Sheed or Dice?

[Big P]

No more old players.

[himat]

Sheed can get frustrating, but after having him on the Pistons for the last 4 years he is honestly one of a kind in the NBA. You will never see such a great player on and off the court. He is unique.

Both Sheed and Dice are great. I hope you guys can get one of them or maybe even both because they would help Tim Duncan SO MUCH!

Sheed is old but he still has great defense. The problem is that he is too slow to help cover for other people anymore, but that shouldn't be a concern when he has Tim Duncan with him. If you think Wallace X2 was great than this combination will be even better. A little less intimidating on defense but on offense it would be much better.

Dice is old but he wants the ring so bad that almost nothing slows him down in the playoffs. We got swept but Dice kept leaving his heart on the floor. During playoff time he would give you miraculous O-boards and clutch jumpshooting.

I hope you guys get them. Pistons cant offer them much anymore.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Wondering where the Spurs fans stand on this.....with a major retooling looming in Detroit, there's a strong chance that both Rasheed Wallace and Antonio McDyess will be available (and affordable). Who would you rather see paired with Duncan in SA?

Neither. Just what we need, another 35 year old on the team...

[meestahmeestah]

A fresh start would bring out that beast we saw in 2004 again.

that beast has 5 more years of tread on the tires.

I think the Spurs FO would be best off tossing out all those scouting reports and mock drafts from the late 90s. there's been a draft or two in between the times when Wallace or McDyess were impact players.

[mrs.purss]

No more has beens. Look at what all the has beens have been doing for us lately.

[smrattler]

Kevin Willis has been seen working out in Atlanta and wants an invite to an NBA camp too.

[SouthTexasRancher]

Oh is that what we need another forward? Dumb ass......So your idea is to spend our money on players that are old, and play the same spot as our best player. You need to pay attention before posting again!

Kid, there is such a thing as dumb. Then there is dumber. Then there is dumbest. You happen to be all 3, not to mention that when it comes to comprehension you are an imbecile and when it comes to the English language, you are simply put, a simpleton.

Now go back and get mommy to read my posts to you, including the previous 5-10 posts of mine on some of the other threads where I say we need a true 6'11" - 7'2" Center as well as a true backup Point Guard. I also have been emphatic about not wanting another old player. I specifically point out we need to get younger and more athletic.

Now tomorrow morning when you arrive at your Elementary school I want you to go up to your 4th Grade teacher and apologize to him or her and make a promise that you will from now on PAY F'ing ATTENTION because too damn many people have pointed out to you that you are an imbecilic, moronic, idiotic, Ignoramus and you really want to get some respect by the time you enter the 5th grade in 3 years.

Now go away or I'll call your grandmother and get her to get her paddle out and spank your butt...!!!

[SouthTexasRancher]

I know he gets T'ed a lot, but tell me of a real ocasion where you can trully say: "Look there's Wallace beign a cancer!"

Just Google up Rasheed Wallace and I'm sure you'll find what his past has been like. Sheed is just not Pop's type as most of us fans know. Just go back to the Rodman's, Jackson's (both of them) and so on. Neither Pop nor the Spurs need another headache at this point. It is imperative that we get younger, more athletic, longer, taller, quicker, smarter, and can put the damn ball in the basket. Like I said earlier, each of us have our opinion. It's just that IMHO, we can do better than Sheed for a lot less money.

[SouthTexasRancher]

Just Google up Rasheed Wallace and I'm sure you'll find what his past has been like. Sheed is just not Pop's type as most of us fans know. Just go back to the Rodman's, Jackson's (both of them) and so on. Neither Pop nor the Spurs need another headache at this point. It is imperative that we get younger, more athletic, longer, taller, quicker, smarter, and can put the damn ball in the basket. Like I said earlier, each of us have our opinion. It's just that IMHO, we can do better than Sheed for a lot less money.

Here you go DAF86... a little about his problems in the NBA. Too disruptive for Pop even though Sheed has been less troublesome the last 3 or 4 years and has done some good things off the court.

Rasheed Wallace
His career suffered from numerous missteps on and off the court. In the 1999-2000 NBA season, he set an NBA record with 38 technical fouls for the season. However, he would be fifth in the league in field goal percentage. The following year, he would break his own record with 40 technicals. Wallace was also suspended by the NBA for seven games for threatening then referee Tim Donaghy on an arena loading dock after a home game in 2003. That was the league's longest suspension for something that did not involve violence or substance abuse.

