Why the Spurs dealt Scola for virtually nothing

[Tek_XX]

Ha "the mole"

I wouldn't have thought about that until this trade was made. I love conspiracy theories.

[whottt]

Even after being able to digest it for a couple days, it still feels and looks like a horrible trade. You don't give a divisional rival a free gift. There's no excuse for that.

If the Spurs really, really needed to save money, they should have done something like Barry and a first rounder to the Sonics/Bobcats/Warriors for a second rounder. Then you ship Scola to the highest bidder (not the Lakers, Dallas, Phoenix or Houston). Even if that's a second round pick, you'd basically end up trading two second round picks and $8M in savings for a fist round pick.

You don't salary dump a player making 40% of what Barry makes to a divisional rival and include Scola as part of the package. I don't think Scola would have been a great fit on the Spurs, but he's going to be a good scorer. In Europe, he scored more per minute than Ginobili did.

If Adelman almost won a championship with Chris Webber, he can do something with TMac and Yao, with Scola scoring when those two guys start feeling the pressure.

Two years from now, this is going to look like a horrendous trade.

Don't you think if $$$$ was the primary motivation, Barry and Beno would have been the first guys they moved? Who makes more money? Barry does...he makes as almost as much as Butler/Scola and Bonner/Oberto combined.


Don't you think if $$$ was the primary motivation, Butler would be here instead of Bonner?

Don't you think if Scola was better than Oberto, he'd be here and Oberto wouldn't?

I think Scola actually signed for less than Oberto.


Lots of bad takes here built around one underlying premise....people wanted more than the Spurs could get.



Did you really want Scola in Chicago or Cleveland instead of Houston?

I don't... sending him to the Bulls...


You rather Bulter sits here and does for a season after Pop doghouses him, instead of brining Ian over?


You rather have Butler riding the IR in our roster slot instead of Ime Udoka?




You are Marcus Bryant are pulling off some of the worst takes about the Spurs FO the last two seasons...I have ever seen you guys have.




Hey...Elson signing? Scorboard. We just won an NBA le...ditto Oberto.

You guys keep calling them out as penny pinchers...except they keep being right, and they are winning les.


Last offseason disaster was an NBA le...

Scoreboard.


Bad takes.

[timvp]

If the Spurs go ahead and sign Udoka (which I hope they do), that'll just make this trade look even dumber. What they would have done is made a desperation salary dump ... and then bring in even MORE salary.

So then when it's all said and done, you couldn't even really call it a salary dump

Udoka was my number one option of reasonable free agents this summer, but even I would rather have waited it out. This time next year Butler's contract is done, Scola's contract with Tau is done and the Spurs would have the full MLE to sign a Bowen replacement in a much deeper free agent market.

Udoka is good but if the Spurs really made this trade to make room for him, that's even dumber than all the Jason Kidd shenanigans. At least Kidd is a Hall of Famer. Udoka is Devin Brown without as good of an offensive game with the ability to show up for practice on time.

If you wait until next summer, there is no way that you lose anything. Scola was bluffing about signing a long-term contract in Europe. He waited five years ... waiting one more year to become a free agent was nothing. You give Butler more playing time and another year to get in shape and he'd no doubt raise his trade value.

Salary dumping Barry or staying status quo while signing someone like Jumaine Jones were both hugely more logical moves.

Who the would ever salary dump a guy making half the MLE for a second round pick, while using arguably the best European prospect as bait? I'm trying to rationalize what the Spurs did but it makes no sense.

[Marcus Bryant]

Even after being able to digest it for a couple days, it still feels and looks like a horrible trade. You don't give a divisional rival a free gift. There's no excuse for that.

If the Spurs really, really needed to save money, they should have done something like Barry and a first rounder to the Sonics/Bobcats/Warriors for a second rounder. Then you ship Scola to the highest bidder (not the Lakers, Dallas, Phoenix or Houston). Even if that's a second round pick, you'd basically end up trading two second round picks and $8M in savings for a fist round pick.

You don't salary dump a player making 40% of what Barry makes to a divisional rival and include Scola as part of the package. I don't think Scola would have been a great fit on the Spurs, but he's going to be a good scorer. In Europe, he scored more per minute than Ginobili did.

If Adelman almost won a championship with Chris Webber, he can do something with TMac and Yao, with Scola scoring when those two guys start feeling the pressure.

