Europe: football, the greatest game on the planet tbh god bless

[midnightpulp]

Again, all those things being bad is strictly subjective.

Soccer being so popular only because it is cheap, has to be one of the more moronic arguments ever. In fact, I'm sure most folks don't even believe it, they just say it to don't concede ground.

There are many sports who are just as cheap (if not cheaper) to play than football, yet they aren't as popular. You know why? Because they aren't as good and/or fun. Why isn't handball as popular, or rugby, or basketball?

Accessibility. Those sports require certain body types and athleticism to excel, while great soccer players can range from 5'2" to 6'5". Basketball also became the 2nd most popular sport (the China factor puts it over cricket) in the world for a relatively young sport. And it's probably the 2nd cheapest sport to play. Why do you think basketball is so popular in American urban communities? So yeah, cost of entry is a huge, huge factor in why anything becomes popular. It's not a moronic argument at all. Handball is very, very young, so I don't see the point in mentioning it.

Your "fun/good" argument is what's moronic. If you're bored by baseball, test cricket would probably put you in a coma. Think 30 seconds between pitches and 4 hour games are bad? Try 2 minutes between bowls and 6-8 hour games, and pretty much zero running around. Yet billions in the subcontinent and Oceania adore the sport. Why do you think that is? Inherently more fun? Ask our resident Aussie TIMVP about his experience playing it. You could wait in the sun for literal hours and never have the ball hit to you. You also might never get to bat if your teammates score the required amount of runs.

Now I'm not talking cricket. I like the sport, but the point is how do you think such an impenetrable, quirky, "boring" game like cricket became the 2nd/3rd biggest sport in the world? Good ole British Imperialism. So if they could make a strange game like cricket the 2nd/3rd biggest sport in the world, of course they were able to export a simplistic game like soccer with relative ease. Has nothing to do with inherent fun factor (although, just like baseball, when you take the time to learn cricket's nuances and get over the static nature of the sport, it is "fun," and a lot more interesting to play/watch than goal sport #8890808).

Ultimate point is there's a variety of factors that go into making something popular. It's not simply because this one thing has more inherent worth than another.

[midnightpulp]

Oh, and on that note, a huge % of the reason basketball grew worldwide at such a quick pace was because of American cultural "imperialism." Handball is actually older than I thought, but it could be reasoned that basketball probably siphoned up handball's potential worldwide audience in both sports' formative years since Denmark isn't exactly the cultural force the US is. It's not because basketball is inherently superior to handball.

[Mitch]

In the early days, football had such a death problem that the US government considered banning it

I'm not suggesting rugby players aren't tough, but when Euros and the like denigrate NFL players as "pussies," trying to equate gridiron with rugby as if both sports have the same type of contact, I just laugh. The forward pass changed everything, making football a faster, harder hitting game (not to mention special teams, where players have 60 yards to reach full speed and hit). Rugby does have its share of big hits, but they aren't on the level of an over-the-middle blindside and the like.

Same as when MMA fans think MMA is inherently more dangerous than boxing because they don't use "soft" gloves. In fact, boxing is more dangerous since knockouts are less frequent and boxers endure more continuous punishment to the head and body, when in MMA, a knockout is usually one or two punch quick.

boxers deliver hand breaking blows regularly, you can ask anyone who says like that why boxers still break their hands when it's wrapped and padded.

[DAF86]

Accessibility. Those sports require certain body types and athleticism to excel, while great soccer players can range from 5'2" to 6'5". Basketball also became the 2nd most popular sport (the China factor puts it over cricket) in the world for a relatively young sport. And it's probably the 2nd cheapest sport to play. Why do you think basketball is so popular in American urban communities? So yeah, cost of entry is a huge, huge factor in why anything becomes popular. It's not a moronic argument at all. Handball is very, very young, so I don't see the point in mentioning it.

Your "fun/good" argument is what's moronic. If you're bored by baseball, test cricket would probably put you in a coma. Think 30 seconds between pitches and 4 hour games are bad? Try 2 minutes between bowls and 6-8 hour games, and pretty much zero running around. Yet billions in the subcontinent and Oceania adore the sport. Why do you think that is? Inherently more fun? Ask our resident Aussie TIMVP about his experience playing it. You could wait in the sun for literal hours and never have the ball hit to you. You also might never get to bat if your teammates score the required amount of runs.