On June 2, 2007, Rasheed fouled out of Game 6 of the Eastern Conference Finals after committing a foul on LeBron James and then received two technical fouls, resulting in an automatic ejection, for arguing with a referee.In a postgame interview, Wallace stated that he was upset at the officiating and did not feel his emotional breakdown cost his team a chance to win.
In the 2008 Eastern Conference Finals, the Pistons played Garnett and the Celtics. This marked the sixth consecutive time that the Pistons had made it to this point, and five times they had gotten there with Wallace in the lineup. Still, Detroit lost a third consecutive year in the Conference Finals, losing to Boston 4-2. After the game, Rasheed reportedly told reporters, without taking any questions, "It's over, man," perhaps indicating that Pistons' General Manager Joe Dumars would break up the core of the team in the 2008 offseason.
Earlier in his career, he was widely considered a volatile player, and regularly led the NBA in technical fouls, setting a still-standing league record with 41 in 2000-2001. This problem has continued into his Piston days; Wallace again led the league five seasons later with 16 technicals. He used to be dubbed by NBA announcers as a "Walking Technical Foul".
Wallace always felt frustrated because he felt that he was being treated other than the "norm" in terms of NBA foul calling. One game seemed to be the breaking point, where one referee Tim Donaghy called extraordinary fouls at extraordinary times, which when Wallace complained, he received a technical. After the game out by the loading dock of The Rose Garden, referee Donaghy made an incendiary comment to Wallace, and Wallace offered to fight him. At the time, this was reported as "another athlete out of control" and Wallace was suspended for seven games.
Infamous on-court moments
During the 2008 Playoffs Wallace went on a expletive-laced tirade following Game 5 of the Eastern Conference Finals against the Boston Celtics in which he lashed out at the officiating, stating, "All that bull[expletive]-ass calls they had out there. With Mike [Callahan] and Kenny [Mauer] -- you've all seen that [expletive]," Wallace said. "You saw them calls. The cats are flopping all over the floor and they're calling that [expletive]. That [expletive] ain't basketball out there. It's all [expletive] entertainment. You all should know that [expletive]. It's all [expletive] entertainment." Wallace was fined $25,000 for his profanity and criticism. Wallace's comments were in response to a question about flopping. Earlier that day, the NBA stated that starting with the 2008-09 season, fines would be imposed by the league for obvious flops
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rasheed_Wallace
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** ********
Disruptive Behavior Made Him a Pariah
The Portland Trail Blazers organization sought to increase the team's chances of a championship, adding All-Star after All-Star to the roster. Yet Wallace's behavior seemed to spiral out of control, seemingly from the pressure. He began fighting with the referees over every perceived miscall. While most players and coaches argued to a certain point or even earned a technical before backing down, Wallace did not stop until he was ejected. At times, he would not stop even then. There were times fans even tried to get him to calm down. According to Sports Illustrated, during one heated argument with a referee, one fan yelled, "It's all right, 'Sheed. Just chill, just chill." But according to the Detroit Free Press, "'Sheed believes if there is a questionable call, he must protest...."
Wallace's positive stats continued to rise--reaching a high of 19.3 ppg and 8.2 rpg in the 2001-2002 season--but so did his technical fouls. In one season he received 38 technical fouls, only to follow that with 41 fouls the next season. His teammates and the coaching staff were at a loss in helping him keep his anger with the refs in check. In one instance he threw a towel in one referee's face, earning a two-game suspension and a $10,000 fine. Later Wallace threatened another referee and received a seven-game suspension.
Wallace also began acting out off the courts by refusing to sign autographs, ignoring fans, fighting with teammates, and refusing to give interviews, despite it being mandatory by the NBA. Though he acquiesced to the locker room interviews by taking his time changing and only answering a few questions filled with expletives, Wallace continued showing disdain during mandatory team events, including an appearance where he and others from the Portland organization gave Christmas trees to needy families in the Portland area.
While his teammates and head coach Mike Dunleavy tried to downplay Wallace's antics by talking to him both on and off the court, it soon took a toll on a team already at odds with one another over various things including playing time. Even though he would help the team make it to the playoffs every year starting in 1996, and twice reach the Western Finals, many were ready for a change. Wallace and fellow player, Damon Stoudamire, did not help the team's image by getting arrested after marijuana was found in the vehicle they were in. The charges were later dropped after each completed community service, stayed out of legal trouble, and underwent drug and alcohol counseling. But the damage had been done. Though it was not the first time a Portland Trail Blazer had been arrested, by the early 2000s this incident and others had earned the team a new nickname: the Portland Jail Blazers.
Found Home in Detroit
While rumors floated that Wallace would soon be traded, he made the task more difficult in 2003 by making comments in the Oregonian quoted in the Philadelphia Inquirer that NBA and Commissioner David Stern only "drafted n---- who were dumb and dumber." Many decried his statements, and Wallace apologized for using street language but he stood by what he said. While a number of organizations expressed interest in the talented power forward, a few reconsidered.
However, over the All-Star break in early 2004, Wallace was traded to the Atlanta Hawks. He played one game, then was traded to the Detroit Pistons. Though his new teammates were a little worried, his new coach, Larry Brown, was not. The whole organization was in agreement about bringing Wallace to the Motor City.
With a fresh start, Wallace helped the Detroit Pistons win their first championship in 15 years. A team known for working hard to win a game was the right fit for Wallace. Instead of being the franchise player, he found himself in a supporting role that suited him fine. While he continued to argue with the referees, he no longer received the large number of technicals he had received in the past, and his number of ejections reduced drastically. He soon signed a multi-year contract with The Pistons. Wallace was a factor in helping them reach the Finals in 2005, though they lost to the San Antonio Spurs. In Detroit Wallace largely shed the reputation as a troubled player and was widely supported by Detroit fans
http://www.answers.com/topic/rasheed-wallace

