HoopsHype.com Publishes Top 50 Spurs of All Time

[cd021]

Played better than Game Five?? With four turnovers and three awful passes in the fourth quarter of Game Seven to spark the Heat? LMAO LMAO LMAO


I took out Game Five to illustrate the point, which remains with Game Five, frankly. The team was overcoming his stupidity at 2-2. He finally had a decent game, then had two more crap ones that were more than the team could compensate for.

If Manu can learn to be a facilitator and not a jackupathreewith20ontheshotclock has been then we have a chance. Otherwise expect more of the same, just worse.

Miami only scored 5 points on his 4 turnovers in game 7, He accounted for 34% of the Spurs offense and his 5 assists accounted for 12 points alone and he scored 18 pts . Another one of your illogical comments.

How can you remove a game to prove your point? that is just wrong and you claim I doctored stats? you just admitted that you did to prove a point that isn't even remotely true.


Game 1
Game 3
Game 5
Game 7

were all good games for Manu

Not just game 5

I really am starting to doubt that you watched the NBA finals now.

[Skull-1]

I hope Skull-1 is just trolling. He can't be this dumb.

I even discredited the "Manu turnovers" argument (still waiting for a reply) Manu had 22 turnovers in the series but Miami only scored 26 points off of them ,in 7 games. His assists are incredibly valuable. In game 5 he had 10 assists for 25 points, he also scored 24 points as well. If we were to factor in his assists valule with his scoring he would average almost 22 points per game.

And again..... If he only has four turnovers and they all come in the fourth and kill our momentum or spark a Heat rally then we are done. Context!


He took bad shots that killed our offense early in the shot clock leading to Miami going the other way.

He made bad passes that resulted in a turnover on himself, a turnover charged to the other player, no shot, or shot clock violation.

He bricked a ton of shots (55) a lot of which were early in the clock and wound up with Heat rebounds.


If Manu turns it over and Miami gets two points, that's a potential FIVE POINT OR FOUR POINT SWING, NOT JUST TWO. It forces our defense to get back which adds to the fatigue factor. It doesn't take time off the clock. All this favors a younger, faster Heat team.

You guys are so blind it astounds me. You cannot tell me that a shooting percentage in the 30s is remotely acceptable along with turnovers and bad passes with ridiculous bricks flying all over the place. The guy stunk.

[Skull-1]

Miami only scored 5 points on his 4 turnovers in game 7, He accounted for 34% of the Spurs offense and his 5 assists accounted for 12 points alone and he scored 18 pts . Another one of your illogical comments.

How can you remove a game to prove your point? that is just wrong and you claim I doctored stats? you just admitted that you did to prove a point that isn't even remotely true.


Game 1
Game 3
Game 5
Game 7

were all good games for Manu

Not just game 5

I really am starting to doubt that you watched the NBA finals now.

AND THE SPURS SCORED ZERO. A POTENTIAL SWING OF 13 TO 17 POINTS.


I took out Game Five to prove that the trend in1-4 was not a fluke. That one game saved him from looking as bad as he really was. His series was bad even with Game Five.

[cd021]

Manu gave the Heat an equal or greater number of points than SA. Leonard contributed to the offense's scoring at a higher percentage than shown. You cherry picked points and assists. Never mind the multiple turnovers CAUSED BY BAD MANU PASSES BUT CHARGED TO OTHER PLAYERS. Or his horrible step back clangs that missed resulting in a two to six point swing for Miami, depending on how you factor it.

If I generate 33 percent of the offense but go 15 for 65 like Kobe Bryant I AM NOT HELPING THE TEAM, PARTICULARLY WHEN WE LOSE.


Also never mind the key rebounds and tip outs by Leonard where the offense reset and scored. These don't show up as points on the board like your cherry picked points and assists criteria.

The eye test has it. Manu stunk.

Unless you break down the tapes and re-credit assists and turnovers I'll stick with the professionals.

Kawhi has little to no assist value simply because he doesn't assist. His postseason average is 1 assist to 1 turnover per game in 37 mpg.

Leonard really doesn't tip out much, he has massive hands and simply grabs them, rebounds credited to him are pretty accurate. Its not like he was Oberto or Chandler now with the Knicks.

I accounted for all of Manu's assists, Kawhi seldom had one.

His assists are valuable 12 points on 5 assists, 18 pts scored in Game 7

That "Kobe scores 30 and they lose stat" is overblown (this past season, at least ). Kobe had a strong offense season, The Lakers were a poor offensive team playing with a coach who ill suited their strengths. He actually benched Gasol in favor of Earl Clarke. They needed every point he game them because their defense was average at best. Not the best analogy.