Now I'm not talking cricket. I like the sport, but the point is how do you think such an impenetrable, quirky, "boring" game like cricket became the 2nd/3rd biggest sport in the world? Good ole British Imperialism. So if they could make a strange game like cricket the 2nd/3rd biggest sport in the world, of course they were able to export a simplistic game like soccer with relative ease. Has nothing to do with inherent fun factor (although, just like baseball, when you take the time to learn cricket's nuances and get over the static nature of the sport, it is "fun," and a lot more interesting to play/watch than goal sport #8890808).

Ultimate point is there's a variety of factors that go into making something popular. It's not simply because this one thing has more inherent worth than another.

Sports like Rugby and handball don't need a specific body type. You can be short, tall, slim, fat and still be of use.

Also, you are contradicting yourself. You talk about "accessibilty" in terms of body types being the factor for soccer being the most popular sport in the World and then call basketball, maybe the elitistest sport in terms of accessibility, the second most popular sport in the World.

[dfens]

tbh this is how you know you dont have a winning argument

all the proof you need is in the first post ... or you really think the whole world is insane but good ole us of a is the shining light of common sense in this century (if so )?
come on son, this way at least I give these toothless s a chance to talk and maybe they start understanding some parts of the game at least or at least they scour the sites and find a wank good enough for their taste tbh ...

this is community work son tbh

[dfens]

Sports like Rugby and handball don't need a specific body type. You can be short, tall, slim, fat and still be of use.

Also, you are contradicting yourself. You talk about "accessibilty" in terms of body types being the factor for soccer being the most popular sport in the World and then call basketball, maybe the elitistest sport in terms of accessibility, the second most popular sport in the World.

come on son smh you're really arguing with that brokeback hick ? bless your heart you a good soul smh.

[midnightpulp]

Sports like Rugby and handball don't need a specific body type. You can be short, tall, slim, fat and still be of use.

Also, you are contradicting yourself. You talk about "accessibilty" in terms of body types being the factor for soccer being the most popular sport in the World and then call basketball, maybe the elitistest sport in terms of accessibility, the second most popular sport in the World.

To be a pro rugby player or even play it at a high level, you do need top tier athleticism combined with a relatively large physical build. Show me all the professional rugby players that stand 5'6" 150lb? Furthermore, rugby's rule set is rather complicated compared to basketball and soccer and it's a more dangerous game than both. I should've been more clear that "accessibility" entails a variety of elements, from cost of entry, to physical demands (i.e. what kind of physical build does it take it to excel), to injury severity, to learning curve of the rule set. Basketball shines on the accessibility scale in 3 out those 4 categories.

I think another thing worth mentioning that plays a role in sport's growth is the backyard/driveway factor. Basketball is the team sport that's most fun to play alone, with its "equipment" (a ball and basket) easily accessible, installed and maintained. Sports like rugby, football, baseball, etc you generally need another person to help you properly practice or expensive equipment that can't be easily set up in a driveway/backyard (a batting cage). Soccer has this going for it, as well. You can practice your dribbling, touch, kicking by yourself. Someone who wants to play linebacker can't really practice anything football related by himself in the backyard (unless he has a tackling sled, which is expensive) outside of working out. QB is really the only position you can somewhat practice alone (throwing a ball through a tire and the like).

I know you want to try to prove soccer ascended to the world's number 1 sport because it's intrinsically more "fun," but the cricket argument knocks that argument down. Again, a combination of factors go into making anything popular. Accessibility, timing, spread by cultural/economic power. Golf is bigger than bowling worldwide, yet I would bet the majority of people find bowling more "fun."

Also, anything is fun if you keep an open mind and learn that something's particular nuances, instead of just dismissing it with shallow arguments like "it's boring."

[Mitch]

To be a pro rugby player or even play it at a high level, you do need top tier athleticism combined with a relatively large physical build. Show me all the professional rugby players that stand 5'6" 150lb? Furthermore, rugby's rule set is rather complicated compared to basketball and soccer and it's a more dangerous game than both. I should've been more clear that "accessibility" entails a variety of elements, from cost of entry, to physical demands (i.e. what kind of physical build does it take it to excel), to injury severity, to learning curve of the rule set. Basketball shines on the accessibility scale in 3 out those 4 categories.

