Dow 7553, Citibank About to Go Bankrupt

[Wild Cobra]

And how does that happen?

Simply let corporations and unions know they are on their own. If they cannot find a way to survive, too bad. That would apply to the likes of GM. They don’t deserve to survive as a corporate welfare case. Unions need to see that they lose almost all the dues receipts if they do mot work with management to cut costs. Management needs to change some things as well. I see only two big things the government can do for the auto industry. Relax regulations to a reasonable level and reduce corporate tax rates. Did you know that for 2007, GM paid $37.2 billion in taxes, even though they had a $38.7 billion loss! If we do any kind of financial help to the car makers, it should be loans only, and contingent on them presenting a viable model for long term future growth. Otherwise, we are simply throwing the money into the fire.

In the cases of the banking and lending industry, let them go bankrupt and reorganize if they cannot fix themselves. It's the rich investors that get hurt that way, not the people with loans. Investors lose money all the time. Why should this be any different? All we are doing is bailing out the stock holders. Not the people.

A bailout is rewarding failure. It does not make the industries find corrections that work. All a bailout will do is prolong the pain.

I believe the market in general knows that the bailouts we are doing will hurt the consumer even more than we would be without. I believed we would have a bad economy with either president, indicators have been there for at least a year now. However, I also believe it is compounded by fear of Obama's taxation plans. Because of that, I think the only thing government can do to help the economy is promise no increase in taxes, and even reduce corporate tax rates.

[Wild Cobra]

"MAKE them fix themselves"? No one can make them fix THEMSELVES. That would have already happened right? If they were capable, willing, or comepetent to do so?

I assume, Domesticated Garter, that you simply want the "free market" to fix what the "free market" brought about.

Markets should live and die free. Some en ies are dying. Let them.

[ChumpDumper]

Easy to say when your won job is not on the line.

[LnGrrrR]

If you did not save during the good times, you will after this .

When are the good times? lol

[Wild Cobra]

Easy to say when your won job is not on the line.

Just the cold hard facts. I've been laid off before. When the Semiconductor Indistry took a dump a few years back. I survived, so can others. Again, it's going to happen anyway if the corporate worlddoesn't get fixed. Bailouts will only delay the problem.

For everone. Did you know the Dow Jones consists of only 30 compaines:

3M
Alcoa
American Express
AT&T
Bank of America
Boeing
Caterpillar
Chevron Corporation
Citigroup
Coca-Cola
DuPont
ExxonMobil
General Electric
General Motors
Hewlett-Packard
Home Depot
Intel
IBM
Johnson & Johnson
JPMorgan Chase
Kraft Foods
McDonald's
Merck
Microsoft
Pfizer
Procter & Gamble
United Technologies Corporation
Verizon Communications
Walmart
Walt Disney

[ChumpDumper]

So the other stock indexes are doing great, right?

[2centsworth]

If that's the case, how do you ever even post to Spurstalk?

feel free to show me vato.

[Tully365]

He isn't president yet, dummy. (with all due affection to my favorite curmudgeon)

Kind of hard to issue executive orders and intiate policy proposals before you actually, say take the oath of office.

Ah, you and your objective facts...

It's absurd to see people saying nothing about Bush, who has presided over the economy the last eight years, and criticizing Obama, who is two months away from even being sworn in.

[Nbadan]

[2centsworth]

Ah, you and your objective facts...

It's absurd to see people saying nothing about Bush, who has presided over the economy the last eight years, and criticizing Obama, who is two months away from even being sworn in.

I'm the one supposedly "criticizing", but what I recommend you and the free-loader do is reread my post.

[Nbadan]

Sooner or later there has to be a loan, we just can't let them fail...

“Directly and indirectly, the economic breadth and contribution of the U.S. automotive industry is deep and far reaching across the country. U.S. automakers directly employ approximately 355,000 American workers and indirectly employ nearly 5 million additional jobs through related industries that are dependent on auto manufacturing, sales, and related activities. Over the last two decades, the automotive industry has invested nearly a quarter of a trillion dollars in the U.S. and is among this country’s top industries for R&D spending. Automakers also are among the largest purchasers of U.S.-manufactured steel, aluminum, iron, copper, plastics, rubber, electronics, and computer chips.”


"...Manufacturing directly employs 14 million America and supports 8 million more.

Each manufacturing job supports as many as four other jobs, providing a boost to local economies. For example, every 100 steel or every 100 auto jobs create between 400 and 500 new jobs in the rest of the economy. This contrasts with the retail sector, where every 100 jobs generate 94 new jobs elsewhere, and the personal and service sectors, where 100 jobs create 147 new jobs.


Well, there are a lot of good, compassionate reasons for picking those three, but if your goal is to save the Middle Class from extinction, then you…

Enact health care reform…to take the burden of wildly-overpriced employer-based health-care off the backs of American business, in order to make them more compe ive in the global marketplace.

