If Duncan were to win an NBA Championship in the next few years...

[TheGreatYacht]

Please, then Pau prevented Kobe from winning more. Anyone can make excuses but your disregard for Game 7, which was a winnable game, not a blowout, makes you an non credible voice on the matter.

5 beats 4 every time... Oh so close to tying Kobe and getting the conversation with the truly great ones aka the 5 and up club.

Give me a break. Kobe is not even close to being a top 5. he's not even the 5th greatest Laker of all time. Kareem, Wilt, Magic, Shaq, and Jerry West (Mr. Clutch) are all better than.

Yeah its on Manu and Pop that Tim Duncan didnt make a 2 footer over a small forward.

Yeah it's mostly on Manu and Pop in Game 6 that Duncan didn't get his 5th ring and his 4th NBA Finals MVP. If Manu would've played average and Pop didn't outcoached himself in Game 6, then Timmy wouldn't have to blame himself for Game 7 unlike those two that refuse to take accountability.

You're such a ing re ... I mean a Kobe . You are brainwashed by DisneySPN. Go back downstairs or the BSPN forums

[Ice009]

I'm still angry at Manu and Tony Parker. These guys had a chance to step up and repay Tim for all that he's done for them, and they both couldn't close the deal in game 6 and 7. Tim, at 37, was still able to set it all up for them, and all they had to do was close the game, but they just couldn't return the favor and get it done.

One, or both of them had to step up in crunch time in game 6 or 7, but they just couldn't do it. Tim has to do it all himself (as usual), Kawhi tried his hardest, but Pop didn't utilize him enough earlier in the year so that he could have gotten the ball more and had plays run for him.

What a horrible finish to the season. Poor finish from Manu and TP. I will give TP a pass if he was seriously hampered by injury, but Manu, I'm finding it hard to give any kind of pass. He's been a top 3 favorite player of mine for the last 10 years or so, but man, he just didn't show up when he had to. Sloppy, unfocused performance from him, just wasn't anywhere near as sharp as he needed to be to help the team get it done.

The in the armor, to me, was when he was missing free throws in the regular season. I had always rated him as one of the best closing out a game free throw shooters of all time, a guy I'd want to take those free throw with the game on the line, but I should have known that when he was missing free throws during the regular season, it would come back to cost us in the biggest game of the season. It seemed like a focus problem, like he didn't have the same focus that he used to, not sure why, but he just wasn't sharp enough.

[TheGreatYacht]

I'm still angry at Manu and Tony Parker. These guys had a chance to step up and repay Tim for all that he's done for them, and they both couldn't close the deal in game 6 and 7. Tim, at 37, was still able to set it all up for them, and all they had to do was close the game, but they just couldn't return the favor and get it done.

One, or both of them had to step up in crunch time in game 6 or 7, but they just couldn't do it. Tim has to do it all himself (as usual), Kawhi tried his hardest, but Pop didn't utilize him enough earlier in the year so that he could have gotten the ball more and had plays run for him.

What a horrible finish to the season. Poor finish from Manu and TP. I will get TP a pass if he was seriously hampered by injury, but Manu, I'm finding it hard to give any kind of pass. He's been a top 3 favorite player of mine for the last 10 years or so, but man, he just didn't show up when he had to. Sloppy, unfocused performance from him, just wasn't anywhere near as sharp as he need to be to help get the team done.

The in the armor, to me, was when he was missing free throws in the regular season. I had always rated him as one of the best closing out a game free throw shooters of all time, a guy I'd want to take those free throw with the game on the line, but I should have known that when he was missing free throws during the regular season, it would come back to cost us in the biggest game of the season. It seemed like a focus problem, like he didn't have the same focus that he used to, not sure why, but he just wasn't sharp enough.

So am I. I saw some red lights from Manu too during the regular season. He would have like one good performance out of every four games.

I remember my younger brother would cuss at the TV and say "man I hope that ing old man retires, he can't do anymore." Believe it or not, I would actually defend Manu. I would tell my bro "calm down, he just got back from injury."

I had a lot of faith in Manu that if healthy, he would get back to normal. Apparently he proved me wrong. He said it himself during the NBA Finals "I'm fine, I'm healthy." Clearly he wasn't fine mentally or emotionally.

A lot of people won't beleive me but I haven't always been a Manu hater. He pissed me off during the NBA Finals. He really let the whole team down. I used to be proud of him.

