Rockets winning streak is impressive

[whottt]

Remember though the Rockets are missing Yao a good part of this stretch too so even though other teams are missing one there stars, so are the Rockets.

And some of us would say that actually helped the Rockets, because Yao doesn't really fit that team.


22 wins is impressive...but it doesn't make you a world beater.

[DazedAndConfused]

It's a catch 22 with Yao, he is needed for them to win in the post-season but he also hinders a lot of what they do. IMHO they are best off getting rid of him now while his value is high.

If you look at a guy like Rafer Alston, it's no coincidence he's having a career year now that Yao is out. When Yao is in the game, he is the focal point of the offense. Alston is needed to distribute the ball more and to score less. This really limits his strengths since he is not a good PG in that sense, he is a scoring PG much like Tony Parker.

[bobbyjoe]

When is someone going to mention that the Rockets recent defensive surge is likely due to the fact that nearly every good team they have played has been devoid of it's top interior scoring threat.


I wouldn't expect a guy citing their excellent defense to bring that up...but I'd think someone would.

How many teams nowadays have a great dominant big anyway?

And dont bring up Dirk or West. Both are jump shooting/turn and face big men. These arent the kind of guys who are going to dominate in the paint and take advantage of the undersized Houston PF's on the boards and in the post like Lamar Odom did yesterday.

The guys likely to exploit Houston are a Tim Duncan, Shaq type who are big and play big. There are just aren't too many of those in the league. Even KG is not a true dominant interior player.

It also must be noted that Carl Landry has been out for Houston for 5 games. if he comes back, that helps the interior issues in a major way.

I think you make some good points overall, but I would refrain from including the Jazz in that list. Carlos Boozer is a great PF, but Chuck Hayes defends him extremely well. Hayes is undersized, so he has no hope against a Duncan, Stoudemire (too athletic and quick), Shaq, Gasol but Boozer is also an undersized turn and face PF. Boozer cant necessarily overpower guys like Scola/Landry and Hayes down low.

Where was David West's impact when he was on the court against Houston on a back to back and the Hornets lost by 20 at home?

[DazedAndConfused]

How many teams nowadays have a great dominant big anyway?

And dont bring up Dirk or West. Both are jump shooting/turn and face big men. These arent the kind of guys who are going to dominate in the paint and take advantage of the undersized Houston PF's on the boards and in the post like Lamar Odom did yesterday.

The guys likely to exploit Houston are a Tim Duncan, Shaq type who are big and play big. There are just aren't too many of those in the league. Even KG is not a true dominant interior player.

It also must be noted that Carl Landry has been out for Houston for 5 games. if he comes back, that helps the interior issues in a major way.

I think you make some good points overall, but I would refrain from including the Jazz in that list. Carlos Boozer is a great PF, but Chuck Hayes defends him extremely well. Hayes is undersized, so he has no hope against a Duncan, Stoudemire (too athletic and quick), Shaq, Gasol but Boozer is also an undersized turn and face PF. Boozer cant necessarily overpower guys like Scola/Landry and Hayes down low.

Where was David West's impact when he was on the court against Houston on a back to back and the Hornets lost by 20 at home?

They had Yao Ming for that game. Change your team affiliation to HOU please, you ain't fooling anyone.

[bobbyjoe]

It's a catch 22 with Yao, he is needed for them to win in the post-season but he also hinders a lot of what they do. IMHO they are best off getting rid of him now while his value is high.

If you look at a guy like Rafer Alston, it's no coincidence he's having a career year now that Yao is out. When Yao is in the game, he is the focal point of the offense. Alston is needed to distribute the ball more and to score less. This really limits his strengths since he is not a good PG in that sense, he is a scoring PG much like Tony Parker.

You do realize that Rafer Alston was having a career year before Yao got hurt, right?

The guy (Alston) is purely a stand still 3 point shooter and you are arguing he improves in value when a 7'6" 22/10 guy who creates wide open shots for perimeter players is gone?

My, oh my. With Yao out, it's a uva lot easier to stay at home on Alston/Battier/etc.

No team in the NBA will give up fair value for Yao Ming with his injury issues. He's going to be looked on as damaged goods if/until he proves he can stay healthy.

People need to realize that it's possible to turn it on for a few games with your main gun out due to grit/effort. But for the long haul, you'll get exposed.

It's only been 10 games for Houston without Yao. One hot game by Rafer doesnt mean he's becoming the 2nd coming because Yao is gone.

[whottt]

They had Yao Ming for that game. Change your team affiliation to HOU please, you ain't fooling anyone.

LOL...that's his first direct Rockets related post ever...all his other posts having been defending Hakeem under the guise of being an objective LakerFan..


