Ludden: White waits patiently for time with Spurs

[bigfan]

Ive got a feeling we will be seeing lots more of White later this season and certainly into the next season. He's got too much of an upside to let go, I think this guy is a sure keeper (as opposed to Ian and the others).

[mardigan]

SJax needed a lot of work before he got regular minutes, and he turned out to be pretty good, even without the atheticism White has. I really do hope this guys gets a roster spot next year with regular minutes

[Borosai]

Indiana releasing him was probably the best thing to ever happen to him in his young NBA career. Right now its advantage white, because of the players that he's surrounded with. Hopefully he takes it and runs with it for his future whether if its with or with out the spurs.

I was thinking the same thing. Being on the Spurs, surrounded by solid veterans with zero off-the-court problems is much more advantageous for White than being on the Pacers (especially earlier in the year) with troubled characters like Jackson, Tinsley and maybe even J.O. Hopefully it works out.

[Fabbs]

Finley is a great locker room guy. There was a story earlier in the season about him disciplining Jackie Butler and running extra laps with him after practice....and now this. He is a positive veteran influence to these young guys with alot to learn. Why are you ing on him?

yeah i read how the whole team was snickering at the more or less joke. Guess Findawg could not have influenced him to work out after he was signed in June? The laps really had an effect on him, as surely you remember the posted article about a Spur going down with a twisted ankle and Tim Duncan having to ask Butler 3 Xs to help carry him off the court. Butler sat on his ass on the bench while other Spurs including Duncan helped him limp off the court. Real influence by Finley.

BTW, since Fin was told to let loose and not hesitate to take his shot, those 2-10 nights show up far less often....in case you missed the 9-12 performance the other night

Are you serious? Finley has been told by Pop "to let loose and not hesitate" and that any and all misses would have no consequences since day 1 as a Spur. We are now 130 freakin games into Findawg. Yes i saw his 9-12 stats. Once every 40 games he does this. Woopie Doo. I guess i expect more from a 19 million a year player who was brought over primarily to shoot. Real leadership would have been going to Pop a long time ago and saying for gods sake let White play in place of me while i work my bricks out. He comes over from Dallas with zero les, has the same declining deficiencies Mavs fans have seen since 2002, shoots 30%* and steals minutes yet is supposed to be some uber "leader"?
*T-Park disclaimer he had a few good games vs Dallas in playoffs for sure.

ManuTim_best of Fwiendz

But it's true. Bynum did get more minutes than White and he was pretty raw his first year. But he was a first round draft pick. And getting mentored by Kareem. And we're seeing that pay off now.

And the mentoring by Fins?

[mardigan]

Why the are you hating on Finley so much? He has played better and is a great locker room guys, no snide little remarks by you are going to take that away.

[Fabbs]

Why the are you hating on Finley so much? He has played better and is a great locker room guys, no snide little remarks by you are going to take that away.

I'm not hating on him, but I'm not propping him up to some ridiculous false glory status either.

The bar is Championship to me, not rah rah ooohh that was great hearing Mike Finley play some psuedo leadership role. Dallas loses him and gets past the Spurs. Period. Address what i wrote about Finleys alleged great locker room presense and influencing Butler.

Yes it seems the return to leather ball is helping him. Goodie goodie. Stop the pampering of this 19 mil a year guy and lets get down to does he or does he not help the Spurs get a le?

Since the thread is as relates to White, was it really neccessary for Findawg to be eating minutes in his 100-150th games as a Spur while White "had" to sit? Okay maybe it did do him good in the NDBL. But to sit him during the losing streaks while Finley Beans Horry etc all got big minutes? Spare me.

[mardigan]

I'm not hating on him, but I'm not propping him up to some ridiculous false glory status either.

The bar is Championship to me, not rah rah ooohh that was great hearing Mike Finley play some psuedo leadership role. Dallas loses him and gets past the Spurs. Period. Address what i wrote about Finleys alleged great locker room presense and influencing Butler.

Yes it seems the return to leather ball is helping him. Goodie goodie. Stop the pampering of this 19 mil a year guy and lets get down to does he or does he not help the Spurs get a le?

Well then yes, I believe he does help us win a le, although I guess that is yet to be seen. Maybe Im just holding out hope that he hits a game winner in a pivitol game 5 against Dallas in Dallas

[AFBlue]

yeah i read how the whole team was snickering at the more or less joke. Guess Findawg could not have influenced him to work out after he was signed in June? The laps really had an effect on him, as surely you remember the posted article about a Spur going down with a twisted ankle and Tim Duncan having to ask Butler 3 Xs to help carry him off the court. Butler sat on his ass on the bench while other Spurs including Duncan helped him limp off the court. Real influence by Finley.

Finley showed leadership and has great work ethic. If Butler chooses not to follow his example it's Butler's fault...not Finley's. My point was to suggest that Finley has great work ethic and has worked to become a veteran influence on this club. Care to dispute?