Two years from now, this is going to look like a horrendous trade.

How about just eating the cost instead of making the deal? I don't get how it's some kind of stretch to expect the Spurs to do that. The championship window realistically has maybe 2 seasons left. Why not do what you can to bring in the best talent today? You think Scola won't fit. You don't know that. At $2.8 mil per for 3 years, bring him in now. You have Horry, Barry, Finley, Udrih, and Elson coming off the books next summer. That's close to $17 mil. Butler too if you had kept him.

[ploto]

I don't trust a writer who does not even know not to split his infinitives.

[Marcus Bryant]

You know what, whotttt? I'd rather the Spurs sat on Scola and Butler than gift them both to the Rockets. I'd rather see Scola sign another 10 year deal with Tau than be dumped for a 2nd round pick to someone else in the division.

The Spurs got greedy with this trade.

[ShoogarBear]

You know what, whotttt? I'd rather the Spurs sat on Scola and Butler than gift them both to the Rockets. I'd rather see Scola sign another 10 year deal with Tau than be dumped for a 2nd round pick to someone else in the division.

Yep.

[Marcus Bryant]

We can search for the hidden meanings within this trade, talk of conspiracy and moles, but at the end of the day, when Ian Mahinmi and Tiago Splitter are brought in each will cost one-fourth of what Jackie Butler and Luis Scola each will cost this next season, and that is why Butler and Scola are gone.

[whottt]

I think the Spurs are going to make at least a token effort to bring Vaginis over and if they can...

Barry(assuming Udoka signs) and Beno are gone.


Barry and Beno are easily movable at any point this season...you guys want to get desperate and throw them away...not only when their value isn't as high as it will be....

But also before you even have a clue if we have suitable replacements waiting in the wings.


Just say for a second Lindsey said...why not let me try to sign Vaginis to replace Beno...if we can we can go ahead and move him for certain...perhaps Barry too, and if we can't, we save money and create a slot for Ian.


Personally I rather Beno than Vaginis...dude is way more of a pussy than Beno is...but he's also more talented from what I have read...everyone automatically assumes the Spurs weren't even going to consider signing him...I disagree, the guys primary problems were with Van Gundy..regardless of what he is saying now...and Lindsay just might know something no one else does...and if now...fine, buy him out and we still got a second round pick and a roster spot.

If the Spurs were just trying to get under the tax Barry and Beno would already be long gone....they are great shooting guards with extensive playoff experience that come out of a great program and are off the books after this season....

And everyone wants to dump them for just anything...without realizing that leaves our guard rotation as Vaughn, Finley and James ing White.


Spurs aren't going to do that until they at least get another PG and probably until they get a good look at Finley in training camp...not to mention Williams and White.



Just say they get Vaginis and Udoka...

Poof Barry and Beno are gone......


TO me it reads like the Spurs are holding off on moving them..and there is a reason they are holding off.

[Kori Ellis]

Vaginis, as you so sweetly refer to him, is not an actual point guard. He's a 6'3 shooting guard. So even if the brought him over, they'd still need a point guard if they got rid of Beno.

[Russ]

Dennis Lindsey settles in to his new digs . . .

The only (small) contribution Lindsey may have had to this deal was to tout the Greek kid.

I agree that trading Scola and Butler to a divison rival is somewhat troubling. But, looking at the filp side, it's actually reassuring -- if there were any doubt about this trade, the Spurs woud never have made it with the hated Rockets. In other words, the Spurs may believe that Scola and Butler will fit no better with the Rockets and Yao than with the Spurs and Duncan. They may actually be ahead of the curve on this.

The problem with our analysis of these moves is that we sometimes employ the "fantasy league" analysis. Scola = X points. Butler = X points and X rebounds.

The Spurs know that 3 focal points are plenty and that anyone else on the team must understand that. All indications are that Scola might not understand that and that Butler might not understand much of anything.

Over the long haul Splitter and Mahinmi fit the Spurs current image of bigs better than Scola and Butler -- even if they may not put up the "numbers" of the other two.

Most teams want to seen as brilliant. The Spurs are content to win les and let the big city boys look at them in amazement -- wondering how they could win with the mundane pieces that they assemble.

[timvp]

Don't you think if $$$$ was the primary motivation, Barry and Beno would have been the first guys they moved? Who makes more money? Barry does...he makes as almost as much as Butler/Scola and Bonner/Oberto combined.