Glad he finally gave up the ghost...and I'm glad someone else besides me finally saw him for the Rocket Fan he has always been

[bobbyjoe]

They had Yao Ming for that game. Change your team affiliation to HOU please, you ain't fooling anyone.

Wait, I thought "Ewing theory: better without Yao"?

Which is it?

Are they better off without Yao, as you contend in half your posts?

Or are they going to exposed without Yao and wins they had with Yao dont mean much because the team is no longer built the same, as you contend in the other half?

P.S. You can be a fan without resorting to arrogance, showboatery, and chest beating as you do in your posts. You dont have to act like a royal ass to fans of other teams to prove your fanhood.

[whottt]

How many teams nowadays have a great dominant big anyway?

And dont bring up Dirk or West. Both are jump shooting/turn and face big men. These arent the kind of guys who are going to dominate in the paint and take advantage of the undersized Houston PF's on the boards and in the post like Lamar Odom did yesterday.

The guys likely to exploit Houston are a Tim Duncan, Shaq type who are big and play big. There are just aren't too many of those in the league. Even KG is not a true dominant interior player.

It also must be noted that Carl Landry has been out for Houston for 5 games. if he comes back, that helps the interior issues in a major way.

I think you make some good points overall, but I would refrain from including the Jazz in that list. Carlos Boozer is a great PF, but Chuck Hayes defends him extremely well. Hayes is undersized, so he has no hope against a Duncan, Stoudemire (too athletic and quick), Shaq, Gasol but Boozer is also an undersized turn and face PF. Boozer cant necessarily overpower guys like Scola/Landry and Hayes down low.

Where was David West's impact when he was on the court against Houston on a back to back and the Hornets lost by 20 at home?

I'm going to disagree with your opinion on Garnett and Dirk and the way they will match up against the Rockets...they most certainly are dominant enough...

Dirk is tricky because you guys have defended him estensively with TMac in the past and TMac does an excellent job of that...but I'm going to say Adelman won't want to do that this time around and Dirk will abuse the Scola/Mutombo front court.



I agree...Landry or Hayes, not Scola will be drawing any tough defensive asignments in the fourth...as they have been doing it in this 22 game streak as well.

[Solid D]

The players were already committed to defense and that has clearly helped this year's Rockets team. Rafer said in an interview during the midst of this streak that he can still hear Van Gundy's voice in his head about not letting guys get into the middle.

This team is more like the Sacramento Adelman though. Elston Turner and TR Dunn and Sikma have adapted their defensive schemes depending on their opponents.

[DazedAndConfused]

Wait, I thought "Ewing theory: better without Yao"?

Which is it?

Are they better off without Yao, as you contend in half your posts?

Or are they going to exposed without Yao and wins they had with Yao dont mean much because the team is no longer built the same, as you contend in the other half?

P.S. You can be a fan without resorting to arrogance, showboatery, and chest beating as you do in your posts. You dont have to act like a royal ass to fans of other teams to prove your fanhood.

You spend an inordinate amount of time defending the Rockets for someone that is a supposed Laker fan. In fact, that's all you do.

[robbie380]

And some of us would say that actually helped the Rockets, because Yao doesn't really fit that team.


22 wins is impressive...but it doesn't make you a world beater.

just dismiss that the rockets had won 16 straight with yao in the lineup (he was sick for the utah loss) before he got knocked out for the year again.

to your 2nd point i don't think any rockets fans care about this streak if we end up doing nothing in the post season. it's been fun as to watch but we know what matters. there is no doubt in my mind that this team SHOULD get out of the first round. this TEAM is talented enough to get out of the first round and the season is a failure if we don't after this amazing run.

[DazedAndConfused]

bobbyjoe let's just crown the Rockets 2008 NBA champs since they are so invulnerable.

[whottt]

The players were already committed to defense and that has clearly helped this year's Rockets team. Rafer said in an interview during the midst of this streak that he can still hear Van Gundy's voice in his head about not letting guys get into the middle.

This team is more like the Sacramento Adelman though. Elston Turner and TR Dunn and Sikma have adapted their defensive schemes depending on their opponents.

They are commited to defense like Flip Saunders Pistons have been commited to Larry Brown's defense....it's there, but the same emphasis won't be.

[whottt]

just dismiss that the rockets had won 16 straight with yao in the lineup (he was sick for the utah loss) before he got knocked out for the year again.

16 in a row does not = 22.

I pretty much think you wouldn't have won 22 games if Yao hadn't got injured. I think his injury allowed Adelman to game plan more according to his style, so basically you guys changed in mid-streak.