[TheSpursFNRule]

Sheed. Easily. And for all the "we need to get younger" crowd. Well guess what? We ed that up in the Duncan era. We should have started that mission right after the 06 mavs series. But now it would be poor repayment to Tim to surround him with a whole brand new cast with no experience in his last few years. Our only hope for another ship in the Duncan era is to pull a superstar veteran (and by veteran I don't mean someone who has obviously been past his prime for 5 years now like finley) like Sheed and hope he has enough in the tank to get us one more ship.

Lets face it...the youth movement isn't starting until after Timmy retires. So you may as well get used to some hard years ahead. Even though I wont complain. Who would have thought after MJ retired (the second time) that ten years later the Spurs would have the fourth most ships in NBA history and be arguably the third best franchise in NBA history? We have had a good run but it's about over. We all knew this day would come but it is still hard.

Excellent ing post.

[TheSpursFNRule]

The guy threatened Tim Donaghy because he has passion for the game. he will not handle the bull .

[gameFACE]

No old guys, please.

[Man In Black]

I'd take Sheed first, then Dice. Sheed and Dyess do what Gooden and Bonner do not do.
A) Either can play defense, and B) Either can make an open jumper with Wallace having better range. Gooden can make that jumper but his defense sucks. Bonner has shown in the past that he can make that jumper but it's inconsistent as and his defense sucks. I get that some people say they're old but with Duncan, you get 1 of those guys, plus Mahinmi, possibly Thomas or Splitter, then it's balanced out.
Getting 1 of those Detroit players means 1 thing, the most important thing that we all know, "It gives Pop a player where he DOES NOT have to give up offense for defense or vice-versa."

[mystargtr34]

Its easy to say no more old guys, or get younger. But how about giving an option thats better than a 35 year old Sheed, or a 35 year old Mcdyess - instead of just opposing age.

Matt Bonner is 6 years younger than both of them, but i would sure as prefer either a 35 year old Sheed or a 35 year old Dyess.

[50Bestspurever]

One more time!!! It doesn't ing matter who you surround timmy with, young or old. As long as they can help the greatest power forward to ever play the game win a ing le. Rebuild when timmy is gone cause I promise you we ain't never gonna be as blessed to have another Duncan, or come close to sniffing the finals anytime soon after timmy is gone. That is reality.

[angelbelow]

both for the veterans minimum. cant be any worst than oberto.

[mountainballer]

If anyone has any better young frontcourt players available in free agency for the MLE or less, feel free to let us know.

