Chicago teachers strike

[Nbadan]

I know several teachers in the Chicago area after living there for a couple of years. None of them make even CLOSE to $76k. That figure sounds pretty far out there, TBH.

No surprise there....the anti-education crowd has a nack for using Ryan-like facts to support their stupid claims..

[Jacob1983]

The public school system in America is pathetic in my opinion. It's a in' joke in Texas. Texas public schools are all about getting the little peckers to pass their pressure standardized tests so undeserving teachers get bonuses from good test scores. The public school system in America would be better if schools actually taught kids life skills that they can use once they are out of high school like how to fill out a job application, make a resume, open a bank account, job interviewing, filling out other important life do ents, how to fiend for yourself in this evil world, etc...

[baseline bum]

No surprise there....the anti-education crowd has a nack for using Ryan-like facts to support their stupid claims..

That number does sound like bull . The source seems to be John Fund from the National Review. Salary.com has the median income at about $54,000 for public school teachers in Chicago, with the top 10% at $70,000.

http://swz.salary.com/SalaryWizard/P...hicago-IL.aspx

[Nbadan]

Salary.com has the median income at about $54,000 for public school teachers in Chicago, with the top 10% at $70,000.

How much would you expect to make with a Masters degree and/or after having worked at any profession for 30+ years Bum? Unlike other professions where there is bonus pay for over-achievers and promotions to a higher level position....the only way to make more money as a teacher is to get out of the classroom and become a specialist or an administrator...there are teachers who have been teaching in TX for close to 20 years who are the top of their game and still make less than 52K per year...not more than an average teacher....besides personal drive, which crashes hard in the face of 70+ hour work weeks, tyrannical principals, a mountain of paperwork, helicopter parents, and low to no-motivated students, where is the incentive to over achieve?

[Jacob1983]

Explain to me how standardized state tests help a kid be successful in life. How does that prepare them for real life? What types of skills do they get from standardized state tests?

[Nbadan]

Explain to me how standardized state tests help a kid be successful in life. How does that prepare them for real life? What types of skills do they get from standardized state tests?

Right now, how to take a test....although more states are adapting tests where students must be able to synthesize information they learn in class by using it in other ways, but it will be awhile before students can be adapted to think at this higher level...that said, politicians have very little patience...this is why almost every district in the country will fail AYP next year and be subject to state bureaucracy and school choice....its an impossible standard..

[Wild Cobra]

Do you make more than a Portland police officer, WC?

Probably, but I have skill sets they don't. Far more people can teach than have the skills that i have for my job.

Those who can, do. those who can't, teach.

[Nbadan]

Those who can, do. those who can't, teach.

Your an ass hat...you know nothing about teaching, teachers, or education in general..

[Wild Cobra]

Your an ass hat...you know nothing about teaching, teachers, or education in general..

It's a common saying. I though I would repeat it.

We have these teacher arguments here is Oregon too. Teacher get paid way to much for the job they do. There is nothing that special to teach kids Math, English, Science, etc, to warrant such exuberant wages and benefits.

[boutons_deux]

Why the Chicago Teachers Strike Is Really About Better Schools

But at its heart, the strike is over the union's deep opposition to what it calls a "corporate reform agenda" that pursues a compe ive or punitive relationship with teachers, rather than a collaborative one. Examples include blaming teachers and unions for educational shortcomings, promoting private but publicly financed charter schools, focusing on high-stakes tests and tying pay to merit.

CTU has instead pushed for smaller classes, enriched curriculum, better supplies and facilities, fairer and fuller funding (including the return of some public revenue long diverted into " TIFs" to subsidize developers), more counselors and support staff, respect for teacher professionalism, and a bigger say for teachers in their schools.

That clash puts the union at odds with CPS, the mayor and President Obama--whose education secretary, Arne Duncan, boosted the corporate-reform agenda as former Mayor Richard M. Daley's school superintendent. It also represents a more forceful rejection of such reforms than espoused by the national union, which nonetheless supports the CTU strike.

http://www.alternet.org/education/wh...tter708011&t=8

The strike is over much more than the mythical $76K.

The corporatization, privatization of school systems is part of the VRWC/ALEC agenda to destroy the teachers union as a scource of Dem funding and votes.

It's absolutely NOT about education.

[coyotes_geek]

That number does sound like bull . The source seems to be John Fund from the National Review. Salary.com has the median income at about $54,000 for public school teachers in Chicago, with the top 10% at $70,000.

http://swz.salary.com/SalaryWizard/P...hicago-IL.aspx

FWIW...

By comparison, teachers in New York City earn an average of $73,751. That would be less than the average $76,000 average salary for Chicago teachers cited by CPS, but more than the $71,000 average cited by the union. Depending on which is accurate, Chicago would either be first or second in the nation in average teacher salary.