Are you serious? Finley has been told by Pop "to let loose and not hesitate" and that any and all misses would have no consequences since day 1 as a Spur. We are now 130 freakin games into Findawg. Yes i saw his 9-12 stats. Once every 40 games he does this. Woopie Doo. I guess i expect more from a 19 million a year player who was brought over primarily to shoot. Real leadership would have been going to Pop a long time ago and saying for gods sake let White play in place of me while i work my bricks out. He comes over from Dallas with zero les, has the same declining deficiencies Mavs fans have seen since 2002, shoots 30%* and steals minutes yet is supposed to be some uber "leader"?
*T-Park disclaimer he had a few good games vs Dallas in playoffs for sure.

First off, he hasn't been that $19M player in a few years, let alone the $38M he would've cost the Mavs as they were over the lux tax, so to hold him to some salary standard is rediculous. He came to the Spurs as a role player and should be thought of as such...not some $20M superstar. He was brought over because he CAN provide instant offense, but also because he's a good locker room guy, and a decent defender. He brings added depth to the Spurs squad.

I also find it funny that you choose to ignore his improving play over the season and categorize his decent games as "one in 40". He's shooting 46% from the field in March and has had only one really ty game in that stretch (@ NJ, 2/12).

And the reason Pop tells him to pull the trigger is that he's a rythm shooter that can't miss when his shot starts falling...he's also the only player other than Horry that can take a shot with a hand in his face...a valuable trait. Yet you'd rather have a guy who's played all of 15 minutes in a blowout win?

[TDMVPDPOY]

First off, he hasn't been that $19M player in a few years, let alone the $38M he would've cost the Mavs as they were over the lux tax, so to hold him to some salary standard is rediculous. He came to the Spurs as a role player and should be thought of as such...not some $20M superstar. He was brought over because he CAN provide instant offense, but also because he's a good locker room guy, and a decent defender. He brings added depth to the Spurs squad.

i still havnt seen that 'instant offense' your talkin about, if his instant than = GODmode

[AFBlue]

He put up 20 points in 20 minutes off the bench just two days ago...how's that not instant offense?

[AFBlue]

3 Mar @Hou...14pts in 18min on 6/11

[AFBlue]

9 Feb (orl)....18pts in 23min on 7/10

[rocyaice]

I'm not hating on him, but I'm not propping him up to some ridiculous false glory status either.

Who's asked for Finley to recieve props? Reading this thread you came out of no where knocking Finley for praising James White. Because he doesn't have the menality of a loser? That's something a loser would do. Sit on the bench and not earn your pay check. Fin is out there playing his ass off and has contributed to many wins this year as a Spur. I could care less what Fin's stats look like just as long as he shows up in the post season. And the way he's playing as of a late it looks as if he's gearing up.

[Fabbs]

2 games this season?
Now post Barrdogs stats. Both last years playoffs esp vs Kings but also Mavs.

Finley showed leadership and has great work ethic. If Butler chooses not to follow his example it's Butler's fault...not Finley's. My point was to suggest that Finley has great work ethic and has worked to become a veteran influence on this club. Care to dispute?

Then why mention the laps incident with Butler. Just a small one after practice sidepoint that's had no bearing on Butlers season. Spurs already had and have a ton of veteran leadership. We did not need to bring it in. It's not like Finley is the only one. If he is helping White with off court at ude, great. I see no quotes from White on Fins, however.


ChumpDumper, PhatTony etc

To save $17 more million, sure

Cuban couldn't care less about saving money to help get a Mavs le. If he thought Finley would have helped, he would have spent the lux tax money.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Finley said he has seen White take off from the free-throw line and put the ball between his legs before flushing it through the rim. He also claims White can throw down a two-handed dunk from the foul line.

"Nobody's seen that," Finley said.

Except for the people who watched the college dunk contest last year...

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Take the Finley bashing to a new thread. Damn.

[ambchang]

FYI PHAT Tony, Fabbs also thinks Horry and Kerr are surefire HoFers.

[Fabbs]

Take the Finley bashing to a new thread. Damn.

Hey latecomer, back off.
The article said White may soon again be banished to the bench. Hence several of us ask "why not White in Findawg reduced?"

But yes, let us rejoice in the dunkage and upside that is James White.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Anyone else think that White looked like he's been hitting the weightroom pretty hard?

[AFBlue]

2 games this season?

Nice bit of sarcasm. I guess I should've added an "etc." to clarify to the less intuitive posters that those were two of MANY examples this season.

Spurs already had and have a ton of veteran leadership. We did not need to bring it in. It's not like Finley is the only one. If he is helping White with off court at ude, great. I see no quotes from White on Fins, however.

So it's bad to have too many professional, hard-working veterans? I don't get your logic. About the no-quotes from White, see the reference to the entire article dedicated to Fin's professionalism, work ethic, and mentorship...you need White's quotes to validate his veteran worth to this team?