I think another thing worth mentioning that plays a role in sport's growth is the backyard/driveway factor. Basketball is the team sport that's most fun to play alone, with its "equipment" (a ball and basket) easily accessible, installed and maintained. Sports like rugby, football, baseball, etc you generally need another person to help you properly practice or expensive equipment that can't be easily set up in a driveway/backyard (a batting cage). Soccer has this going for it, as well. You can practice your dribbling, touch, kicking by yourself. Someone who wants to play linebacker can't really practice anything football related by himself in the backyard (unless he has a tackling sled, which is expensive) outside of working out. QB is really the only position you can somewhat practice alone (throwing a ball through a tire and the like).

I know you want to try to prove soccer ascended to the world's number 1 sport because it's intrinsically more "fun," but the cricket argument knocks that argument down. Again, a combination of factors go into making anything popular. Accessibility, timing, spread by cultural/economic power. Golf is bigger than bowling worldwide, yet I would bet the majority of people find bowling more "fun."

Also, anything is fun if you keep an open mind and learn that something's particular nuances, instead of just dismissing it with shallow arguments like "it's boring."

5'6 150lbs, is that the little Messi kid?

Can you imagine a midget like Messi being tackled by JJ watt?

[benefactor]

Midnightpulp laying soccer stans out like Steve A er

[spurraider21]

Midnightpulp laying soccer stans out like Steve A er

that's good on mutliple levels, considering his best hit was against the nigerian nightmare

[benefactor]

that's good on mutliple levels, considering his best hit was against the nigerian nightmare

[DAF86]

To be a pro rugby player or even play it at a high level, you do need top tier athleticism combined with a relatively large physical build. Show me all the professional rugby players that stand 5'6" 150lb? Furthermore, rugby's rule set is rather complicated compared to basketball and soccer and it's a more dangerous game than both. I should've been more clear that "accessibility" entails a variety of elements, from cost of entry, to physical demands (i.e. what kind of physical build does it take it to excel), to injury severity, to learning curve of the rule set. Basketball shines on the accessibility scale in 3 out those 4 categories.

I think another thing worth mentioning that plays a role in sport's growth is the backyard/driveway factor. Basketball is the team sport that's most fun to play alone, with its "equipment" (a ball and basket) easily accessible, installed and maintained. Sports like rugby, football, baseball, etc you generally need another person to help you properly practice or expensive equipment that can't be easily set up in a driveway/backyard (a batting cage). Soccer has this going for it, as well. You can practice your dribbling, touch, kicking by yourself. Someone who wants to play linebacker can't really practice anything football related by himself in the backyard (unless he has a tackling sled, which is expensive) outside of working out. QB is really the only position you can somewhat practice alone (throwing a ball through a tire and the like).

I know you want to try to prove soccer ascended to the world's number 1 sport because it's intrinsically more "fun," but the cricket argument knocks that argument down. Again, a combination of factors go into making anything popular. Accessibility, timing, spread by cultural/economic power. Golf is bigger than bowling worldwide, yet I would bet the majority of people find bowling more "fun."

Also, anything is fun if you keep an open mind and learn that something's particular nuances, instead of just dismissing it with shallow arguments like "it's boring."

Not really. On this argument I'm trying to prove that soccer can't be such a poorly designed sport as you say, and you are kinda making my point with all those things you said about soccer being so accesible in different elements. Simple yet succesful, that's proof of great design, imho.

[midnightpulp]

Not really. On this argument I'm trying to prove that soccer can't be such a poorly designed sport as you say, and you are kinda making my point with all those things you said about soccer being so accesible in different elements. Simple yet succesful, that's proof of great design, imho.

Core game isn't poorly designed (soccer has the same core design as ice hockey, field hockey, basketball, etc). Like I said, the subs ution rules, overtime rules, penalty rules, and shootout rules box soccer in and make it a more poorly designed sport than other goal sports. No sport/game should excessively end in a tie. No other world sport nor game has this issue to soccer's degree. And it's not simply Americans hating it just because. In any other sport, ties don't feature prominently. It's not the fault of soccer's core design, but the overtime rules. Play on until there's a winner. "But they'll get tired." Unlimited subs and 33 man rosters then.