Manu has always been on extremely effective player in part because of his ability score at a high rate and a high percentages. He is also an creative passer you frequently generates offense for other players.

He can't get to the rim like he once could or draw fouls but he his play-making is still incredibly impactful as I have shown you time and time a gain.

Wash your eyes, Men lie, Women Lie, Numbers don't...

[Skull-1]

Leonard was a beast. You dismiss the effect he had on denying points for the Heat, something seen with the eyes that stats can never capture.


Manu was out of control much of the series and it badly hurt us.


Your beloved professionals were all wondering on tv and in columns just what the was wrong with Manu.

[Skull-1]

K. Leonard was a beast. This isn't going to format well.... Darn it.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/kawhi_...ame_stats.html


Date Opponent Result MIN FGM-A 3PM-A FTM-A OFF DEF REB AST STL BLK TO PF PTS



Jun 20 @ MIA4 L 88 - 95 45 8 - 17 1 - 4 2 - 4 4 12 16 0 1 1 2 2 19
Jun 18 @ MIA4 L 100 - 103 46 9 - 14 1 - 3 3 - 4 2 9 11 0 3 0 0 3 22
Jun 16 vs. MIA4 W 114 - 104 33 6 - 8 2 - 4 2 - 2 1 7 8 1 3 0 2 3 16
Jun 13 vs. MIA4 L 93 - 109 33 5 - 10 1 - 2 1 - 2 1 6 7 0 1 2 1 2 12
Jun 11 vs. MIA4 W 113 - 77 29 6 - 10 2 - 3 0 - 0 3 9 12 2 4 0 1 2 14
Jun 09 @ MIA4 L 84 - 103 33 4 - 12 1 - 3 0 - 1 8 6 14 2 1 0 1 2 9
Jun 06 @ MIA4 W 92 - 88 35 3 - 9 0 - 4 4 - 4 2 8 10 1 1 0 0 2 10


And you seriously think Manu was even close to as good as Leonard or consistent? Did I miss something?

[xmas1997]

Unless you break down the tapes and re-credit assists and turnovers I'll stick with the professionals.

Kawhi has little to no assist value simply because he doesn't assist. His postseason average is 1 assist to 1 turnover per game in 37 mpg.

Leonard really doesn't tip out much, he has massive hands and simply grabs them, rebounds credited to him are pretty accurate. Its not like he was Oberto or Chandler now with the Knicks.

I accounted for all of Manu's assists, Kawhi seldom had one.

His assists are valuable 12 points on 5 assists, 18 pts scored in Game 7

That "Kobe scores 30 and they lose stat" is overblown (this past season, at least ). Kobe had a strong offense season, The Lakers were a poor offensive team playing with a coach who ill suited their strengths. He actually benched Gasol in favor of Earl Clarke. They needed every point he game them because their defense was average at best. Not the best analogy.

Manu has always been on extremely effective player in part because of his ability score at a high rate and a high percentages. He is also an creative passer you frequently generates offense for other players.

He can't get to the rim like he once could or draw fouls but he his play-making is still incredibly impactful as I have shown you time and time a gain.

Wash your eyes, Men lie, Women Lie, Numbers don't...

You're wasting your time trying to convince this bandwagon fan, he is just way too dense and ignorant to have an open mind to see the truth, that it was the whole team at one point or another.

[cd021]

And again..... If he only has four turnovers and they all come in the fourth and kill our momentum or spark a Heat rally then we are done. Context!


He took bad shots that killed our offense early in the shot clock leading to Miami going the other way.

He made bad passes that resulted in a turnover on himself, a turnover charged to the other player, no shot, or shot clock violation.

He bricked a ton of shots (55) a lot of which were early in the clock and wound up with Heat rebounds.


If Manu turns it over and Miami gets two points, that's a potential FIVE POINT OR FOUR POINT SWING, NOT JUST TWO. It forces our defense to get back which adds to the fatigue factor. It doesn't take time off the clock. All this favors a younger, faster Heat team.

You guys are so blind it astounds me. You cannot tell me that a shooting percentage in the 30s is remotely acceptable along with turnovers and bad passes with ridiculous bricks flying all over the place. The guy stunk.

I just showed you his turnovers had little to no actual impact. Momentum can't be quantified so why bring it up?