ChumpDumper, PhatTony etc

Cuban couldn't care less about saving money to help get a Mavs le. If he thought Finley would have helped, he would have spent the lux tax money.

I refuse to believe that Cuban would have cut Finley outright if he wasn't given the incentive of not having to pay the luxury tax on his enormous salary. You think he would've been cut regardless?

[T Park]

Except for the people who watched the college dunk contest last year...

wich isn't many.

[AFBlue]

Interestingly enough, John Hollinger wrote a piece on the "Worst Contracts" and Finley was right up there....only,his contract was deemed worst in reference to the Mavs. Read below...

1. Michael Finley, Mavericks ($16.1 million)
Contrary to what you might think, the worst-case contract scenario isn't paying a lot of money to a guy who can't play. It's s ing out for a guy who can play and then waiving him, allowing him to sign a below-market contract with your closest rival for the championship. That's the case for the Mavs, who are paying Finley superstar money to try to beat them as a Spur. Blame the luxury tax amnesty rule, which offered the Mavs so much savings that they couldn't afford not to cut Finley.

Note, Fabbs, the last statement (bolded)

[Taco]

i hope James White is active and get's to play tonight

[Fabbs]

Note, Fabbs, the last statement (bolded)

That was written prior to the season.
Whatever Cubans reasons, here is what John Hollinger wrote after the season.

Michael Finley
2005-06 season: Waived by Dallas via the luxury-tax amnesty rule, Finley found a soft landing in San Antonio. Unfortunately, his play continues to head downhill. Finley established new career lows ... (The rest is for pay only. I'm not paying for what i already know.)

Tying this into White, and going back to the very beginnings of Finley, my understanding was he was going to be a 10-15 minute guy who was happy to fulfill his role on the Spurs and get a le shot. How that translates into 37 minutes per game vs Dallas is something he and Pop should be held accountable to. Barry shot 74% fga vs Kings including a crucial game winner, bouncer or not. Finley 53% in equal minutes.
While Fins picked it up vs Dallas he still didn't shoot as well as Barry. Not that Barry was the answer vs Mavs, his inbounds snafu was gagging.
Point being Pops use of personell can and should most certainly be questioned. Post Finley it's 1-0 Mavs, pure and simple with Pop deciding to ride Findawg 37 minutes per in the elimination series.

That having been said PhatTony and all, maybe the Spurs FO and Pop know more about White. Maybe he sniffs coke like an anteater and his rehab counseler suggested that increased NBA minutes and fame could be deadly to him. It's just a thought.

[AFBlue]

That was written prior to the season.
Whatever Cubans reasons, here is what John Hollinger wrote after the season.

Michael Finley
2005-06 season: Waived by Dallas via the luxury-tax amnesty rule, Finley found a soft landing in San Antonio. Unfortunately, his play continues to head downhill. Finley established new career lows ... (The rest is for pay only. I'm not paying for what i already know.)

Tying this into White, and going back to the very beginnings of Finley, my understanding was he was going to be a 10-15 minute guy who was happy to fulfill his role on the Spurs and get a le shot. How that translates into 37 minutes per game vs Dallas is something he and Pop should be held accountable to. Barry shot 74% fga vs Kings including a crucial game winner, bouncer or not. Finley 53% in equal minutes.
While Fins picked it up vs Dallas he still didn't shoot as well as Barry. Not that Barry was the answer vs Mavs, his inbounds snafu was gagging.
Point being Pops use of personell can and should most certainly be questioned. Post Finley it's 1-0 Mavs, pure and simple with Pop deciding to ride Findawg 37 minutes per in the elimination series.

That having been said PhatTony and all, maybe the Spurs FO and Pop know more about White. Maybe he sniffs coke like an anteater and his rehab counseler suggested that increased NBA minutes and fame could be deadly to him. It's just a thought.

Sorry Fabbs...here's the link and the quote...note the bolded date

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insid...dContracts0607

Updated: March 28, 2007


The 25 worst contracts in the NBABy John Hollinger
ESPN Insider
Archive

CATEGORY I: ALREADY WAIVED

These players are still getting paid by their former teams, even though a couple of them haven't suited up in ages. A few others are double dipping, cashing checks from both a former team and a current one.



1. Michael Finley, Mavericks ($16.1 million)
Contrary to what you might think, the worst-case contract scenario isn't paying a lot of money to a guy who can't play. It's s ing out for a guy who can play and then waiving him, allowing him to sign a below-market contract with your closest rival for the championship. That's the case for the Mavs, who are paying Finley superstar money to try to beat them as a Spur. Blame the luxury tax amnesty rule, which offered the Mavs so much savings that they couldn't afford not to cut Finley.

I actually agree with you that playing Finley 35 minutes...with most of those minutes coming at the small ball 4 spot was/is a huge mistake. Still, I think he's more effective at the two positions James White would be used in...