I look at your interior players...even with a healthy Landry...and I'm not worried at all.

to your 2nd point i don't think any rockets fans care about this streak if we end up doing nothing in the post season. it's been fun as to watch but we know what matters. there is no doubt in my mind that this team SHOULD get out of the first round. this TEAM is talented enough to get out of the first round and the season is a failure if we don't after this amazing run.

You guys probably won't be eliminated in the first round...unless you're playing us. Hope to see ya soon, in just that scenario...there is an ugly wrong that needs to be righted.


So by all means...keep celebrating that winning streak and hoping for Spurs losses...it'll only lock in that first round matchup LOSS, for you

[Solid D]

Shane Battier is certainly committed to defense. He has been since he was at Duke and he's gotten better at it every year. All you have to do is watch...at least that's all I have to do.

[whottt]

Shane Battier is certainly committed to defense. He has been since he was at Duke and he's gotten better at it every year. All you have to do is watch...at least that's all I have to do.

So was Ben Wallace...even after Larry Brown was gone. Didn't mean the Pistons still were.

[bobbyjoe]

bobbyjoe let's just crown the Rockets 2008 NBA champs since they are so invulnerable.

Not really. I "spend time defending the streak" because I always think it's lame in sports when a great achievement is minimized for weak reasons.

I did the same thing when Kobe Bryant scored his 81 and all we heard was "yeah, but it was the Raptors".

Did you read my post in the other thread? I still have LAL getting to the NBA Finals. I would definitely not expect the Rockets to win the le without Yao Ming, as I've said many times.

I mean do people not think the Lakers in 70 or Bucks in 71 had several easy games in their streaks? Of course they did, so acting like having a lot of easy games in a long streak is something exclusive to Houston is silly.

Ditto for Bryant. Did you not think it was ridiculous to hear Bryant's 81 critiquted because it was the Raptors? It's still 81 freaking points in the NBA! If it were that easy, why would it be the 2nd biggest scoring output of all time.

Ditto for David Robinson's 71 points. "Yeah, but it was the Clippers" said many.

I dont really post on here much to be honest but obviously this streak has been an interesting topic for all NBA fans, so I chimed in with thoughts. If you think that makes me a Rockets fan, so be it.

[robbie380]

IF you'd ever seen Rick Adelman coach prior to this season you'd know none of that is really relevant. He squeezes offense out of bigmen like TMac squeezes choke out of a first round playoff series.


Not the same thing due to the nature of Adelman's teams.



We gave you credit for winning 22 in a row, but you seek credit for beating elite teams when they weren't elite. You aren't going to get it....now matter how many excuses you have.


You can't claim greatness on the grounds of your 22 game winning streak and then claim poor little us simultaneously.


Which is it...are you 22 wins in a row good, or are you beat up and vulnerable in the paint?

where did i give excuses? you were giving excuses for teams losing to the rockets. so if you want to give excuses for teams losing to us then i have to remind you that we are not 100%. it's a catch 22....they can do no right. that's fine.

and even though we have been dominating rebounding and points in the paint we are vulnerable to a low post scorer. that was very evident when deke and anyone else on the rockets was trying to defend okafor. but the obvious counter point is that there simply are not many good low post scorers that are too big for us to defend. there is shaq if his fat ass can stay healthy. there is duncan. there are the lakers with odom, bynum, and gasol who are all too long for us to defend without yao.

yes, i know there is boozer as well but he falls in love with his jumper too much. also, i feel that our power forward trio of scola, landry, and hayes can cancel him out.

and at no point did i claim greatness. i just stated that this TEAM is more talented than you would like to believe.

[DazedAndConfused]

16 in a row does not = 22.

I pretty much think you wouldn't have won 22 games if Yao hadn't got injured. I think his injury allowed Adelman to game plan more according to his style, so basically you guys changed in mid-streak.

I look at your interior players...even with a healthy Landry...and I'm not worried at all.




You guys probably won't be eliminated in the first round...unless you're playing us. Hope to see ya soon, in just that scenario...there is an ugly wrong that needs to be righted.


So by all means...keep celebrating that winning streak and hoping for Spurs losses...it'll only lock in that first round matchup LOSS, for you

How sweet would it be if the Rox held onto the #1-2 seed and the Spurs slapped them in the playoffs. It would be a 4-0 sweep nightmare for them. Another 1st round exit, I don't think T-Mac would recover.

[whottt]

How sweet would it be if the Rox held onto the #1-2 seed and the Spurs slapped them in the playoffs. It would be a 4-0 sweep nightmare for them. Another 1st round exit, I don't think T-Mac would recover.

It's what I want...


It'll shut the Scola fans the up too. In fact it's the only thing that will.

[bobbyjoe]

16 in a row does not = 22.

