Teams droppping 120+ on the regular nowadays...

[DAF86]

I have no problem with teams actually having to play to win games, instead of running down the clock, tbh.

[Immortal Spur]

Exactly ^^^ All it does is polish the game more. Aesthetically it kills the flow of the game and on the other hand it’s quite literally a waste of time. They want movement and flow. Visually it keeps the momentum going and continues stimulation which essentially makes it more entertaining. From a basketball purist POV I understand but tbh, it’s a kids game. Should be entertaining. Otherwise why do we watch and pay are hard earned money. I actually thoroughly enjoyed tonight’s game. It was a roller coaster ride. It was fun and exhilarating.

[DJR210]

These scores are bonkers

It's corny as , this feels like all star weekend

[midnightpulp]

I have no problem with teams actually having to play to win games, instead of running down the clock, tbh.

Um, fighting for an o-board with 20 seconds left on the clock to force the opponent to intentional foul is "having to play to win the game." This is actually bails out inept defense during late game situations and makes it where "defense doesn't really have to play the game" in order to win games. It's a ty arbitrary rule not consistent with what an "offensive possession" regularly is (i.e. 24 seconds to shoot the ball).

There's also other stupid in' rules that have nothing to do with "having to play to win games." Like the offense being able to advance the ball after a time out. The offense didn't have to dribble across the half court line, maybe fighting a press or other defense. No. Call a time out and you get a free 48 feet of space (the seconds of which to traverse become mightily important in late game situations). We don't pay attention to how goddamn re ed the advance the ball rule is because we're so used to it, but it's contrived to produce more late game drama.

[midnightpulp]

It's corny as , this feels like all star weekend

Corny league. When you think about it, why did the NBA ever need "more scoring?" Even in the grit-and-grind era when games ended up 85-80, that is still a load of scoring relative to other sports. One complaint I've noticed from people who don't like basketball is that there is too much scoring and no score feels meaningful (until the closing moments). I see that point more clearly than ever. Attritional baskets are a great deal more entertaining that walk up and launch or waltz in undefended for a layup because the spacing is so immense.

[JakeCuenca]

The bigger change is the softer calls. Implementing a 14 second shot clock rule does increase possessions but its not whats causing the increased in scoring overall.

Because teams shoot lots of threes, move better offball, and run a lot of high pick and roll..the emphasis on calling touch fouls offball has really opened the game up even more.

Less and less shots are being contested. And when threes are at an all time high..you get these scores.

The players who defend are actually very frustrated with these. If you watched even a few games this year..simply accidently touching an offensive player during offball is a foul now.

Its not the NBAs intention to discourage defense but thats ceetainly the outcome. This is good short term imo..

But things will get stale and they might find thesmelves in a hole in the future if this keeps up.

Good short term, bad long term.

[JakeCuenca]

Basically.

Last few years teams have been playing faster, shooting more threes. Teams would generally try to slow things down by aggressively switching or going through screens.

Thats not somwthing defense can do now..the defense is practiclly being told " dont defend"

[BanditHiro]

three point line is the worst case of affirmative action in American history.

[TDMVPDPOY]

high scoring pts avg

means scrubs with inflated empty stats = can ask for more money on next contract, when they are fake ass franchise players or scoring goto guys

[DAF86]

Um, fighting for an o-board with 20 seconds left on the clock to force the opponent to intentional foul is "having to play to win the game." This is actually bails out inept defense during late game situations and makes it where "defense doesn't really have to play the game" in order to win games. It's a ty arbitrary rule not consistent with what an "offensive possession" regularly is (i.e. 24 seconds to shoot the ball).

You still have to rebound, you still need to defend. Those things haven't been banned from the NBA, tbh. What the NBA got rid of is of the 16 seconds of a guy just standing on half court with the ball doing nothing after offensive rebounds. How can anyone miss that is beyond me.

There's also other stupid in' rules that have nothing to do with "having to play to win games." Like the offense being able to advance the ball after a time out. The offense didn't have to dribble across the half court line, maybe fighting a press or other defense. No. Call a time out and you get a free 48 feet of space (the seconds of which to traverse become mightily important in late game situations). We don't pay attention to how goddamn re ed the advance the ball rule is because we're so used to it, but it's contrived to produce more late game drama.

