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  1. #26
    Retired Ray xrayzebra's Avatar
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    You honestly think Bush would have just stepped aside if the roles had been reversed? You know nothing about politicians.The thing about that is, there's no way to tell if an election was stolen by rigging the electronic voting machines. If you are happy and perfectly satisfied with that, you are an even bigger fool than I knew you to be.
    Well, first off, Bush didn't step aside when then election was attempted to
    be stolen FROM him. He fought and won.

    Secondly, machines, all of them, can be rigged. Optical readers, which are
    used can be rigged, I am sure you knew that. And the old mechanical voting
    machines could be rigged. So what is the point. Ballot boxes have been
    stuffed since they started having elections. You can only hope enough
    honest people are at the polls that you get. And this crap about paper
    trails. What a joke. Even when they were all paper ballots, counted by
    hand and kept for however many days. The elections were rigged.

  2. #27
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    You honestly think Bush would have just stepped aside if the roles had been reversed? You know nothing about politicians.
    Well, the most recent Republican example we have is 1960. In an election clearly stolen by the Democrats, Nixon let it go -- for the sake of the country.

    No, Gore set a new precedent for how low politicians will stoop to attempt to steal an election. You have nothing on which to base your characterization so, you defend Gore with the tired-old-Bush-woulda-done-it-too.

    The thing about that is, there's no way to tell if an election was stolen by rigging the electronic voting machines. If you are happy and perfectly satisfied with that, you are an even bigger fool than I knew you to be.
    No, I'd prefer there to be a paper trail created by the damn things. But, the point is, you don't see any Republicans claiming a Diebold conspiracy and, even if one were to start today, it would have been eclipsed by Nbadan's pre-scandal proclamation.

  3. #28
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Well, first off, Bush didn't step aside
    No , dummy.
    Secondly, machines, all of them, can be rigged.
    And you are happy with that, dummy.

  4. #29
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Well, the most recent Republican example we have is 1960. In an election clearly stolen by the Democrats, Nixon let it go -- for the sake of the country.
    @ using Nixon 40 years ago to prove a point about Bushy.
    No, Gore set a new precedent for how low politicians will stoop to attempt to steal an election. You have nothing on which to base your characterization so, you defend Gore with the tired-old-Bush-woulda-done-it-too.
    Not a defense. An observation. If you feel Bush would be a quitter, fine. That's your mischaracterization.
    No, I'd prefer there to be a paper trail created by the damn things. But, the point is, you don't see any Republicans claiming a Diebold conspiracy and, even if one were to start today, it would have been eclipsed by Nbadan's pre-scandal proclamation.
    So you're happy with the distinct possibility (however unlikely -- or is it?) that the Democrats DID steal the elections by rigging the machines and you never knew and never will know it happened.

  5. #30
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    Nixon only stepped aside publically not privately.

  6. #31
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Nixon only stepped aside publically not privately.
    And everyone lived happily ever after.

  7. #32
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    Did the Northsiders in this election stay home or did Ciro do uncommonly well there?

  8. #33
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    Nixon only stepped aside publically not privately.
    Really, so what did he do privately? Because, I believe all states certified their votes in that election and there was no hand-wringing over whether or not the House would have to settle the election or if Texas or Illinois would have to send two slates to Washington, etc...

    The fact remains, whatver "private" efforts Nixon may have made to set the record straight, the nation was unaware and the election was settled peacefully and amicably.

    The Idiot, I mean Gore, actually conceded and then took it back.

  9. #34
    Retired Ray xrayzebra's Avatar
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    No , dummy.And you are happy with that, dummy.

    Obviously you aren't! But since you are so damn smart and smug, why
    don't you come up with a solution and make yourself a cool billionaire.

    You are all talk and no go. Come on do something about what you are
    moaning about. But be forewarned, a bunch of politicians, on both sides
    of the aisle, might want to oppose your efforts.

  10. #35
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    @ using Nixon 40 years ago to prove a point about Bushy.
    Okay, ChunkDunker, if you would have read the post, it was the most recent example of how a losing candidate dealt with a contested election. I can't help that every losing Presidential candidate between Nixon and Dole handled their losses with dignity and grace or that all the elections between 1960 and 2000 were pretty much uncontested.