[dallasmaverickslose]

So am I. I saw some red lights from Manu too during the regular season. He would have like one good performance out of every four games.

I remember my younger brother would cuss at the TV and say "man I hope that ing old man retires, he can't do anymore." Believe it or not, I would actually defend Manu. I would tell my bro "calm down, he just got back from injury."

I had a lot of faith in Manu that if healthy, he would get back to normal. Apparently he proved me wrong. He said it himself during the NBA Finals "I'm fine, I'm healthy." Clearly he wasn't fine mentally or emotionally.

A lot of people won't beleive me but I haven't always been a Manu hater. He pissed me off during the NBA Finals. He really let the whole team down. I used to be proud of him.

Wah. Wah. Wah.

[Sean Cagney]

I'm still angry at Manu and Tony Parker. These guys had a chance to step up and repay Tim for all that he's done for them, and they both couldn't close the deal in game 6 and 7. Tim, at 37, was still able to set it all up for them, and all they had to do was close the game, but they just couldn't return the favor and get it done.

One, or both of them had to step up in crunch time in game 6 or 7, but they just couldn't do it. Tim has to do it all himself (as usual), Kawhi tried his hardest, but Pop didn't utilize him enough earlier in the year so that he could have gotten the ball more and had plays run for him.

What a horrible finish to the season. Poor finish from Manu and TP. I will give TP a pass if he was seriously hampered by injury, but Manu, I'm finding it hard to give any kind of pass. He's been a top 3 favorite player of mine for the last 10 years or so, but man, he just didn't show up when he had to. Sloppy, unfocused performance from him, just wasn't anywhere near as sharp as he needed to be to help the team get it done.

The in the armor, to me, was when he was missing free throws in the regular season. I had always rated him as one of the best closing out a game free throw shooters of all time, a guy I'd want to take those free throw with the game on the line, but I should have known that when he was missing free throws during the regular season, it would come back to cost us in the biggest game of the season. It seemed like a focus problem, like he didn't have the same focus that he used to, not sure why, but he just wasn't sharp enough.

When Manu started missing FT's late in games I knew something was wrong with him man, he used to be ICE from there and hit them all and I wanted the ball in his hands late at all times. Great point there, he started that in the regular season late. I feel he loset his confidence or lacked focus like you said.

[therealtruth]

The in the armor, to me, was when he was missing free throws in the regular season. I had always rated him as one of the best closing out a game free throw shooters of all time, a guy I'd want to take those free throw with the game on the line, but I should have known that when he was missing free throws during the regular season, it would come back to cost us in the biggest game of the season. It seemed like a focus problem, like he didn't have the same focus that he used to, not sure why, but he just wasn't sharp enough.

I think this hits the nail on the head that it wasn't a physical problem with Manu. More of a focus problem. He's got to get his focus back.

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

Give me a break. Kobe is not even close to being a top 5. he's not even the 5th greatest Laker of all time. Kareem, Wilt, Magic, Shaq, and Jerry West (Mr. Clutch) are all better than. Yeah it's mostly on Manu and Pop in Game 6 that Duncan didn't get his 5th ring and his 4th NBA Finals MVP. If Manu would've played average and Pop didn't outcoached himself in Game 6, then Timmy wouldn't have to blame himself for Game 7 unlike those two that refuse to take accountability.

You're such a ing re ... I mean a Kobe . You are brainwashed by DisneySPN. Go back downstairs or the BSPN forums

That's ok because Jerry, Magic and Shaq all called Kobe the greatest Laker of all time. I can't say some bag Tim Duncan semen sucker is exactly the authority on the subject.

Back to Tim Duncan's botched layup on a small forward in Game 7 of the NBA Finals...

You're right! The le was lost in Game 6! There shouldn't even have been a Game 7 and the league should have awarded the Heat the championship right then and there. At least we wouldn't have to hear excuses for Tim Duncan's legacy sealing unclutch play if they had.

[hitmantb]

Pippen has 6 rings to Kobe's 5, but no one is calling him better than Kobe, you know why? Because they don't hand final MVP's and all-time great's to side kick's.

Kobe has won 2 legitimate finals MVP's to Duncan's 3. 1 regular season MVP to Duncan's 2. I will say many consider Duncan to be > Parker in 2007, just that he was generous enough to let Parker pad his stats against an over-matched Cleveland team, and many consider Gasol the finals MVP of the series vs Celtics in 2010. Duncan is too kind but it is what it is.

