Web and Bibby (never Adelman, imo) held the control of the teams offensive scheme. Could it be Peja's lack of touches was a direct result of his success post Web's return in 2003-2004? Everything kinda points to Web withholding passing the ball (along with Bibby) in 2004/2005 also. Not a conspiracy, a resentment...if you will. "Soft Peja can't touch this..."

Mr. Egomaniac ruined not only his own future opportunity with the Kings but also Kings opportunities by not spreading the offense and instead holding/shooting the rock from 15 feet. Peja's opportunities? Those were Peja's responsibility, but until Web returned no one had any problems setting screens and getting the ball to Peja.

[DirkAB]

But did Web have a right to change the offensive scheme simply so he could be "worked" into the lineup?

Kings offensive scheme was working s until Web came back. Peja was lighting it up and having the best season of his career - All NBA 2nd teamer, All Star, and I think the seasons highest scorer for much of the first half.

Peja ended the year with 24.2/6.3/2.1. In 2004/2005 Peja was 20.1/4.3/2.1. Last year before he left Sac 16.5/5.3/1.7.

Say it was because he played less and less games, doesn't matter. The decline is apparent. Peja was relegated to "stand on wing and wait" status while Web and Bibby (never Adelman, imo) held the control of the teams offensive scheme. Could it be Peja's lack of touches was a direct result of his success post Web's return in 2003-2004? Everything kinda points to Web withholding passing the ball (along with Bibby) in 2004/2005 also. Not a conspiracy, a resentment...if you will. "Soft Peja can't touch this..."

Mr. Egomaniac ruined not only his own future opportunity with the Kings but also Kings opportunities by not spreading the offense and instead holding/shooting the rock from 15 feet. Peja's opportunities? Those were Peja's responsibility, but until Web returned no one had any problems setting screens and getting the ball to Peja.

Get over it!!!!! You see it all the time in the NBA a players stats go up in the absence of another player, and then back down when they return. So what! You can't blame Webber, do you think that the Kings were going to do anything in the playoffs without Webber? No, they wouldn't have, and every single analyst said the same thing, to have any kind of a chance in the playoffs the Kings will need Webber back. So do you think that Webber should have sat the rest of the season out? Do you think that he was the one coaching the team? Deciding his minutes and the offense? Don't you suppose that Adelman should catch some of your criticism?

What is this crap, hands across America for poor Peja? Peja benefitted from having Webber on his team as much as anybody else on the team, and if you don't believe that to be the case look at what happened to him when Webber left, He couldn't even average 20. Maybe Peja shouldn't have gotten all butt hurt about the Webbers comments after the 2004 playoffs, he acted like a sensitive little girl and demanded a trade. That hurt the Kings more than anything Webber ever did.

I can't believe you hang all of that bull on Webber, not fair.

[trueD]

Get over it!!!!! You see it all the time in the NBA a players stats go up in the absence of another player, and then back down when they return. So what! You can't blame Webber, do you think that the Kings were going to do anything in the playoffs without Webber? No, they wouldn't have, and every single analyst said the same thing, to have any kind of a chance in the playoffs the Kings will need Webber back. So do you think that Webber should have sat the rest of the season out? Do you think that he was the one coaching the team? Deciding his minutes and the offense? Don't you suppose that Adelman should catch some of your criticism?

What is this crap, hands across America for poor Peja? Peja benefitted from having Webber on his team as much as anybody else on the team, and if you don't believe that to be the case looked what happened to him when Webber left, He couldn't even average 20. Maybe Peja shouldn't have gotten all butt hurt about the Webbers comments after the 2004 playoffs, he acted like a sensitive little girl and demanded a trade. That hurt the Kings more than anything Webber ever did.

I can't believe you hang all of that bull on Webber, not fair.

Yeah I blamed Adelman for his sloppy integrating of Webber when he returned. If I thought Adelman was really the one running things, he could be my spacegoat, but I don't believe he was. Remember the one game Webber was pulled? The pulling, and subsequently the pouting, never happened again.

When Webber left, how many times did Bibby, who became solely responsibility for running the offense, get the ball to Peja? You saw it, we all saw it...don't deny it.