Shelden Williams?
yeah, I know. he didn't exactly look like he could be more than a 12th man. but this should make him available for a low price. not that I think he could be the new starting center for the Spurs. I just think he is better than what he showed.
just needs some good coaching to learn how to use his defensive potential without fouling. then he might become a useful rotation player from the bench, who works hard in the middle, rebounds and defends. Malik plus 2 inches. and the Malik concept did work a bit. (didn't work 7 millions worth though.)

Chris Anderson?
(ok, at 30 he isn't exactly young any more)
Nuggets for sure want to keep him, but considering they are already deep in lux tax territory for next season, (with only 8 players on the roster) they won't keep him at any price.

Chris Wilcox? (not a big fan, but Spurs were reportedly interested before deadline)
Marcin Gortat? (Magic also have assembled a very expensive roster. maybe not enough money to match left)

however, I think a quality big the Spurs can get via trade with a rebuilding and/or salary dumping team, if they offer a package of Bowen and Fab before July 1st. (when Fab's contract gets guaranteed).

[spursbird]

Neither.
We need young and athletic players like Ian and Gist.

[mountainballer]

Neither.
We need young and athletic players like Ian and Gist.

you did realize that Ian and Gist combine for 23 minutes of NBA experience?
no, not minutes per game. that the career total in minutes for both.

we are talking about players, who could become part of the regular rotation and who can contribute immediately. Ian and Gist might both be on the roster. but they will be 9th and 10th in the rotation at best.

[SanAntonioSpurs23]

Seriously even at their age both Sheed and Dice are better than Oberto, Bonner and KT. If you guys can point out a quality "young" big man that we can get for less than the Mid level feel free...... Spurs can't wait another 3 years for a young guy to develop, they need someone to help Duncan now and given how much Dice or Sheed would cost they look like our best bet.

Parker/Hill
Mason/Ginobili/Finley
Udoka/Gist/Bowen
Duncan/ Dice? Gooden?/Thomas
Sheed/ Bonner/ Mahinmi

[bdubya]

My $.02 - I'm not surprised folks have reservations about Sheed; he's still got the skills and the IQ, but the body is aging and the focus is questionable. (But he has NEVER been a cancer in Detroit. A hothead, sure, but cancer? NEVER.) It would be a gamble with a big downside....but OTOH, such a move could be just the thing to screw Sheed's head back on straight, and if it were, jeez that'd be a scary frontcourt. It's an outside shot, IMHO, and not one I'd expect the Spurs to take a gamble on.

Dice is going to be a contributor on a contending team next year. Period. The only knock on him is his age. His at ude, his IQ, his skills, his focus and determination are all beyond reproach, and he probably wants a ring worse than anybody else in the league. He was the most consistent and reliable frontcourt player for the Pistons this season, and without him we would have missed the playoffs by a fair margin. And he's far from finished; his career playoff high in points (26, along with ten boards) was set yesterday. Spurs would be wise to make a run at him this summer.

[Extra Stout]

If this were 2007, the Spurs would do well to focus on bringing in some young guys to develop with the aging veterans, so that by 2009 when the existing role players are washed up, the youngsters are spry and ready to contribute to a le run.

Yeah, that didn't happen.

Now, Duncan is nearly 33, and the Spurs have to consider that he only has a year or two left of being Tim Duncan. The team has the MLE available to sign free agents this summer, and several player contracts expiring in 2010 available to trade to teams looking to dump salary.

Things have to be done now. There is no waiting two years for young players to develop.

The Spurs have to find guys who can contribute now. If they happen to be veterans, so be it.

[eDizzle20]

I think the edition of either one of these guys would be great. This offseason the free agents aren't tremendously high caliber (at least the one the Spurs can afford). If the Spurs could sign either one to a one year deal go for it. At this point next year's team if going to be about the same. Next season we can really because of the expiring contracts of Ginobili and Bowen. I think a lot people tend to forget that age does not determine talent.

[manufan10]

+1

I would have been fine having Sheed for this end of the season run to replace Matt at center(I prefer Matt coming off the bench).

But, in terms of a long term deal Sheed will have to sign with the Spurs for the least amount possible for me to like the deal.

Plus Pop and Sheed probably wouldn't get along too well.

Remember that Sheed use to play under Larry Brown. I don't remember hearing anything about those two butting heads. Pop is cut from the same cloth as Larry Brown, and so I believe that Sheed and Pop wouldn't have a hard time getting along.

[Thomas82]

both for the veterans minimum. cant be any worst than oberto.

That would be gravy if we could get both.