And that's bad why? Stop being such a grumpy old man.

[Spurminator]

No. It's . No other sport in the world does this.

Every sport makes rule changes. The NFL has made several rule changes in its history related to play clock and clock stoppage. They've moved kickoffs 5 yards up, and moved touchbacks 5 yards up. MLB took away the 4-pitch intentional walk and gives relievers less time to warm up than they used to. The NHL has changed rules for where the goalie can make a play on the puck.

I have no problem with the NBA reducing the number of "hold the ball and run out the clock" seconds that occur within a game. The players and coaches don't seem to have a problem with it, either. Fans certainly seem to like it. Really the only argument against it is that it's not like it used to be.

During the endgame, offensive rebounds are backbreakers because the team that retained possession can milk more and more clock. This rule devalues a fundamental aspect of basketball: rebounding.

It only devalues rebounding compared to previous seasons. No player is going to be less motivated to grab a rebound in the last minute of a game. 14 seconds are still important.

What becomes more important than it was in the past is scoring after an offensive rebound. You can't just throw up a brick at the end of the clock and still have the benefit of having milked almost half a minute off the clock.

I would argue an offensive rebound is more correctly valued now. You're still running time off, but converting the possession into points becomes a more necessary result to take advantage.

[Spurminator]

It's corny as , this feels like all star weekend

During the All Star Game, players go back and forth dunking in open lanes. Players don't even try to play defense because half of them are waiting on the other side of the court for a long inbound pass.

I'm not seeing a whole bunch of uncontested dunks in these games. Players today are faster and shoot better than they ever have. There are certainly aspects of foul calling that impact scoring... You certainly can't get in someone's face the way you used to. But for the most part (at least from where I'm sitting) scoring is up because NBA offenses are really ing good right now.

It's evolution baby. Larry Bird would be a bit player on most of these teams.

[HarlemHeat37]

The problem is the whistles, not the new rule or lack of effort..faster pace and replacing mid-range with 3s was inevitable with evolution, but the emphasis on calling fouls has been annoying..

As Draymond said, the players were warned that the refs would be calling everything tighter, which has forced defenders to fear playing aggressive defense..I expect regression, though, and the playoffs will revert to physicality and more of an emphasis on defense(like GS vs. Houston last year)..

[TDomination]

The problem is the whistles, not the new rule or lack of effort..faster pace and replacing mid-range with 3s was inevitable with evolution, but the emphasis on calling fouls has been annoying..

As Draymond said, the players were warned that the refs would be calling everything tighter, which has forced defenders to fear playing aggressive defense..I expect regression, though, and the playoffs will revert to physicality and more of an emphasis on defense(like GS vs. Houston last year)..

which is crazy to think about given the fact that the defense has already been restrained the last 15 years or so. now its where you just try your best to annoy the player your guarding but forget about actually guarding them. it will be next to impossible.

the next rule change i expect will be where the defense will not be allowed to enter the paint area for more than 1 second and the no charge zone arc will be pushed up to the ft line.

i'm fine with the pace, but i absolutely HATE that they can no longer be physical.

[RC_Drunkford]

this is lame, I used to get excited when the Spurs got an important stop. I actually like seeing good defense, but I guess I'm in the minority. Question is, how can a team defend efficiently nowadays? I think that is the one thing that would make a team elite if they can hold teams to 100 or 110 points per game while being able to go for 130

[SAGirl]

On the Spurs it appears that it's going to become a regular occurrence. Spurs are next to last on defense in the league. It is early in the season tho....

[313]

The 14 second shot clock on Orebs makes sense, that's why every other basketball league in the world already implemented it. It doesn't make defense, worse, the increase in scores is coming from the increased pace.

The main ones detrimentally affected by this will be the 30+ y/o players, trying to keep up with the pace. We'll possibly see more injuries if players aren't properly conditioned, which is hard to imagine with all the injuries we already see.

[313]

I will say, this is the start of a new era in the nba and should get more media coverage.