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/06/...teachers-make/

[101A]

How much would you expect to make with a Masters degree and/or after having worked at any profession for 30+ years Bum? Unlike other professions where there is bonus pay for over-achievers and promotions to a higher level position....the only way to make more money as a teacher is to get out of the classroom and become a specialist or an administrator...there are teachers who have been teaching in TX for close to 20 years who are the top of their game and still make less than 52K per year...not more than an average teacher....besides personal drive, which crashes hard in the face of 70+ hour work weeks, tyrannical principals, a mountain of paperwork, helicopter parents, and low to no-motivated students, where is the incentive to over achieve?

M.ed. <<<<<<< M. of anything else

Local district pays for students to get graduate degrees (Masters AND Ph.D.) from local University (serious quid pro quo mutually beneficial relationship there). Classes are a complete joke; profs openly talk about how their "Masters" level classes for teachers are less rigorous than their 101 classes for Freshmen. However, if they dare fail those teachers, the administration comes to talk to them about it. Run them through; cash the tuition checks from the School District.

[Homeland Security]

The public school system in America is pathetic in my opinion. It's a in' joke in Texas. Texas public schools are all about getting the little peckers to pass their pressure standardized tests so undeserving teachers get bonuses from good test scores. The public school system in America would be better if schools actually taught kids life skills that they can use once they are out of high school like how to fill out a job application, make a resume, open a bank account, job interviewing, filling out other important life do ents, how to fiend for yourself in this evil world, etc...

Most of the pathology in the American school system stems from the refusal to accept that blacks on average are one standard deviation less intelligent than whites, controlling for socioeconomic and cultural factors. Since they can't compete, we've set up this system to pretend that they can and throw resources at dragging as many across the line as we can.

There isn't really a solution; if it were just Hispanics we could teach them the skilled crafts and turn them loose to make $100K and send their kids to college. But with the low blacks, you have to throw so many resources at them just to make them competent to work at Subway. They'll always be a drag on society.

[Homeland Security]

That clash puts the union at odds with CPS, the mayor and President Obama--whose education secretary, Arne Duncan, boosted the corporate-reform agenda as former Mayor Richard M. Daley's school superintendent. It also represents a more forceful rejection of such reforms than espoused by the national union, which nonetheless supports the CTU strike.

...

The corporatization, privatization of school systems is part of the VRWC/ALEC agenda to destroy the teachers union as a scource of Dem funding and votes.

I know it's boutons and his dazzling 65 IQ, but I couldn't help but LOL at this assertion that the Obama Administration is part of a conspiracy to undermine Democratic funding and votes.

[TeyshaBlue]

It's a common saying. I though I would repeat it.

We have these teacher arguments here is Oregon too. Teacher get paid way to much for the job they do. There is nothing that special to teach kids Math, English, Science, etc, to warrant such exuberant wages and benefits.

There's alot of common sayings that are absolute bull . Yet, you seem to think this one's accurate. smh

[Latarian Milton]

The public school system in America is pathetic in my opinion. It's a in' joke in Texas. Texas public schools are all about getting the little peckers to pass their pressure standardized tests so undeserving teachers get bonuses from good test scores. The public school system in America would be better if schools actually taught kids life skills that they can use once they are out of high school like how to fill out a job application, make a resume, open a bank account, job interviewing, filling out other important life do ents, how to fiend for yourself in this evil world, etc...

your making some good point here imho and hope you aren't making the rant only to protest your personal remorse, but also the public suffering as well. the school system is ed but i think it's the sector of colleges, rather than that of middle/high schools or elementary schools that takes the major brunt. hs kids are not supposed to be taught those advanced skills that you think should be useful in their lives cuz they're beyond kids' abilities to absorb at early ages and that's why they need to attend colleges after graduating from high schools rather than get dropped straightly into the cruel world.

colleges on the other hand are handing away degrees way too easily and there becoming more and more of a bridge for foreign students who want to immigrate to the US, or simply steal technologies from the US back to their countries. while most local students are often denied the chance to continue their studies due to the fact they can't afford the skyrocketing tuition, immigrants & foreigners are getting free-education plus maybe scholarships to help cover their living cost, and you know every ing penny comes from American taxpayers

[coyotes_geek]

hs kids are not supposed to be taught those advanced skills that you think should be useful in their lives cuz they're beyond kids' abilities to absorb at early ages and that's why they need to attend colleges after graduating from high schools rather than get dropped straightly into the cruel world.

Couldn't disagree more. College isn't for everyone. I also strongly disagree that high school kids are incapable of absorbing knowledge about things like job interview skills and how to make a resume.