    Not a defense. An observation. If you feel Bush would be a quitter, fine. That's your mischaracterization.
    No, I just don't believe he would have been so self-absorbed as to cause a cons utional crisis over the Presidential election.

    So you're happy with the distinct possibility (however unlikely -- or is it?) that the Democrats DID steal the elections by rigging the machines and you never knew and never will know it happened.
    No, but I don't think arguing over a past election will solve the issue. Plus, there is nothing but conspiracy theories to suggest there is anything untoward occurring. The biggest argument (that Republicans would steal the election using rigged Diebolds) pretty much went down in flames.

    I'm not accusing the Democrats of stealing the election. In fact, I applauded them, right after the election, for targeting the right 26 districts and 6 states.

    I merely stated I would prefer the machines leave a paper trail so they can be validated. I'd like to be able to see my vote in print.

  11. #36
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    No politician would have stepped aside after what happened in Florida. If things were reversed Bush, Baker and the clan would have fought tooth and nail

  12. #37
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    No politician would have stepped aside after what happened in Florida. If things were reversed Bush, Baker and the clan would have fought tooth and nail
    I disagree. Didn't we just have a Senate race that ended in a virtual tie but, yet, the Republican candidate conceded?

    Just because your politicians can concede gracefully don't expect all politicians don't see the greater good to keeping the electoral system, flawed as it is, intact.

  13. #38
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    House Win Adds Insult to Injury for DeLay

    By Sylvia Moreno and Chris Cillizza
    Washington Post Staff Writer and washingtonpost.com Staff Writer
    Thursday, December 14, 2006; A04

    AUSTIN, Dec. 13 -- Former congressman Ciro Rodriguez's victory in a House runoff election Tuesday in Texas not only allowed Democrats to pick up their 30th seat of the 2006 elections but served as a final rebuke to one of the architects of the Republican House majority: Tom DeLay.

    The former congressman from Texas was the mastermind of a 2003 redrawing of congressional lines in the state that led to the removal of six House Democrats in the 2004 elections.

    Two years later, DeLay's fortunes have suffered a near-total reversal, as the redistricting map that once seemed certain to cement his legacy and GOP majorities for years has instead led to the end of that career and may well be a building block for a reenergized Democratic Party in the state.

    On Nov. 7, a Democrat won the seat vacated by DeLay, and on Tuesday, Rodriguez defeated seven-term Rep. Henry Bonilla in the runoff in Texas's 23rd District. With nearly all precincts reporting in the state's largest district, Rodriguez had won 54 percent of the vote to Bonilla's 45 percent.

    "The genius of Tom DeLay is now seriously in question," said Cal Jillson, a political science professor at Southern Methodist University. He added that the overall result of the DeLay-led redistricting plan was, "at best, a wash for Texas."

    Asked about the effect of the plan, DeLay flashed a bit of the hardball rhetoric that made him both famous and infamous. "The redistricting plan was quite successful -- after all, it made a political has-been out of Martin Frost," he said, referring to his longtime Democratic nemesis, who lost to Rep. Pete Sessions in 2004.

    Frost was one of four Democratic congressmen defeated in that year's general election. Two others lost in a primary or chose not to run for reelection.

    DeLay has begun his own blog, TomDeLay.com, aimed at building a home for conservatives on the Internet as well as rehabbing his somewhat tarnished reputation. The blog logged 150,000 page views in its first days.

    If DeLay decimated Democrats in 2004, he also seems responsible for their revival. He was forced to resign as House majority leader after his indictment by a grand jury in Travis County, Tex., in connection with the alleged funneling of illegal corporate contributions into state legislative races. This past April, he announced that he would not seek reelection. Former congressman Nick Lampson, a victim of the Republican-led redistricting, claimed DeLay's seat.

    The Supreme Court struck another blow to DeLay when it ruled that portions of the map he devised were in violation of the Voting Rights Act. That decision forced the redrawing of Bonilla's district to include thousands more Hispanic voters.

    Even so, Bonilla nearly avoided a runoff when he won 49 percent of the vote on Nov. 7. Six Democrats and an independent split the remainder, with Rodriguez, who had held the neighboring 28th District from 1996 until 2004, leading the pack with 20 percent.

    Phil Ricks, Bonilla's campaign spokesman, cautioned against reading too much into the race, saying that "if not for some voter confusion," the congressman would have won without a runoff.