Sorry rings along doesn't mean anything, unless Kobe wants to admit Pippen is > him. I would rank him in Duncan/Shaq's league for sure, he has one more ring but both Shaq and Duncan each has 1 more final MVP + MVP. They are the top 3 players of their generation but because Shaq/Kobe played together, Duncan individually should be ranked ahead since he did not have an all time great and a much smaller market to work with.

[Ice009]

At least we wouldn't have to hear excuses for Tim Duncan's legacy sealing unclutch play if they had.

Tim missed that one and it will haunt him for a long time, but overall, Tim Duncan is one of the most clutch big men of all time. That's what separates Tim from other great big men. He's one of the most clutch of all time, usually, it's guards and forwards who make most of the clutch plays, but as far as bigs go, most suck in crunch time. Tim may have missed that one, and it was a big one, but overall he's come up big more times that not.

Apart from Dirk, can anyone name big men that were clutch in crunch time?

Karl Malone - DEFINITELY NOT CLUTCH (That's why I will never say he is in the conversation for best PF ever)
Webber - Awful. I think everyone knows the Michigan incident?
Shaq - best to pass the ball to Kobe or Wade in tight games
Olajuwon - Not great in crunch time, but not horrid. Rockets fans will have to correct me on that.
D-Rob - Not clutch
Ewing - Forget about it
KG - Hot Potato, pass the ball to someone else for most of his career with the game on the line. That's why McHale said he traded him, couldn't give him the ball with 5 minutes to go and have him win the game for you like a Tim Duncan could.
Wilt - Not clutch from what I am told
Bill Russell - I assume he didn't have the ball much as he was more of a defensive player, and also had those all-star guards to give to ball to.
Kareem - Not sure, Lakers fans will have to chime in.
Barkley - Not sure, as I wasn't a fan. I assume he was clutch the one season they made the finals, but overall probably not (since they choked series that they should have won after that).

If you want to consider Lebron a PF, then you could even add him to the list, as he's been mediocre most of his career in crunch time too.

To close, as previously mentioned, there never should have been a game 6, Tim's guards let him down. You can now go crawl back into Kobe's 5 ring asshole.

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

Tim missed that one and it will haunt him for a long time, but overall, Tim Duncan is one of the most clutch big men of all time. That's what separates Tim from other great big men. He's one of the most clutch of all time, usually, it's guards and forwards who make most of the clutch plays, but as far as bigs go, most suck in crunch time. Tim may have missed that one, and it was a big one, but overall he's come up big more times that not.

Apart from Dirk, can anyone name big men that were clutch in crunch time?

Karl Malone - DEFINITELY NOT CLUTCH (That's why I will never say he is in the conversation for best PF ever)
Webber - Awful. I think everyone knows the Michigan incident?
Shaq - best to pass the ball to Kobe or Wade in tight games
Olajuwon - Not great in crunch time, but not horrid. Rockets fans will have to correct me on that.
D-Rob - Not clutch
Ewing - Forget about it
KG - Hot Potato, pass the ball to someone else for most of his career with the game on the line. That's why McHale said he traded him, couldn't give him the ball with 5 minutes to go and have him win the game for you like a Tim Duncan could.
Wilt - Not clutch from what I am told
Bill Russell - I assume he didn't have the ball much as he was more of a defensive player, and also had those all-star guards to give to ball to.
Kareem - Not sure, Lakers fans will have to chime in.
Barkley - Not sure, as I wasn't a fan. I assume he was clutch the one season they made the finals, but overall probably not (since they choked series that they should have won after that).

If you want to consider Lebron a PF, then you could even add him to the list, as he's been mediocre most of his career in crunch time too.

To close, as previously mentioned, there never should have been a game 6, Tim's guards let him down. You can now go crawl back into Kobe's 5 ring asshole.

You forgot to add Tim Duncan in the unclutch category. He botched the biggest shot of his little engine that could career over a shrimp defender no less sealing his fate as a 2nd rate superstar. Nothing wrong with being 11-12 all time though, that's a big accomplishment for such a small market.

[TheGreatYacht]

You forgot to add Tim Duncan in the unclutch category. He botched the biggest shot of his little engine that could career over a shrimp defender no less sealing his fate as a 2nd rate superstar. Nothing wrong with being 11-12 all time though, that's a big accomplishment for such a small market.

Hey Kobe , check out these facts before you open your mouth.