Peja is a wimp but he can shoot better than most. The only real weapon he has was removed by his own teammate(s) who would not find him. What I really care about is winning. Peja could score points.

Webber had no right to call anyone out, imo. Bad juju, and his calling out of a teammate immediately after the Game 7 loss was like him taking a on team morale. And probably was a big reason Vlade left too.

How many ways can I blame him?

[DirkAB]

Yeah I blamed Adelman for his sloppy integrating of Webber when he returned. If I thought Adelman was really the one running things, he could be my spacegoat, but I don't believe he was. Remember the one game Webber was pulled? The pulling, and subsequently the pouting, never happened again.

When Webber left, how many times did Bibby, who became solely responsibility for running the offense, get the ball to Peja? You saw it, we all saw it...don't deny it.

Peja is a wimp but he can shoot better than most. The only real weapon he has was removed by his own teammate(s) who would not find him. What I really care about is winning. Peja could score points.

Webber had no right to call anyone out, imo. Bad juju, and his calling out of a teammate immediately after the Game 7 loss was like him taking a on team morale. And probably was a big reason Vlade left too.

How many ways can I blame him?

So now Webber ran Vlade out too? Wow, if we listened to you we would be under the impression that Webber was the worst thing that ever happened to this franchise! But the truth is, he the greatest thing that ever happened to the Kings! He put them on the map, he made them contenders, and he made them relevant to the NBA. Obviously it was more than just Webber, like the other players, Adelman, and Petrie. But can you deny that Webber was the biggest piece to the puzzle? Is there any doubt?

I know your style, it is to hang it all on the best player. You were did it with Webber, then Bibby after Webber left, and if you haven't already started with Artest, you will.

[DirkAB]

BTW, Vlade didn't resign with the Kings because they didn't offer him nearly as much money as the Lakers did. Had nothing to do with Webber. It was that jerk Petrie, man I wish we had Vlade sitting on our bench all gimped up those last 2 season of his career.

[trueD]

So now Webber ran Vlade out too? Wow, if we listened to you we would be under the impression that Webber was the worst thing that ever happened to this franchise! But the truth is, he the greatest thing that ever happened to the Kings! He put them on the map, he made them contenders, and he made them relevant to the NBA. Obviously it was more than just Webber, like the other players, Adelman, and Petrie. But can you deny that Webber was the biggest piece to the puzzle? Is there any doubt?

I know your style, it is to hang it all on the best player. You were did it with Webber, then Bibby after Webber left, and if you haven't already started with Artest, you will.

Tsk Tsk Tsk. Resorting to insults never wins the argument.

Webber did an amazing job putting Sacramento on the map and I'm glad (read GLAD) he was on the Kings, although I said from the beginning Kings shouldn't pay him all that god-awful money, even when he was in his prime. But yes, Kings needed a star to make them legitimate and Webber was that. WAS that. We didn't give up on him when we traded him, we gave up on the idea that he could still lead us anywhere.

Yes I criticized Bibby because he wasn't playing team ball and had all but ABANDONED the princeton. He won't play defense either. We can't win when our PG won't run plays and especially when he won't include anyone who can shoot into the offense. Adelman was a non-factor, imo.

Can you deny that Peja's shooting wasn't a piece of the puzzle as well and Kings gave up on Peja with Bibby at the helm, can you deny that?

[trueD]

Gotta git off my butt so signing off now.

xoxo BAkrid

[DirkAB]

Tsk Tsk Tsk. Resorting to insults never wins the argument.

Webber did an amazing job putting Sacramento on the map and I'm glad (read GLAD) he was on the Kings, although I said from the beginning Kings shouldn't pay him all that god-awful money, even when he was in his prime. But yes, Kings needed a star to make them legitimate and Webber was that. WAS that. We didn't give up on him when we traded him, we gave up on the idea that he could still lead us anywhere.

Yes I criticized Bibby because he wasn't playing team ball and had all but ABANDONED the princeton. He won't play defense either. We can't win when our PG won't run plays and especially when he won't include anyone who can shoot into the offense. Adelman was a non-factor, imo.

