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He sucks...badly.
I think you hit the nail right on the head.
Because Bonner can hit the outside shot (suprisingly adept from mid-range) and hustles his ass off, everyone wants to build him up as the "Horry Replacement".
I think it's apparent after watching him play these extended minutes that is not the case. He just flat out doesn't have the athleticism (underrated characteristic of Horry) and the clutchness (if that's a word) of Horry.
So please....let it go.
As the poster quoted above says, stop trying to compare Bonner to Horry because he'll never live up. Just appreciate him for what he brings.
Side Note: Stop billing Udoka as the "Bowen Replacement" too....because he'll also fall short of that expectation. I just hope he can hit open jumpshots enough to matter on this team.
He sucks...badly.
Last edited by AFBlue; 11-26-2007 at 12:38 PM.
I agree on the general idea behind the thread - the Spurs deserved to lose this one the way they played. That being said, wouldn't you rather win a couple you were supposed to lose instead of losing a couple you could have won ( o, Dallas losing to Indy with no O'Neal on a barfed inbounds pass and Dallas being up on the Bucks with 3 mins to go)?
The way the Spurs offense is going right now, I think they feel they only need to play about 4 or 5 minutes of shutdown defense during the game. A couple of minutes like the start of the 3rd to get a couple of turnovers and get the lead and then the last 2 or 3 minutes of the 4th to finish it out.
I look for some full court pressing tonight. Try to get Beno flustered and some better D throughout the game.
Yup. You are my Spurs fans alright: "The sky is falling! The sky is falling!"
Oh, woe is us.
The Spurs aren't going to give tremendous effort that defense requires, not for 48 minutes/game.
At least the Spurs know how to play defense, play it more often and better than almost any team, rather than just pretending and talking defense, like the Suns.
When the Spurs need defense, it will be there.
The Spurs are probably just tired of playing top-flight defense for 48 minutes and blowing teams out by 20+ by halftime. Other teams are playing so sloppy that we have stopped respecting them.
Still not very consistent, although to his credit, he is not completely shying away from hitting big jumpers late in close matches when in the past he would freeze and not attempt a wide-open jumper.
Is there a site where we can see what TP's field goal % is on jumpers? I suspect it's not that great when compared to other PG's in the league.
Thanks timvp for your thoughts. I was concerned about the D as most others are but realize that it's early. Much room for improvement with plenty of time to get that done.
RROS had a good point about our cutters/lack of movement. I noticed the overdribbling myself and wondered where did our ball/player movement go. At times we moved it well and then it just kinda went away. We won't be hitting the 3's at that clip on a regular basis so we had better focus on movement.
All in all it was a nice win with plenty of ammo for Pop to use in the film sessions. I have all the faith in these guys to work on the D so when it's deep in the season they are clicking on all cylinders. These guys will become the MACHINE we all know and love.
www.nba.com/hotspots
FYI, Tony is shooting .358 on all non-layups. If you take out three-point attempts he is shooting .359. That's not as good as he has been the last couple of years.
For the sake of comparison, Manu is shooting .412 on all non-layups. However, if you take out three-point attempts he is shooting .343.
Over the past couple of years, Tony has consistently shot equal or higher than Manu on jumpers if you exclude three-pointers. This has been covered before in other threads.
So in summation: Parker rocks and is clearly a better basketball player than Manu.
yes but Manu also is not a good mid-range jump shooter so why compare TP to Manu?
What is the % on non 3pt. jumpers for the other dominant PG's like Deron, Paul, Billups, Nash, Kidd, etc.?
.358 average on all non-layups confirms what I have been seeing with my own eyes this year....that Parker has been missing a LOT of easy jumpers. I don't have the stats but I have to believe that this is a very poor number when compared to some of the top PG's who almost in all cases are also very good 3 point shooter unlike TP.
TP is still predominantly a slasher, penetrator and for someone who drives so hard so often, one thing that puzzles me is why he doesn't get more fouls.
Anyway the good thing is that he is still improving and the season is still young and i see some good things coming out of him, especially in terms of his reduced turnover and better judgements/ball movement.
I'm not going to go thru and calculate them all, but it looks like Deron is 38%, Paul is 31% on midrange shots. There aren't many good midrange shooters in the league.
And Jason Kidd is only shooting 36% overall this season, and has never shot even 45% overall in his entire career.
Last edited by Kori Ellis; 11-26-2007 at 03:30 PM.
For the sake of comparison, Manu is shooting .412 on all non-layups. However, if you take out three-point attempts he is shooting .343.
wow his three point shooting is better then anything
Yup. They really need to do automatic ulative zone % calculations in hotzone (among the 9,839,394,394 other improvement nba.com should make).
Anyway, if you look at hotzone numbers since TP went away from the three-pointers, you can put his FG% inside the arc up against probably just about anyone you want to name. Yes, it could get better (especially this year), but for the past couple of seasons, when he has an open J in the fourth, I expect it to go in just as much as I expect Manu's or any other elite player's.
Trapping with a big (Bonner) helped the Spurs gain control of the game. The Sonics folded like a lawn chair in the last 2 minutes.
except for Nash.
I sweare when I see Nash go for 2 or 3 point jumper, unless he is under extreme pressure or tight defense, it always seems go in. His % must be close to 50% in mid-range and definitely over 40% in 3pt range. I believe this is why it's so hard to guard Nash because you simply can't leave him alone but if you run at him, he will dribble penetrate or make a precision pass to an open player.
Nash is the exception, which is why I didn't mention him. I haven't confirmed this, but he might have the best mid-range FG% in the game.
offensively, Nash is untouchable. No ifs, buts or ands. That Phonix team would be an average to below -average team without Nash, even with Amare.
Just crunched them for Nash:
this year on mid-range shots = 38/74 = .514
last year = 189/372 = .509
which is just sick. That's how guys like Walt Frazier and Gervin used to shoot back in the day when everyone's mid-range games were more developed and defenses weren't as intense.
like i said, he rarely misses when he has an open jumper......usually he only misses because time is running out or he has a tough defender crawling all over him when he can't find anyone else open or the play breaks down.
also when tony is open for jumper and shoots it, he is WIDE OPEN as the defenders actually will slide under the screen and dare him to shoot it. Very rarely would defenders do that with Nash as they know he would kill them with jumper after jumper unless they force it out of his hands.
timvp didnt you say that durant was gonna be like darius miles?
Nash gets as many open jumpers as anyone in the league because of the Suns' style. How many times do you really see somebody in his face? Which is what makes what Bowen does to him so special.
As for Tony, the reason he gets jumpers is because teams know he will kill them in the paint. The fact is that he still hits them about on par with other point guards, despite perceptions.
I have more confidence in Parker when he is about to shoot a mid-range jumper than what I had a few seasons ago. He has improved, but he is nowhere near Nash. That guy can shot.
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