If Dirk wins the le this year, he will be better than Duncan

[joshdaboss]

THAT RUN in 03 is legendary! Heads stop looking at Dirks 28 ppg and realize Tim put up 25 and 15 and however many blocks and assists a game! Come on now stop it, just stop it!

When you look at the numbers of his teammates, it becomes absurd that they won a ring that season. It's the only time I can remember that literally 1 player put an entire team on his back and won them a championship.

[Nathan Explosion]

When you look at the numbers of his teammates, it becomes absurd that they won a ring that season. It's the only time I can remember that literally 1 player put an entire team on his back and won them a championship.

Just look at the clinching game of the Finals to see how dominant Tim was. It's one of the greatest Finals performances ever.

But, as a Spurs fan, I have to be fair. Wade carried the Heat to a le in 2006. He was far and away their best player.

As for the Dirk talk, I'll bite. Dirk hasn't approaced anything alone the lines of 22 pts, 20 reb, 10 asst and 8 blks. When Dirk can post a complete stat line like that in a clinching game, then we'll talk.

Also, in 2005, Duncan pretty much outscored and outrebounded both Sheed and Ben COMBINED in the Spurs 4 wins. That's pretty ing impressive.

So, again, when Dirk plays like Duncan in 2003 and 2005, wins 4 rings and 3 Finals MVPs, he can enter the discussion with Duncan.

[joshdaboss]

But, as a Spurs fan, I have to be fair. Wade carried the Heat to a le in 2006. He was far and away their best player.

Shaq was on his team. That wasn't a washed-up LeBron James Shaq, either.

[Nathan Explosion]

Shaq was on his team. That wasn't a washed-up LeBron James Shaq, either.

But he wasn't great either. He averaged double figures, but Wade was far and away better. , Wade score 36 in Game 6 with Shaq chipping in a mind blowing 9 points.

[dirk4mvp]

You'd think it'd be easier for a perimeter player to score with the threat of a HOF center averaging 20 and 9 down low.

[MiamiHeatNumba1]

Not using this as an excuse, but I think people forget about the injuries to Chris Webber in 2003 and then the injury to Dirk Nowitzki. If Webber doesn't go down Mavs don't advance, and I don't think a healthy Kings or Mavs team would have lost in 7 to that Spurs team.

It is what it is though. Duncan is widely considered the greatest PF of all time, but there's a lot of arguments for and against that. It might be easier to talk about when it is all said and done though. Duncan is on his way out, and Dirk is still producing at some of the highest level so let these boys finish their careers then sort it out. Even then who knows what the up-and-coming power forwards will bring. It's not like Blake Griffin, Kevin Love, Gallinari, even Bosh if you want to go back a few years, etc. got drafted into a team with a David Robinson caliber player to help them shape their legacy from day one.

[DMC]

The ignant in this thread is astounding.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

'05 Duncan beat the Pistons. That was a pretty demanding task if you ask me. I mean seriously. That Pistons team was pretty freaking good. I would take an '05 Rip Hamilton, Chauncey Billups, Rasheed Wallace, Ben Wallace, Tayshaun Prince, over LeBron, Wade, and Bosh any day. That was a pretty nasty starting 5.

I would much rather play against a 3 man circus than a full starting squad of solid team players fresh off of a championship. I think 4 of them were all stars the next year or year before or something like that. Oh yea, the Pistons were also coached by Larry Brown too btw.

Ginobili clearly should have been named Finals MVP on '05.

I'm not saying Timmy wasn't essential to the win. But, he wasn't the MVP of the series against Detroit.

, the vast majority of spurs fans were consistently giving "MVP chants" to Ginobili in that series -



Timmy's '99 and '03 Finals MVP were well deserved, however. '07 was rightly given to Tony Parker. '05 was wrongly taken away from Ginobili.

Timmy's 2010-2011 All Star spot was wrongly taken away from Tony Parker (if you had to choose two people from the spurs). Tony deserved it more than Timmy this year.

You have to consider context when assessing whether or not certain awards are actually warranted.

[joshdaboss]

Ginobili clearly should have been named Finals MVP on '05.

I'm not saying Timmy wasn't essential to the win. But, he wasn't the MVP of the series against Detroit.

, the vast majority of spurs fans were consistently giving "MVP chants" to Ginobili in that series -



Timmy's '99 and '03 Finals MVP were well deserved, however. '07 was rightly given to Tony Parker. '05 was wrongly taken away from Ginobili.

Timmy's 2010-2011 All Star spot was wrongly taken away from Tony Parker (if you had to choose two people from the spurs). Tony deserved it more than Timmy this year.

You have to consider context when assessing whether or not certain awards are actually warranted.

You're insane. I'm surprised you aren't a Laker fan with an assessment like this. Ginobili may have scored more down the stretch, but nobody was more valuable to the team than Duncan -- scoring is NOT everything. Duncan dominates on both ends of the floor, not one.

edit: Also, the 2007 MVP going to Parker was a perfect example of what a joke it is how taken for granted Duncan is, he clearly deserved the award but the fact that Parker scored more got him votes. Let's just completely forget the fact Parker is a bigger defensive liability than Matt Bonner, ten fold.

[crc21209]

They see me trolling...they hating..

[DMC]

What team in history has had 3 Finals MVPs on the same team? I cannot think of any that even had 2 (I haven't researched it, maybe Magic's Lakers or the old Celtics). That Ginobili was even considered for it is a testament to Tim Duncan. A great player makes his teammates better. Robinson was a great player, but I don't think anyone made his teammates better than Duncan made his.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

You could make the argument that Duncan and Ginobili benefited synergistically off of each other's scoring threats during that series.

Yes, Duncan was clearly the established "future hall of famer" scoring threat to start the series, but once Ginobili emerged as a threat both of them benefited.

