Simmons: "I told you so..." abt J-Kidd Trade

[lonestr]

You don't think Kidd might do better with Dirk and Josh as opposed to Rex Chapman and Penny Hardaway needing to be put down like Barbaro stage of his career?

Findog, the Mavs do not have a talent problem irregardless of the trade and adjustments that have been made so far. What this all points to is 'Leadership". Dallas is in desparate need of someone stepping up and taking over the team. It's that simple. Avery new this problem when taking over and so did Cuban. Dirk is not the leader everyone believes him to be which posed a huge problem after the 2006 Finals. The trade for Kidd was to do exactly that despite his pedigree resume. How the rest of the team reacts to Kidd and accepts him as their leader is the question. Hopefully it will all come together before the playoffs start.

[Findog]

Dirk is not the leader everyone believes him to be which posed a huge problem after the 2006 Finals. The trade for Kidd was to do exactly that despite his pedigree resume. How the rest of the team reacts to Kidd and accepts him as their leader is the question. Hopefully it will all come together before the playoffs start.

I think the Dirk is a soft pussy choker thing is way overblown. There's a sliver of truth to it. Was he not a leader when his team beat the Spurs? Or the Suns? Does it not take mental discipline and toughness to do that?

[Findog]

Definitely didn't make them a better team. But, in my opinion, it still wasn't a bad trade because they weren't going to win it with Devin Harris either and they were trying to shake things up. Didn't help, but didn't hurt them that much either. The draft picks probably hurt more than losing Harris and Diop.

Malik Allen has been a nice surprise. He brings a bit different skillset than Diop, but he can rebound and commit six fouls just as well as Diop, and he's not an offensive nonen y like Diop.

The 2008 pick is lottery-protected if we miss the playoffs.

[mavsfan1000]

Dallas got a lot more than I thought. Everyone talks about Kidd, Diop, and Harris. The big surprises are Wright and Allen. Both have done a solid job so far. Wright looks like he should be starting at the 2 guard as he has been solid on defense and offense. Allen has done just as good of a job as Diop was doing as a backup. New Jersey gutted their offense with this trade and can't even get to 80 points. Dallas has all the offensive firepower without surrendering too much defense.

[Findog]

I actually like Stackhouse starting at the 2, he solves the size and scoring problem, and he can take Josh's backup minutes at the 3. Wright should be getting some of those minutes at the 2 to split with Terry.

[mavsfan1000]

I actually like Stackhouse starting at the 2, he solves the size and scoring problem, and he can take Josh's backup minutes at the 3. Wright should be getting some of those minutes at the 2 to split with Terry.

It's alright but my first choice would be Wright. He especially will be useful against the Kobe Bryant's/Mcgrady type of players. Making Terry the 6th man was a great move I feel as he is too much of a defensive liability as a starter.

[lonestr]

I think the Dirk is a soft pussy choker thing is way overblown. There's a sliver of truth to it. Was he not a leader when his team beat the Spurs? Or the Suns? Does it not take mental discipline and toughness to do that?

You are missing the point. Every team plays tough against the Spurs, Dallas is no different. Who wants to be the team to claim "We beat the Spurs!". But who wants to be the team to say "We are the Champions!" Take a close look at our team. It doesn't take a genius to name who the leader is. I never made the comment that Dirk was a soft pussy choker. I remember during the WC finals in 2006 when the struggle for leadership came up and Jason Terry was calling for team meetings at his house to get everyone on the same page. I saw it again during the first round playoff series against Golden State. It was all mentioned by the sports announcers.

Discipline is one thing, but mental toughness is another. Otherwise, you'd be the 2006 NBA Champions. Look, San Antonio does not have the most talented players in the NBA. Yes, the Spurs are very disciplined, but they are also killers under the leadership of Tim Duncan. Avery knows this and wants someone to lead and instill killer insticts to the team.

[JMarkJohns]

Yes, Simmons is an idiot. He gets paid to write stuff that gets a reaction. Sort of like Charles Barkley gets paid to spew Hot Sports opinions.

First of all, this is old news. This is over a week old. He judges the trade based on 4 games against the 3 or 4 best oppoents in the West at the time.
The Mavs lost to the Hornets on Kidds 2nd day here. Big surprise. Then the Mavs lost to the Spurs, Lakers and Jazz all by 1 possession in regulation and those 4 games were played in 5 days. The results would have been the same with Harris.

While it is factual that the Mavs team is now "Older", they aren't as old as the Spurs. And they are more experienced now. Kidd brings playoff toughness and experience that Harris could not.

Myth:
The team is worse now than before. Totally wrong. While Harris was a decent scorer 17-18 points per game. He only avg 4-5 assists and 2-3 rebounds. Overall his production is far less than Kidds 10 assist per game 11 points per game and 7-8 rebounds per game.