Can you deny that Peja's shooting wasn't a piece of the puzzle as well and Kings gave up on Peja with Bibby at the helm, can you deny that?

It wasn't an insult, it was an observation. You put all the blame at the best player feet. Maybe you shouldn't always look to one person to point the finger at, it is a team sport.

Of course Peja's shooting was a piece of the puzzle, but you can't blame his lack of production on Bibby either. Bibby was never the guy that got the ball to Peja, that was Webber, Vlade, and Christie to a lesser extent. So when those guys were gone, so were Peja's opportunities. Plus when the team changed Bibby became responsible for a larger share of the scoring load, he had to become more of a scorer. If the Kings didn't have Bibby they wouldn't have even made the playoffs this last season, he carried in a number of games when they were slumping.

[RON ARTEST]

Do you honestly believe the Kings got the best available deal when Webber was dealt to Philly? You're out of your in' mind.

Of course, this is coming from the same guy who thinks that the Wolves are just going to give away Kevin Garnett for Brad Miller, Kenny Thomas, and Bonzi Wells. Kevin McHale may be idiotic, but he also realizes that Garnett is still a valuable piece to a teams success.. Now I'll just sit back and wait for your come back with some lame ass about how the Wolves are better off with the junk that you're proposing because their team is poor.

You sure you're not really Ron Artest? You share the same irrational thoughts he has.

how many teams were intersted in webbers huge contract and horrible knee? if this wasnt the best available deal then petrie wouldnt have done it. hes a way better gm then your TERRIBLE team will ever have . and i dont want KG anyway because after i thought about it for a while we would be giving up alot of depth and our bench would be worse then the T-wolves if thats even possible. like i said the kings will win 50 or more games next year so how are they not better off without his bad bad bad defense?

[DirkAB]

like i said the kings will win 50 or more games next year so how are they not better off without his bad bad bad defense?

Well, they couldn't have both Miller and Webber on the same team. I'd rather have Webber than Miller right now. I personally think that Miller is the much softer defender, I think he might be the worst in the league. Plus, Miller doesn't have the offensive game that Webber does, it's not like his offense is as good as his defense is bad. Webber's offense at least makes up for the bad D.

[NBA Junkie]

how many teams were intersted in webbers huge contract and horrible knee? if this wasnt the best available deal then petrie wouldnt have done it. hes a way better gm then your TERRIBLE team will ever have . and i dont want KG anyway because after i thought about it for a while we would be giving up alot of depth and our bench would be worse then the T-wolves if thats even possible. like i said the kings will win 50 or more games next year so how are they not better off without his bad bad bad defense?

We're just going to have to disagree on Webber.

I'll tell you that had the Kings waited until last off-season to trade Webber, they would have fielded and gotten much better offers. IMO, it's better than making a mid-season trade which is done in kneejerk fashion as opposed to having the offseason to ponder and reconstruct a team accordingly.

[NBA Junkie]

Does anyone think he'll get offered more than the MLE by a team other than the Pacers? I don't think so. That's why I believe he re-signs with Indy.

[DirkAB]

Does anyone think he'll get offered more than the MLE by a team other than the Pacers? I don't think so. That's why I believe he re-signs with Indy.

MLE exception???? Are you insane? He'll sign for close to double that. Were you joking? Or are that clueless?

[NBA Junkie]

If he does sign for close to $10 mil, it'll be with the Pacers. I just don't see another team breaking the bank to sign this guy.

Atlanta? Toronto? Maybe. They have the most money to spend. Chicago does too, but they are already deep at the 3 spot and I expect them to make a play for a 5 or a 4 in free agency since rebounding is their biggest need.

I'm going to sound even more insane by suggesting that Al Harrington will attract more interest than Stojakovic since Harrington has a better interior game of the two.

Stojakovic just hasn't been the same player he was since about March of 2004 when he was putting up All-Star numbers during Webber's injury. He certainly hasn't done much since to justify a hefty contract. His performance over the last 3 postseasons has been uneven. His injury in the NJ series killed his chances even more. His stock has never been as low as it is now.

If he returns to form, it'll be with the Pacers, who figure to spend the most to retain his services. No disrespect.