Don't you think if $$$ was the primary motivation, Butler would be here instead of Bonner?

You are the only person on earth who doesn't realize that money was the primary motivation. In whottt's imaginary world, the Spurs traded Scola to the Rockets because they know he's so bad that they wanted Duncan to match up with him four times a year.

NASA wants it space ship back.

Don't you think if Scola was better than Oberto, he'd be here and Oberto wouldn't?

Don't you think if Raja Bell were better than Derrick Dial, he'd be here?

Don't you think if the Spurs picked at 33 that they wouldn't have drafted the worst player in the entire draft?

I think Scola actually signed for less than Oberto.


Lots of bad takes here

Classic.

built around one underlying premise....people wanted more than the Spurs could get.

No. It's built around the premise that you don't give a divisional rival something for nothing. Do the same trade with the Bobcats and it wouldn't have been nearly as bad. It'd still be a stupid trade but not horrendous.

It was a desperation move that they could have held out on for another year to see if their assets became more valuable. The were no harm in waiting.

After preaching patients all summer, the Spurs get scared and do a panic move. Unacceptable.

Did you really want Scola in Chicago or Cleveland instead of Houston?

I don't... sending him to the Bulls...

All of a sudden you are scared of Scola? Remember your other takes?

At least try to keep your outlandish takes consistent.

Thanks.

You rather Bulter sits here and does for a season after Pop doghouses him, instead of brining Ian over?

The Spurs could have had both. And if Mahinmi was really David Robinson, Jr ... why did the Spurs make their first priority to sign a 20-year-old 6-foot-11 power forward away from Detroit?

Oops.

You rather have Butler riding the IR in our roster slot instead of Ime Udoka?

Could have had both. Salary dump Barry and there you go.

Or if it really comes down to Udoka and giving the Rockets a free gift, just sign someone like Jumaine Jones.

You are Marcus Bryant are pulling off some of the worst takes about the Spurs FO the last two seasons...I have ever seen you guys have.

Hey...Elson signing? Scorboard.

Scoreboard? You mean the guy who got benched during the playoffs and averaged two and two during the postseason?

Scoreboard ... WTF

We just won an NBA le...ditto Oberto.

I wanted Oberto on the Spurs back before you hopped onto the Spurs bandwagon. And you gave up on Oberto before the playoffs even started.

Fess up.

You guys keep calling them out as penny pinchers...except they keep being right, and they are winning les.

Last offseason disaster was an NBA le...

What did the Spurs do last year that helped them win the championship? Duncan, Ginobili, Parker, Bowen, Oberto, Horry and Finley were already on board. Nothing the Spurs did last summer had any impact in the playoffs.

Scoreboard.

Cavs in 5?

How can you claim scoreboard after a take like that. Cavs in 5. That's the message board equivalent of signing Beno to a max deal.

Congrats.

Bad takes.

Agreed. Horrible and horribly inconsistent takes on your part.

[Marcus Bryant]

Why the are they going to bring Spannnisssoulos over? The $2 mil they received for his contract was a key part of this trade. If he wants to play for anyone else he has to be let out of that contract. No way are the Spurs going to give that up.

[Kori Ellis]

The only (small) contribution Lindsey may have had to this deal was to tout the Greek kid.

Huh?

He touted the Greek kid who already said he isn't coming to the NBA? The Spurs didn't make this deal because they thought Spanoulis was going to be a contributor.

[Marcus Bryant]

You know, I bet Lindsey had very little to do with this trade.

[timvp]

VAGINIS IS STAYING IN GREECE. WHAT PART OF THIS DOES WHOTTT NOT UNDERSTAND?

Question.

[whottt]

You know what, whotttt? I'd rather the Spurs sat on Scola and Butler than gift them both to the Rockets. I'd rather see Scola sign another 10 year deal with Tau than be dumped for a 2nd round pick to someone else in the division.

The Spurs got greedy with this trade.

So you wanted to stand pat?

I know that. I disagree.

I want a SF type....a good one that can help us against the Mavs...and the Rockets.

The slot is important here too...the Spurs wanted Jackie Butler gone...


This guys is 5 ing years away from being any kind of serious contributor...he's got some offensive game, but he's also got a lot of liabilities...he is a huge ing project and he doesn't have the skils the Spurs covet at this time.