And what people do not see, unless they watch all the Mavs games, is that Kidd makes everyone around him (except Josh Howard) better. He gets them the ball in a much better position to score where as Harris simply dribbled it up and passed it to another player for an Isolation play.

Myth:
Kidd shoots poorly. While Kidd's 2 point FG % is not the best he does shoot over 35% from 3 point range. And he can make a big shot if needed. But that is not why he is here.

Myth:
Losing Diop hurts the Mavs further. Wrong.
While Diop was a good back up to Damp he was never a scorer and had foul problems. Now that Kidd is here Damp is playing better than ever so we miss Diop even less. Furthermore, Malik Allen has done a nice job playing back up for Damp and he scores twice as much as Diop. Also Magloire is starting to get some time so he should be in shape by the Playoffs. So we will then have a 3 head center position if needed. Damp, Allen, Magloire and that is better than Damp/Diop

Myth:
Now that Harris and Diop are gone the Spurs will run all over the Mavs. Wrong
the game last week was a one possession game and Kidd and co. did a very nice job on Parker. If Josh Howard had been healthy (he is still on about 85%) the Mavs would have won that game and the next 2.

Additionally, we got a good young player in Anotine Wright who is finally getting some playing time under stubborn Avery Johnson's system.

Kidd brings a much larger defender for the bigger gaurds in the NBA. Harris was small/slight of build and was somewhat Fragile. Harris has missed more games in 4 years than Kidd has in 13 years.

And lastly, Kidd has made it fun to play the game again. If you watch the Mavs closely, you see that everyone on the team is just more excited about playing. Everyone is passing the ball and assists are up and Isolations are down. Bottom line, if Dirk's happy about it, that's what matters most.

Our only problem now is getting Avery to stop micro-managing the team and let Kidd run the offensive flow.

I hope that answers your questions.

You're 0-5 vs. Western Conference playoff teams and in those games Kidd has an average +/- rating of like -9.

You're worse off for the trade, just as the Suns are. Your Mavs beat the Spurs with Harris as a second-year point and Diop as a backup reclamation project. You advanced to the Finals. You really should have won the Finals but collapsed. As a fan who's watched a ton of Kidd I can tell you his greatest weaknesses have more of an impact come playoff time than do his greatest strengths.

[DazedAndConfused]

You're 0-5 vs. Western Conference playoff teams and in those games Kidd has an average +/- rating of like -9.

You're worse off for the trade, just as the Suns are. Your Mavs beat the Spurs with Harris as a second-year point and Diop as a backup reclamation project. You advanced to the Finals. You really should have won the Finals but collapsed. As a fan who's watched a ton of Kidd I can tell you his greatest weaknesses have more of an impact come playoff time than do his greatest strengths.

Sssshhh don't you know Mav fans don't like dealing with reality.

[JMarkJohns]

You don't think Kidd might do better with Dirk and Josh as opposed to Rex Chapman and Penny Hardaway needing to be put down like Barbaro stage of his career?

Or Kevin Johnson, or Marion, or Olympian Gugliotta, or pre-surgery McDyess or 15-8 Clifford Robinson, or 6th man Danny Manning, or 6th man Rodney Rogers...

Look, I'm not saying I ever expected a le, but Kidd had plenty of talent, was much younger, more athletic and a better shooter, while the west wasn't nearly as stacked.

I'm not saying Dirk and Howard aren't enough to finally net Kidd his first Western Conference series win, but I wouldn't expect anything more than the first round.

I've seen more of Kidd than most here.... , I saw a better Kidd fail.

[mavsfan1000]

Or Kevin Johnson, or Marion, or Olympian Gugliotta, or pre-surgery McDyess or 15-8 Clifford Robinson, or 6th man Danny Manning, or 6th man Rodney Rogers...

Look, I'm not saying I ever expected a le, but Kidd had plenty of talent, was much younger, more athletic and a better shooter, while the west wasn't nearly as stacked.

I'm not saying Dirk and Howard aren't enough to finally net Kidd his first Western Conference series win, but I wouldn't expect anything more than the first round.

I've seen more of Kidd than most here.... , I saw a better Kidd fail.

This is by far the most talented team Kidd's ever been on. Kidd has gotten to the Finals twice with a far less talented team with Martin as their best goto guy.

[Indazone]

This is by far the most talented team Kidd's ever been on. Kidd has gotten to the Finals twice with a far less talented team with Martin as their best goto guy.

Not getting to the finals in this rodeo.

[DazedAndConfused]

Kidd was also playing in the Leastern conference. Big difference.

[mavsfan1000]

Kidd was also playing in the Leastern conference. Big difference.