    But Democrats would have none of it, insisting that Rodriguez's win on Tuesday coupled with DeLay's departure signal a new day for the party in the state. Matt Angle, a former senior strategist for Frost, said that Democrats are looking to 2010 to break the Republican lock on statewide offices.

    As for DeLay, Angle offered a bitter assessment. "Before this election, DeLay was in the grave with dirt on top of him," he said. "This is a final repudiation of DeLay's arrogance and bullying ways."

    Cillizza reported from Washington.

  14. #39
    keep asking questions George Gervin's Afro's Avatar
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    House Win Adds Insult to Injury for DeLay

    By Sylvia Moreno and Chris Cillizza
    Washington Post Staff Writer and washingtonpost.com Staff Writer
    Thursday, December 14, 2006; A04

    AUSTIN, Dec. 13 -- Former congressman Ciro Rodriguez's victory in a House runoff election Tuesday in Texas not only allowed Democrats to pick up their 30th seat of the 2006 elections but served as a final rebuke to one of the architects of the Republican House majority: Tom DeLay.

    The former congressman from Texas was the mastermind of a 2003 redrawing of congressional lines in the state that led to the removal of six House Democrats in the 2004 elections.

    Two years later, DeLay's fortunes have suffered a near-total reversal, as the redistricting map that once seemed certain to cement his legacy and GOP majorities for years has instead led to the end of that career and may well be a building block for a reenergized Democratic Party in the state.

    On Nov. 7, a Democrat won the seat vacated by DeLay, and on Tuesday, Rodriguez defeated seven-term Rep. Henry Bonilla in the runoff in Texas's 23rd District. With nearly all precincts reporting in the state's largest district, Rodriguez had won 54 percent of the vote to Bonilla's 45 percent.

    "The genius of Tom DeLay is now seriously in question," said Cal Jillson, a political science professor at Southern Methodist University. He added that the overall result of the DeLay-led redistricting plan was, "at best, a wash for Texas."

    Asked about the effect of the plan, DeLay flashed a bit of the hardball rhetoric that made him both famous and infamous. "The redistricting plan was quite successful -- after all, it made a political has-been out of Martin Frost," he said, referring to his longtime Democratic nemesis, who lost to Rep. Pete Sessions in 2004.

    Frost was one of four Democratic congressmen defeated in that year's general election. Two others lost in a primary or chose not to run for reelection.

    DeLay has begun his own blog, TomDeLay.com, aimed at building a home for conservatives on the Internet as well as rehabbing his somewhat tarnished reputation. The blog logged 150,000 page views in its first days.

    If DeLay decimated Democrats in 2004, he also seems responsible for their revival. He was forced to resign as House majority leader after his indictment by a grand jury in Travis County, Tex., in connection with the alleged funneling of illegal corporate contributions into state legislative races. This past April, he announced that he would not seek reelection. Former congressman Nick Lampson, a victim of the Republican-led redistricting, claimed DeLay's seat.

    The Supreme Court struck another blow to DeLay when it ruled that portions of the map he devised were in violation of the Voting Rights Act. That decision forced the redrawing of Bonilla's district to include thousands more Hispanic voters.

    Even so, Bonilla nearly avoided a runoff when he won 49 percent of the vote on Nov. 7. Six Democrats and an independent split the remainder, with Rodriguez, who had held the neighboring 28th District from 1996 until 2004, leading the pack with 20 percent.

    Phil Ricks, Bonilla's campaign spokesman, cautioned against reading too much into the race, saying that "if not for some voter confusion," the congressman would have won without a runoff.

    But Democrats would have none of it, insisting that Rodriguez's win on Tuesday coupled with DeLay's departure signal a new day for the party in the state. Matt Angle, a former senior strategist for Frost, said that Democrats are looking to 2010 to break the Republican lock on statewide offices.

    As for DeLay, Angle offered a bitter assessment. "Before this election, DeLay was in the grave with dirt on top of him," he said. "This is a final repudiation of DeLay's arrogance and bullying ways."

    Cillizza reported from Washington.

    Poetic justice? Karma? Whatever it was this election cycle sure was SWEET! I can't explain how happy I am that Tom DeLay lost and that his 'redistricting' pplan failed..

    Of course since the Supreme Court said it was ok for state legislatures to redraw boundries whenever they felt like it the State GOP could push for more redistricting...

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