I pretty much think you wouldn't have won 22 games if Yao hadn't got injured. I think his injury allowed Adelman to game plan more according to his style, so basically you guys changed in mid-streak.

I look at your interior players...even with a healthy Landry...and I'm not worried at all.




You guys probably won't be eliminated in the first round...unless you're playing us. Hope to see ya soon, in just that scenario...there is an ugly wrong that needs to be righted.


So by all means...keep celebrating that winning streak and hoping for Spurs losses...it'll only lock in that first round matchup LOSS, for you

A Spurs-Rockets matchup with Houston as a top seed and SA as a bottom seed might be the first in NBA history where the lower seed is actually favored. Ditto if LAL drops to a lower seed due to Gasol's injury.

Then again, that might not be such a bold statement given that the West teams 1-8 basically have the same record.

I havent watched a ton of Spurs games lately. But I know about the 1-5 in the last 6. What has been the problem in your opinion?

[Allanon]

The Rockets 22 win streak is very impressive no matter how you cut it. Watching them on Sunday, I'd say their defense and hot 3 point shooting is the key to it. They trotted out 4 3 point shooters at once and smacked the Lakers in the 4th quarter yesterday.

That's a live or die situation but it worked extremely well for them.

[DazedAndConfused]

where did i give excuses? you were giving excuses for teams losing to the rockets. so if you want to give excuses for teams losing to us then i have to remind you that we are not 100%. it's a catch 22....they can do no right. that's fine.

and even though we have been dominating rebounding and points in the paint we are vulnerable to a low post scorer. that was very evident when deke and anyone else on the rockets was trying to defend okafor. but the obvious counter point is that there simply are not many good low post scorers that are too big for us to defend. there is shaq if his fat ass can stay healthy. there is duncan. there are the lakers with odom, bynum, and gasol who are all too long for us to defend without yao.

yes, i know there is boozer as well but he falls in love with his jumper too much. also, i feel that our power forward trio of scola, landry, and hayes can cancel him out.

and at no point did i claim greatness. i just stated that this TEAM is more talented than you would like to believe.

The truth lies somewhere in the middle. The Rockets are not as good as their streak would indicate, but they are certainly not as terrible as people are making them out to be.

Jumpshooting teams almost never do well in the post season, we're talking about a best of 7 game series.....the shots won't be falling every night and you need to get your scoring from elsewhere besides the 3pt line. The Rockets just don't have this without Yao.

[whottt]

I havent watched a ton of Spurs games lately. But I know about the 1-5 in the last 6. What has been the problem in your opinion?

When you are carrying around a lot of these:

They drain a lot of energy you would otherwise be using to win typical regular season games.


Not to mention they tend to motivate the opponents.


These games just aren't that big of a deal to the Spurs...even if they make a conscious effort, at the subconscious level they know these games just aren't that important.


Me? I've fallen a sleep in a couple of these games and I've only actually watched 2 entire games during the stretch.

And both the games I've seen the Spurs looked good to me...


I'm glad the Spurs aren't wasting their energy on games that ultimately will do nothing to aid their quest to repeat. Sure I'd like to see wins...


But I've seen the Spurs go into the playoffs as the hottest team in the league during a repeat year and get owned badly....I'd rather them have that energy then than now.

Only champions can take this frame of mind and it's not even an intentional thing...it's just that there's no subs ute for :

...because only they have had success that exceeds mere regular season big games.



This team knows what it takes to win championships...and there is no subs ute for that experience, but it does have it's side effects.

[bobbyjoe]

The truth lies somewhere in the middle. The Rockets are not as good as their streak would indicate, but they are certainly not as terrible as people are making them out to be.

Jumpshooting teams almost never do well in the post season, we're talking about a best of 7 game series.....the shots won't be falling every night and you need to get your scoring from elsewhere besides the 3pt line. The Rockets just don't have this without Yao.

Agreed, with one important counterargument.

Jumpshooting teams throughout the course of NBA history have almost always been run and gun teams who didnt play a lick of D.

Think the 90's Warriors, the Suns of Nash, the Mavs of Dirk-Terry-Stack, the Warriors of Baron-SJax.

It's a rare combination to have a team that is strong defensively but offensively relies on outside shooting. Most great defensive teams have power post games like the Spurs do or the 3peat Lakers.

At the end of the day, Defense is the single most important component of basketball in terms of winning in today's NBA. You can get by easier on off-shooting nights as a perimeter team if D/rebounding are constants.

And even though I pick LAL to win the West, this is the one problem I see for LAL. The Defense has to be shored up a little bit. Bynum would be a tremendous part of this, but the more time goes by and the more the timeframe for a return gets prolonged, the more I question what exactly his role is for the 2008 postseason.