Enact education reform…because the days of a million high-school drop outs making a Middle Class living pounding anvils and running lathes is over; because the new good jobs (and the prosperity of the nation) depends entirely on a skilled and adaptable labor force.

Pour real money into a green energy portfolio…first, because tethering your manufacturing and distribution systems to a variable like oil which is controlled by hostile foreign powers is suicidal. Second, because somebody’s gonna have to actually man-u-fac-ture the solar cells, fuels cells, windmills and so forth.

To pull us back from the feudal abyss, all these pistons (and more) need to be firing harmoniously in a 21st industrial engine powered by manufacturing.

Yes, the Big Three automakers have been run by short-sighted dolts with ridiculous business models.

So has the financial sector.

So shut up and fix them already..."

Link

[2centsworth]

Sooner or later there has to be a loan, we just can't let them fail...

an investment in the future yes, but to prolong the inevitable no. I like the Dems plan requiring a business plan.

[kwhitegocubs]

Well, I don't think anybody has been advocating carte blanche loans/balilouts to the automakers. It's just a matter of formulating a way to guarantee that the boundaries any bill would set forth would be reasonably followed.

GM's market cap is only 1.62 Billion, Ford is around 3 Billion - we could easily buy controlling interest in their shares and have control that way if we wanted to. THAT would be real socialism.

[2centsworth]

Well, I don't think anybody has been advocating carte blanche loans/balilouts to the automakers. It's just a matter of formulating a way to guarantee that the boundaries any bill would set forth would be reasonably followed.

GM's market cap is only 1.62 Billion, Ford is around 3 Billion - we could easily buy controlling interest in their shares and have control that way if we wanted to. THAT would be real socialism.

those market caps are brutal. Seems to me way too much needs to happen in order for any loan/bailout to be anything more than lifesupport.

[ducks]

Quit "whining", citizens. Phil Gramm, multi-millionaire, says everything is not only OK, but he has no regrets blocking the regulation of financial markets and obscure financial instruments.

The entire Repug/conservative philosophy of free markets and small government has been obliterated as corps and capitalists grovel on their obese bellies for govt welfare.

yep bigger goverment
want them to change your diaper to?

[ducks]

why can we not let them fail
if a small business is about to file bankrapacy
would you say the same thining?

[ducks]

"MAKE them fix themselves"? No one can make them fix THEMSELVES. That would have already happened right? If they were capable, willing, or comepetent to do so?

I assume, Domesticated Garter, that you simply want the "free market" to fix what the "free market" brought about.

you do realize david trump filed for money protection several times and now has money

same thing could happen again

[Tully365]

I'm the one supposedly "criticizing", but what I recommend you and the free-loader do is reread my post.

And Obama is keeping his mouth shut where he could just tell the
public that there will be no new taxes and tax cuts to get the
economy rolling. But he keeps hiding in the deep recesses of Chicago
and let's the people wonder what his policies are going to be.

Some damn leader. Maybe he, as a great socialist, wants things to
get just as bad as can be and then step in with Uncle Sugar and make
us all equally poor. Except of course the ruling class which will be
the socialist.

Surely after seeing the Dimms in action the last few days no one
really expects the dumb ass government to do anything but make lots
of noise and create confusion. Don't you love the 700 billion boost
in the economy.

That is absolutely correct. And he hasn't said anything different. As
far as most market/money people know bigger taxes are coming. And
he sits on his fist doing zip.

Actually, 2centsworth, I wasn't referring to you at all.

Random Guy answered an xrayzebra quote, and I agreed with him. I recommend you reread the thread.

[Cry Havoc]

Actually, 2centsworth, I wasn't referring to you at all.

Random Guy answered an xrayzebra quote, and I agreed with him. I recommend you reread the thread.

Makes it kind of easy to see how conservatives perceive the media to be so biased against them, doesn't it?

[johnsmith]

Makes it kind of easy to see how conservatives perceive the media to be so biased against them, doesn't it?

By misreading a quote on spurstalk.com?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

"won job"?

[boutons_]

Uncertainty sends Citigroup lower

Shares in Citigroup, one of the biggest banks in the US, fell sharply on Friday amid ongoing uncertainty over the company's future.


The stock rose in early trade but later declined 13%, in advance of a board meeting later on Friday.

The Wall Street Journal reported that Citigroup was considering selling parts of the firm. There are also rumours it might merge with another firm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7741463.stm

[2centsworth]

Actually, 2centsworth, I wasn't referring to you at all.

Random Guy answered an xrayzebra quote, and I agreed with him. I recommend you reread the thread.

I thought you guys would pick on someone your own size. my bad.

[2centsworth]

Makes it kind of easy to see how conservatives perceive the media to be so biased against them, doesn't it?

illogical and a huge stretch. wow, I just defined liberal.

[boutons_]

"how conservatives perceive the media to be so biased against them"

their hate-media is 100% right-wing

There was a study that showed Sunday morning guests were about 55% conservative vs 45% non-conservative.