Butler is not going to do jack this season except be a liability...he was not the commodity you guys think he is....


The Spurs would have traded him for nothing just to get him off the roster...becausr they got les to win...herre and now, not when Duncan is retired.

[Marcus Bryant]

When analyzing Spurs' personnel moves, follow the cost. Rose. Nesterovic. Butler. About the only time I recall them taking back more than they sent out was the Turkoglu/Mercer deal.

[Kori Ellis]

So you wanted to stand pat?

I know that. I disagree.

I want a SF type....a good one that can help us against the Mavs...and the Rockets.

So did this deal make them closer to getting that SF type?

Because Udoka doesn't seem like that type at 6'5.

[Marcus Bryant]

So you wanted to stand pat?

I know that. I disagree.

I want a SF type....a good one that can help us against the Mavs...and the Rockets.

The slot is important here too...the Spurs wanted Jackie Butler gone...


This guys is 5 ing years away from being any kind of serious contributor...he's got some offensive game, but he's also got a lot of liabilities...he is a huge ing project and he doesn't have the skils the Spurs covet at this time.





Butler is not going to do jack this season except be a liability...he was not the commodity you guys think he is....


The Spurs would have traded him for nothing just to get him off the roster...becausr they got les to win...herre and now, not when Duncan is retired.

ROFL. Only in whottt's world would giving up two guys who can play next year for a guy who's too much of a pussy to play in the states and a 2nd round pick in '09 be counted as progress.

[timvp]

But, looking at the filp side, it's actually reassuring -- if there were any doubt about this trade, the Spurs woud never have made it with the hated Rockets.

The Spurs made the trade with the Rockets because they got desperate. They had other deals out there that fell apart. The only one still on the table was the Rockets one. And with Scola's deadline to buyout his contract being today, the Spurs waited until the last possible second to do the trade.

It was either make the trade when they did or wait until next year. The Rockets were barely able to get everything done in time to buyout the contract. In fact, I'm sure that the Rockets gave the Spurs some sort of deadline to do the deal. The time came and the Spurs panicked.

Even if someone is 100% for the trade, there's no question that the Spurs had their backs against the wall as far as using Scola's rights. Some think that Scola would have actually extended his contract, thus making Scola's rights worthless.

So the Spurs decided to take the safe yet hurried route of giving away Scola to the Rockets so that they get something in return. Same thing happened with Giricek. Giricek said he was going to sign an extension so the Spurs traded him for a second round pick that eventually turned into Mengke Bateer.

This'll likely look just as dumb in the long run, except on a bigger scale.

[Jimcs50]

ROFL. Only in whottt's world would giving up two guys who can play next year for a guy who's too much of a pussy to play in the states and a 2nd round pick in '09 be counted as progress.

As I said, let the people who know what they are doing have some repect, and give them time to show you why they make money doing this sort of thing, ok?

When you become a GM, then get back to me.

[timvp]

Butler wouldn't help the Spurs this year so they traded him to make room for Mahinmi, who will spend all year in Austin.

Good take

[whottt]

The only inconsistency here is on the part of you...

You guys assume teams were lining up to take Butler and Scola off our hands...


Scola wasn't drafted until the 50 something pick...he's underperformed in the clutch in Europe his teams have failed...and on top of that teams knew the Spurs weren't too high on him...or else they'd have signed him and not Oberto and Bonner.

The Spurs did not have the leverage you guys think they did...

You don't if the Bobcats were offering just a second rounder for the both of them they would have done that deal?


And they went after Amir because guess what...he might better than Mahinmi...he's got more NBA experience...he's further along...


The logic is horrible...that's like saying the Spurs shouldn't draft Greg Oden becuase they have Tim Duncan..and if they do draft Oden...they must think Duncan sucks.


Bad logic.


I want you to tell me the better deals the Spurs turned down...period.


And yes...Chicago scares me more with Scola than Houston...saying I should be as scared of Scola on the Rockets is like me saying you should be as scared of him on the
Bobcats...Chicago is better than Houston.


Bottom line is that the Spurs aren't as scared of the Rockets as you guys are...I concur.

I'd much rather develop Mahinmi and get a second round pick for Scola than be scurred of the Rockets.

[whottt]

So MB and Timvp...how many les are the Rockets going to win?

Say it here and now...


Because that's the only way this wasn't the best deal for the Spurs.