Well Kidd as the best player on the team will probably fail. Kidd as the third best player on the team or possibly 4th is a whole different situation. A lot less pressure when Kidd doesn't have to be the savior for this team. Dallas hasn't gotten used to playing with Kidd yet and that schedule would be brutal to any team.

[DazedAndConfused]

Well Kidd as the best player on the team will probably fail. Kidd as the third best player on the team or possibly 4th is a whole different situation. A lot less pressure when Kidd doesn't have to be the savior for this team. Dallas hasn't gotten used to playing with Kidd yet and that schedule would be brutal to any team.

I agree Kidd isn't the problem. It's Avery.

[kskonn]

Well Kidd as the best player on the team will probably fail. Kidd as the third best player on the team or possibly 4th is a whole different situation. A lot less pressure when Kidd doesn't have to be the savior for this team. Dallas hasn't gotten used to playing with Kidd yet and that schedule would be brutal to any team.

If Kidd is the 4th who is three?? Terry? just asking. I would go with Dirk, Howard, Kidd, Terry. Maybe switch Terry and Kidd, is that on par with your comment?

[mavsfan1000]

If Kidd is the 4th who is three?? Terry? just asking. I would go with Dirk, Howard, Kidd, Terry. Maybe switch Terry and Kidd, is that on par with your comment?

When Terry is on, he is ahead of Kidd. I expect Howard to get back to normal soon as well. He is more important to this team. Overall though I would put Kidd over Terry. Terry definitely can't run the point guard by himself though so they both are important.
1. Nowitzki
2. Howard
3. Kidd
4. Terry

[Findog]

You're 0-5 vs. Western Conference playoff teams and in those games Kidd has an average +/- rating of like -9.

0-4, but who's counting?

You're worse off for the trade, just as the Suns are.

We may not be better, but we're not worse.

Your Mavs beat the Spurs with Harris as a second-year point and Diop as a backup reclamation project. You advanced to the Finals. You really should have won the Finals but collapsed.

Dominating the regular season last year meant the Mavs felt no need to alter their approach after Miami as the trade deadline approached. The Golden State series changed that. Even before the Kidd trade, Avery had moved Terry to the bench and had done quite a few things differently. Do you honestly think the pre-trade Mavs would've beaten the Spurs, Lakers or Jazz with Harris and Diop? Possibly, but I don't think the front office was confident.

It wasn't that they were psychologically damaged after the last two playoff exits, as many critics suggest, it's that there was an aura of negativity surrounding the team because of those exits and something needed to be done to give the team a jolt. Winning teams tend to be happy teams, and yet there was nothing happy about this team. I don't think the Mavs are going to win a championship this year, but I know they're not worse, and they weren't going to win a le with what they had. Like Phoenix, they have shortened their window and are going all-in. And for both teams, it's too early to say they've failed. I still think the Shaq experiment has a chance of working if D'Antoni can utilize him properly. And in Dallas, I would say the biggest impediment to our postseason success is not the talent on the floor, but what appears to be a growing rift between the players and the coach.

[DazedAndConfused]

It was a lateral move at best.

[mavsfan1000]

It was a lateral move at best.

Uh read the comments up above and it definitely wasn't a lateral move. The ones not mentioned are the key to the deal. Wright and Allen were solid players off the bench for New Jersey. Both good defenders and can score. This team needed a well rounded 2 guard to face the Kobe's and Mcgrady's of the league. The key is if Avery utilizes this. Allen has been a good midrange shooter and is a better defender than I thought. Dallas has a much better bench now and Kidd has enough talent around him. I didn't even mention Magloire but he could be useful as well once he gets into shape.

[DazedAndConfused]

If Avery can't utilize Kidd then it is a lateral move. He ain't getting any younger.

[endrity]

If Avery can't utilize Kidd then it is a lateral move. He ain't getting any younger.

America, eatin' my lunch from a single bowl in my parents basement, where I'm livin'. Happy Birthday, I'm forty-three.

Don't want to waste those precious calories...chewin'. Jesus come move my jaw for me, help me get my sloppy food down my throat.

[mavsfan1000]

If Avery can't utilize Kidd then it is a lateral move. He ain't getting any younger.

Too early to tell. Kidd keeps looking better though. Even in Dallas's losses, Kidd looked pretty good. It's not easy to change so drastically at point guard. Harris and Kidd are completely different type of point guards. Kidd looked very good these last 2 games and it didn't look like Avery was trying to change Kidd's game.

[genomefreak13]

Jerry Stackhouse, Brandon Bass, Malik Rose and Devean George isn't a bench?

When the did Dallas acquire Malik Rose??? CONSPIRACY!!! I tell you! CONSPIRACY !!!

[Findog]

When the did Dallas acquire Malik Rose??? CONSPIRACY!!! I tell you! CONSPIRACY !!!

Now he can't guard Dirk!

Yeah, typo, already got called out on it.