With the game on the line

Trailing by one or two points, or tied, in the final 24 seconds of regular-season and playoff games since 1996-97, with a minimum of 30 shots. From Alok Pattani of ESPN Stats & Information.

Player	Makes	Attempts	FG%
Carmelo Anthony	21	44	47.7
Chris Paul	14	31	45.2
Shawn Marion	12	30	40
Brandon Roy	12	30	40
Hedo Turkoglu	12	30	40
Rashard Lewis	18	46	39.1
Glenn Robinson	14	36	38.9
Deron Williams	14	36	38.9
Mike Bibby	15	39	38.5
Dirk Nowitzki	25	65	38.5
Jalen Rose	12	32	37.5
Tim Duncan	23	62	37.1
Eddie Jones	13	36	36.1
Karl Malone	11	31	35.5
Ben Gordon	17	49	34.7
Chris Webber	18	52	34.6
Raymond Felton	12	36	33.3
LeBron James	23	69	33.3
Ray Allen	23	70	32.9
Gilbert Arenas	13	40	32.5
Vince Carter	31	96	32.3
Steve Francis	14	44	31.8
Damon Stoudamire	12	38	31.6
Nick Van Exel	16	51	31.4
Kobe Bryant	36	115	31.3
Jason Terry	14	45	31.1
Allen Iverson	21	68	30.9
Kevin Garnett	22	72	30.6
Ron Artest	9	30	30
Allan Houston	12	41	29.3
Entire league	2038	6861	29.7

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/pos...in-crunch-time

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

Hey Kobe , check out these facts before you open your mouth.



With the game on the line

Trailing by one or two points, or tied, in the final 24 seconds of regular-season and playoff games since 1996-97, with a minimum of 30 shots. From Alok Pattani of ESPN Stats & Information.

Player	Makes	Attempts	FG%
Carmelo Anthony	21	44	47.7
Chris Paul	14	31	45.2
Shawn Marion	12	30	40
Brandon Roy	12	30	40
Hedo Turkoglu	12	30	40
Rashard Lewis	18	46	39.1
Glenn Robinson	14	36	38.9
Deron Williams	14	36	38.9
Mike Bibby	15	39	38.5
Dirk Nowitzki	25	65	38.5
Jalen Rose	12	32	37.5
Tim Duncan	23	62	37.1
Eddie Jones	13	36	36.1
Karl Malone	11	31	35.5
Ben Gordon	17	49	34.7
Chris Webber	18	52	34.6
Raymond Felton	12	36	33.3
LeBron James	23	69	33.3
Ray Allen	23	70	32.9
Gilbert Arenas	13	40	32.5
Vince Carter	31	96	32.3
Steve Francis	14	44	31.8
Damon Stoudamire	12	38	31.6
Nick Van Exel	16	51	31.4
Kobe Bryant	36	115	31.3
Jason Terry	14	45	31.1
Allen Iverson	21	68	30.9
Kevin Garnett	22	72	30.6
Ron Artest	9	30	30
Allan Houston	12	41	29.3
Entire league	2038	6861	29.7

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/pos...in-crunch-time

Which is proof postive that stat worship is for clipboard holding gots.

I just watched Tim Duncan miss the most important shot of his career in the biggest game of his career, lol. That's not clutch. So keep posting irrelevant regular season catalogue of numbers based on arbitrary parameters on your Duncan worship site to mask the fact that your hero isn't as legendary as ya'll thought.

Don't worry, the objective basketball fans took note.

[TheGreatYacht]

Which is proof postive that stat worship is for clipboard holding gots.

I just watched Tim Duncan miss the most important shot of his career in the biggest game of his career, lol. That's not clutch. So keep posting irrelevant regular season catalogue of numbers based on arbitrary parameters on your Duncan worship site to mask the fact that your hero isn't as legendary as ya'll thought.

Don't worry, the objective basketball fans took note.

@ a classical Kobe that ignores facts. @ a Kobe calling himself objective. Go downstairs or go back to the ESPN boards you head.

[Ice009]

You forgot to add Tim Duncan in the unclutch category. He botched the biggest shot of his little engine that could career over a shrimp defender no less sealing his fate as a 2nd rate superstar. Nothing wrong with being 11-12 all time though, that's a big accomplishment for such a small market.

LOL, what a pathetic response.

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

@ a classical Kobe that ignores facts. @ a Kobe calling himself objective. Go downstairs or go back to the ESPN boards you head.

The fact that he botched a layup in game 7 of the finals?