[Yonivore]

I am reminded...

Obama's Lost Annenberg Years Coming to Light

The cloak of media invisibility is slowly beginning to lift from Barack Obama's most important administrative leadership experience, helming an expensive educational reform effort in Chicago that failed to produce any measurable academic gains, according to the project's own final report.

I wonder how much of Obama's failure at the Chicago Annenberg Challenge affected the mess they have there today.

[Yonivore]

Couldn't disagree more. College isn't for everyone. I also strongly disagree that high school kids are incapable of absorbing knowledge about things like job interview skills and how to make a resume.

You might be interested in Mike Rowe's (of Dirty Jobs fame) effort to re-ignite interests in the trades.

He recently wrote an open letter to Presidential candidate Mitt Romney, offering his assistance in renewing interest in the trades. At a time when unemployment is extremely high, there is a shortage of tradesmen; plumbers, electricians, pipe fitters, welders, etc...

In the letter, Rowe claims he wrote a similar letter to candidate Obama, in 2008, but never heard back. Apparently, Romney's staff has already established a relationship and is going to consult with Rowe, on this issue, in the future.

If you think Rowe is just some "celebu " like Sean Penn or George Clooney, I suggest you watch Rowe's 20 minute presentation on TED.com. He obviously has a passion for the true laborers and tradesmen in our society. His MikeRoweWORKS organization is dedicated to celebrating the trades and renewing interest, among the young, in choosing a career in the trades.

The video is entertaining so, if you like Mike Rowe's storytelling style, you'll get a kick out of it whether you agree with his point or not.

[Yonivore]

So, is there any support, in this forum, for the striking Chicago teachers?

The highest paid teachers, in the country, get their panties in a wad and go on strike because -- in a sucky economy -- their proposed raise was cut from 30% to 16% and they'll finally be subject to performance evaluations?

No sympathy here. If I were Godfather, I'd fire them all and hire new ones...I'm sure there are more than a few unemployed teachers, around the country, that would flock to Chicago for $76K a year (before benefits).

[coyotes_geek]

Good stuff!

Even as unemployment remains sky high, a whole category of vital occupations has fallen out of favor, and companies struggle to find workers with the necessary skills. The causes seem clear. We have embraced a ridiculously narrow view of education. Any kind of training or study that does not come with a four-year degree is now deemed “alternative.” Many viable careers once aspired to are now seen as “vocational consolation prizes,” and many of the jobs this current administration has tried to “create” over the last four years are the same jobs that parents and teachers actively discourage kids from pursuing. (I always thought there something ill-fated about the promise of three million “shovel ready jobs” made to a society that no longer encourages people to pick up a shovel.)

[baseline bum]

Thanks for sourcing the numbers, cg.

[baseline bum]

If Romney would actually get our schools to teach trades I would definitely vote for him. It's a system that works great for Germany where you have both academic and vocational tracks in secondary schools so that almost all students get something of value from their time spent there. A nice side effect is the academic track can be made more rigorous also. I hate the at ude in America that truck-driving, plumbing, construction, electrical, etc. should be beneath going to school and getting a desk job, so of course people get pissed if their kid isn't being taught to go to college.

Too bad Obama didn't follow Germany's lead on healthcare.

[Yonivore]

76k ain't in Chicago.

It ain't in New York, Los Angeles, or Philadelphia either but, still, Chicago is paid more; but, still, Chicago has an abysmal graduation rate; but, still, the average household income in Chicago is in the mid-40K's.

ing teacher's unions.

[Homeland Security]

If Romney would actually get our schools to teach trades I would definitely vote for him. It's a system that works great for Germany where you have both academic and vocational tracks in secondary schools so that almost all students get something of value from their time spent there. A nice side effect is the academic track can be made more rigorous also. I hate the at ude in America that truck-driving, plumbing, construction, electrical, etc. should be beneath going to school and getting a desk job, so of course people get pissed if their kid isn't being taught to go to college.

Too bad Obama didn't follow Germany's lead on healthcare.

Holy , we agree on something?

There is an enormous shortage of skilled tradesmen and has been for years. This is a residue both of the effeminization of the culture and the decline of the unions. Yeah, the unions probably dug their own graves, but they ran their own apprenticeship programs and nobody replaced them. There's no payback in businesses doing their own training because it's more cost-effective to let someone else do the training and then go poach.

Solid blue-collar work pays six figures if you work hard enough. That's certainly better than getting a degree in English, or anthropology, or womyn's studies, and then moving back to your old bedroom at your parents' house.

Plus, good-paying blue-collar jobs line up well with the zeitgeist of Mexican-American culture and place that group two generations away from social equality and being able to run the country.