Shootouts. You already know my logic behind why these are bad, and they were never a part of soccer until like the 70s. Again, introduced out of making soccer a more friendly spectator experience.

Penalties. We know how hard it is to score in soccer, so to award a penalty in the box, even when the player wasn't in a position to realistically score, is unbalanced. Ice Hockey has the best solution here out of any goal sport. The Power Play. Fouls outside the box. Free kick is fine since it's still low odds of scoring. Fouls inside the box should punished with something like a 10-15 minute power play.

"Popularity=proof of great design."

Again, appeal to popularity fallacy. Also, to take aim at a beloved American sport, basketball has reached 2nd in worldwide sports popularity, and I think basketball is completely broken. You know my opinions about the 3 point shot (which doesn't mathematically scale to other shots). Basketball's end game is one of, if not, the worst in all major sports. And like soccer, it disproportionally rewards penalty situations (ticky tack fouls resulting in free points). Even Phil Jackson, who I almost always disagree with, proposed a power play-type punishment for fouls. Hockey really got that right. Now granted, in basketball it's much easier to score points, so a 2 minute long 4 on 5 situation could really unbalance the match, but something needs to be done about handing players like James Harden free points for whipping his head around as he's lightly touched 25 feet away. A 1 minute powerplay might not be too bad, and it would create additional tactical complexity, since now teams would have to create penalty kill lineups.

"But could you imagine Lebron, Curry, or some other A-list star sat down for the last 30 seconds of a Finals game because he committed a foul? Lunacy!"

Basketball is supposed to be a team sport, right? And if anything, it needs to become less star driven.

[Chris]

[dfens]

lmao son, y'all boys idolizing gots but trying to pin that on the noble game for some in the 834743th league in Brassil .... so let me tell it like it is sons.

- y'all boys watch sports just for athleticism, not for skill. alert.
- y'all boys got superstar writing gay love letters on the dying bed. alert again.
- y'all boys going online desperately scouring over all the sites to find something football related. alert again.

y'all s should just come out of the closet tbh

[Mitch]

[dfens]

we talking about pros at the highest level, so I won't even bother ... you can easily see s playing handegg on youtube. I just put these star images/ commercials for you to about them. get out of the closet .

[Mitch]

[dfens]

I'm giving you big name mvp level player being obvious gots out in the open and you give me this (another bum from brasil, who fyi is not even gay, just into clowning). Just waive the white flag


told you son, y'all boys better just get out the closet with this , everybody already knows who you bum s are tbh

[Avante]

The greatest athletes play in the NFL or are decathletes in track.

[Mitch]

I'm giving you big name mvp level player being obvious gots out in the open and you give me this (another bum from brasil, who fyi is not even gay, just into clowning). Just waive the white flag


told you son, y'all boys better just get out the closet with this , everybody already knows who you bum s are tbh

[dfens]

one is on the floor naked with his ass up and waiting to have a train ran on his ass and the other is the gayest player in football, with clothes looking like a ... if that is favorable comparison

[dfens]

The greatest athletes play in the NFL or are decathletes in track.

who brought the ladyboy expert here to share his expertise on gotry? smh y'll sons must really be mad tbh.

[Mitch]

one is on the floor naked with his ass up and waiting to have a train ran on his ass and the other is the gayest player in football, with clothes looking like a ... if that is favorable comparison

One of the best kickball players is a closet flamer, you bring up some 4th rounder murderer. Let's be real here, I could come up with better examples of gotry in NFL and it doesn't even compare to a bukake in the locker room or Davis getting spanked as a freshman in college.

[dfens]

One of the best kickball players is a closet flamer, you bring up some 4th rounder murderer. Let's be real here, I could come up with better examples of gotry in NFL and it doesn't even compare to a bukake in the locker room or Davis getting spanked as a freshman in college.

son you got 4 paths:
1. troll more and I'll troll you back because the NFL and NBA are gier at the top EASILY
2. talk sport market and find out WC/UCL/EURO >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>> NFL
3. talk sport quality and lose
4. talk sport following and lose or either try to argue us is the moral and logical ground of the earth and lose even bigger.

All lead to a big L tbh. Or do what you s do and run in circles between 1-4, taking Ls at each turn.
Tbh I'm getting bored in here smh.