[stxspurs]

Tim Duncan
1997-98 NBA Rookie of the Year
1998-99 NBA Finals MVP
1999-00 NBA All-Star Game MVP
2001-02 NBA MVP
2002-03 NBA Finals MVP
2002-03 NBA MVP
2004-05 NBA Finals MVP
4 time champion

Dirk Nowitzki
Most Valuable Player (2007)

yeah mav fans your right...dirk is better

[Sean Cagney]

Not using this as an excuse, but I think people forget about the injuries to Chris Webber in 2003 and then the injury to Dirk Nowitzki. If Webber doesn't go down Mavs don't advance, and I don't think a healthy Kings or Mavs team would have lost in 7 to that Spurs team.

.

Bhwhwhahhahahahahahahahaahahah, okay bruh, stop it. Spurs beat LA that year, after that nothing was GONNA STOP THEM, just stop it.

Spurs 3-1 and matched up very WELL with the Kings that year! Dallas? OH my please, no frontline and won game one after 50 ft's, after that the Spurs were up basically after BLOWING game one 2-1 with Dirk in there, come on now man are you serious? ARE YOU SERIOUS? This argument is weak, nothing was gonna stop the Spurs that year. Tim was on a mission.

[Muse]

The 2003 Mavs would have probably beat the Spurs if Dirk hadn't gone down.

Dirk should have 2 rings and 2 finals MVP's if it wasn't for injuries or stern fixing the NBA finals

[Mal]

The 2003 Mavs would have probably beat the Spurs if Dirk hadn't gone down.

Dirk should have 2 rings and 2 finals MVP's if it wasn't for injuries or stern fixing the NBA finals

[MiamiHeatNumba1]

Bhwhwhahhahahahahahahahaahahah, okay bruh, stop it. Spurs beat LA that year, after that nothing was GONNA STOP THEM, just stop it.

Spurs 3-1 and matched up very WELL with the Kings that year! Dallas? OH my please, no frontline and won game one after 50 ft's, after that the Spurs were up basically after BLOWING game one 2-1 with Dirk in there, come on now man are you serious? ARE YOU SERIOUS? This argument is weak, nothing was gonna stop the Spurs that year. Tim was on a mission.

Spurs were 3-1 against the Kings that year, true, but the one Kings win was a blowout. Two of the three losses went down to the wire while the other was close, one game was without Webber, and the Spurs shot 10+ more FT's in each of the wins. Yes I 100% believe that they just would have rolled past Sacramento... oh wait...

Dallas shot 50 freebies in game one, okay, Spurs shot 48 that same game. Not really a huge differential there unless you want to discuss how Dallas got more to go in the bucket.

Since you opened up that can of worms how about we look at Game 2... Dallas shot 22 freebies... Spurs... 45? What? Oh and this Game 2 trend continues for the entire series.

Granted, I'm not here to make a case for Dallas so I'll just stop there. San Antonio won in 6, went 2-1 against Dirk and co. and 2-1 against Dirkless Mavs. Props to your team if you want props. Nobody knows what would have happened if Webber or Dirk would have stayed healthy anyway, but to say that it didn't practically give away the WCF trophy is just denial at its best.

[djohn2oo8]

Tim Duncan
1997-98 NBA Rookie of the Year
1998-99 NBA Finals MVP
1999-00 NBA All-Star Game MVP
2001-02 NBA MVP
2002-03 NBA Finals MVP
2002-03 NBA MVP
2004-05 NBA Finals MVP
4 time champion

Dirk Nowitzki
Most Valuable Player (2007)

yeah mav fans your right...dirk is better

You got trolled BIG time

[baseline bum]

The 2003 Mavs would have probably beat the Spurs if Dirk hadn't gone down.

Dirk should have 2 rings and 2 finals MVP's if it wasn't for injuries or stern fixing the NBA finals

There was no way Dallas was winning that series with 2003 Nowitzki guarding 2003 Duncan. Revisionist history at its finest.

[TampaDude]

THAT RUN in 03 is legendary! Heads stop looking at Dirks 28 ppg and realize Tim put up 25 and 15 and however many blocks and assists a game! Come on now stop it, just stop it!

^ this

[dunkman]

No, Duncan had much better career so far.

[Nathan Explosion]

You're insane. I'm surprised you aren't a Laker fan with an assessment like this. Ginobili may have scored more down the stretch, but nobody was more valuable to the team than Duncan -- scoring is NOT everything. Duncan dominates on both ends of the floor, not one.

edit: Also, the 2007 MVP going to Parker was a perfect example of what a joke it is how taken for granted Duncan is, he clearly deserved the award but the fact that Parker scored more got him votes. Let's just completely forget the fact Parker is a bigger defensive liability than Matt Bonner, ten fold.

This. Again, Gino was scoring points, but Duncan was outscoring and outrebounding Ben and Sheed COMBINED. He was negating two of the 5 players leaving the Spurs to go 4 on 3 basically. When you're outproducing 2 NBA starters on a defending champion, you're pretty ing good.

Plus, go look at the games again. Everyone remembers Gino's late game shots, but everyone forgets that Duncan was the most consistent player. He'd single handedly keep the Spurs in Game 5 and 7 until Gino took over in the 4th.

In 2007, it was Duncan's defense that set the tone for the entire series. In the first game in the first quarter Duncan blocks Lebron, Lebron recovers the ball and Duncan has to guard him 1 on 1 on the perimeter. Duncan digs in and forces Lebron to take a fallaway jumper with the shot clock running down. When I saw that, I thought, "Wow, Duncan is sending a message to both teams that the he's here to win this series, not just be happy to be there." As if the Spurs somehow forgot that.