What we know

Manu turned the ball over 22 time in 7 games, Miami scored 26 points (incredibly bad efficiency). They only attempted 13 shots and hit 7 shots which suggest that most of these turnovers weren't the kind that allowed Miami to get out in transition and score easily. Its like a QB that in the 1st half of a season throws 12 TD's but has 7 interceptions. However of those 7 turnovers the opposing teams scored only 3 times for 13 points while he directly contributed 72 points to his team. 72 points scored to 13 points off T.O's is fairly comparable to Manu's 72 assists to 26 points off Turnovers.

Manu's mistakes had, overall, minimal effect on the Spurs. His play making had a clear, positive effect.

And how exactly was was it a 13-17 point swing? If he hadn't turned it over it would have been of 8-12 points at best. You also forgot to mention the steal Manu had and his smart decision to force Miami to closeout on him and throw a no look pass to Green who missed a clean look that would have given the Spurs the lead with less than 2 minutes remaining.

In the final 3 games of the series Manu shot 55% FG. He shot 43% overall (in the series) which isn't far off his regular season numbers.

Another stat doctored by Skull-1

You should treat everyone who posted on this thread to a happy meal once we catch you making up another or exaggerating numbers for your arguments sake.

He took 31 shots 103 minutes not exactly and made 17 of those shots (in Games 5,6 & 7).

By the way, he took 60 shots in 200 minutes (for the series) that's a shot every 3.5 minutes. Thats about a shot once every 10 Spurs possessions. He took 8 shots per game in 28.6 mpg. Once again you are overstating things...

Not really "ridiculous bricks flying all over the place" now is it.

[Skull-1]

So Leonard had 115+ points if we count points plus assists and 78 rebounds.... With like....seven turnovers the ENTIRE series... So what's a rebound worth?

I also didn't doctor stats. I just posted total shots and total misses. That means every time he shot the ball, be it a layup or a three.


Factor the point swing however you want. A turnover to give Miami two points could have been a zero to four for the Spurs. I just went with two on the low side and three on the high. So four turnovers, assuming two points lost by SA for each, as an example, is eight the Spurs lose and eight the Heat get for a sixteen point swing. It could be way more or way less. At a fifty percent rate it is eight points. It is a highly subjective range, but when you lose by one or by five, eight is enough.

[Skull-1]

They're ridiculous bricks when you miss seven of eight shots in one game. Clang. Whang. Whiff.

[cd021]

Leonard was a beast. You dismiss the effect he had on denying points for the Heat, something seen with the eyes that stats can never capture.


Manu was out of control much of the series and it badly hurt us.


Your beloved professionals were all wondering on tv and in columns just what the was wrong with Manu.

Those columnists are the ones who ignored the spurs the entire year, I was referring to stat keepers. Genius


Leonard's numbers can be quantified. Defensive rating, and by looking at the spurs 5 man lineups that included Leonard as opposed to the ones that didn't it would give an fairly accurate reading of how effective he was (I NEVER stated he was ineffective) Its on NBA.com/stats. Its too bad you don't look at advanced stats, you actually could craft an intelligent response.

[Skull-1]

Those columnists are the ones who ignored the spurs the entire year, I was referring to stat keepers. Genius


Leonard's numbers can be quantified. Defensive rating, and by looking at the spurs 5 man lineups that included Leonard as opposed to the ones that didn't it would give an fairly accurate reading of how effective he was (I NEVER stated he was ineffective) Its on NBA.com/stats. Its too bad you don't look at advanced stats, you actually could craft an intelligent response.

Because advanced stats are just some weenie's attempt to say that grass is blue.

Manu was out of control. I wish I had the time and equipment to make a compilation of all his bad decisions. Perhaps someone can come up with an advanced stat for that and call it the TURNOBILI RATING.

[xmas1997]

Because advanced stats are just some weenie's attempt to say that grass is blue.

Manu was out of control. I wish I had the time and equipment to make a compilation of all his bad decisions. Perhaps someone can come up with an advanced stat for that and call it the TURNOBILI RATING.

Don't you ever have anything constructive to say?
Or do you get some sort of sadistic/masochistic pleasure in being so narrow minded, ignorant, and dense?
Just admit you are wrong and slink back to your cage.

[cd021]

Because advanced stats are just some weenie's attempt to say that grass is blue.

Manu was out of control. I wish I had the time and equipment to make a compilation of all his bad decisions. Perhaps someone can come up with an advanced stat for that and call it the TURNOBILI RATING.

Advanced stat revolutionized the way baseball is being played and is rapidly grown in every teams front office in the NBA. Yeah they are all wrong and you are all knowing. Why do you think Memphis hired Hollinger? It wasn't because they wanted a "weenie" on payroll.