[313]

The problem is the whistles, not the new rule or lack of effort..faster pace and replacing mid-range with 3s was inevitable with evolution, but the emphasis on calling fouls has been annoying..

As Draymond said, the players were warned that the refs would be calling everything tighter, which has forced defenders to fear playing aggressive defense..I expect regression, though, and the playoffs will revert to physicality and more of an emphasis on defense(like GS vs. Houston last year)..

Funny enough, I feel like I can count on one hand how many moving screen calls I've seen

[james evans]

which is crazy to think about given the fact that the defense has already been restrained the last 15 years or so. now its where you just try your best to annoy the player your guarding but forget about actually guarding them. it will be next to impossible.

the next rule change i expect will be where the defense will not be allowed to enter the paint area for more than 1 second and the no charge zone arc will be pushed up to the ft line.

i'm fine with the pace, but i absolutely HATE that they can no longer be physical.

I hate taking charges. If they would remove taking charges from the game I'd be happy with it. The only way for that to happen is if someone breaks their neck on a play. Someone coming down full speed for a dunk and a player slides up under him. It's dangerous and bails out those who can't play defense.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

I hate taking charges. If they would remove taking charges from the game I'd be happy with it. The only way for that to happen is if someone breaks their neck on a play. Someone coming down full speed for a dunk and a player slides up under him. It's dangerous and bails out those who can't play defense.

If they remove charges and call them as fouls then the scores will be in the 200s.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Feels like we're watching an And1 tournament with today's pace. I hate the lack of D, and the inability to body up and slow folks down. Makes the game one-dimensional and takes away strategy. It's now just a score-fest. Lame.

[Coach X]

Feels like we're watching an And1 tournament with today's pace. I hate the lack of D, and the inability to body up and slow folks down. Makes the game one-dimensional and takes away strategy. It's now just a score-fest. Lame.

100% agree.

It's not the new possession ruling but the new fouling ruling. Players can't play defense. It's ridiculous.

[midnightpulp]

You still have to rebound, you still need to defend. Those things haven't been banned from the NBA, tbh. [B]What the NBA got rid of is of the 16 seconds of a guy just standing on half court with the ball doing nothing after offensive rebounds. How can anyone miss that is beyond me.

Why doesn't this rule exist in soccer, hockey, Lacrosse, water polo and similar sports? Soccer, hockey, etc all have "time killing" strategies to milk clock. No, the "16 seconds" a team gets to run off is the "reward" they get for fighting and grabbing that offensive board. How can anyone argue against the inconsistency of what an ordinary offensive possession is vs. an offensive possession that came via an offensive rebound is beyond me. But consistent and organic design be damned. As long it's "entertaining," right? Here's a better in' idea. Make the shot clock 14 seconds from the beginning (but the time it take to get across half court. Don't start the clock until the player crosses half court. What about presses, you take those away now. Have a half court clock like they have time lines in college basketball). I think 24 seconds is fine in all cases, but I guess this tier ADD culture we live in needs even more pace.

And that's bad why? Stop being such a grumpy old man.

Because it's an artificial way of manufacturing it that devalues a key basketball play. Just make the shot clock shorter all around if the NBA needs "more" late game drama. "Old man." Yeah, criticizing dumbass makes me "old and bitter." Do you just open wide for every novel spoonful of the culture industry serves up to you? (rhetorical question. I know you do. Enjoy Avengers 14 or whatever coming soon to a theater near you!).

[midnightpulp]

]Every sport makes rule changes.[/B] The NFL has made several rule changes in its history related to play clock and clock stoppage. They've moved kickoffs 5 yards up, and moved touchbacks 5 yards up. MLB took away the 4-pitch intentional walk and gives relievers less time to warm up than they used to. The NHL has changed rules for where the goalie can make a play on the puck.

I have no problem with the NBA reducing the number of "hold the ball and run out the clock" seconds that occur within a game. The players and coaches don't seem to have a problem with it, either. Fans certainly seem to like it. Really the only argument against it is that it's not like it used to be.



It only devalues rebounding compared to previous seasons. No player is going to be less motivated to grab a rebound in the last minute of a game. 14 seconds are still important.

What becomes more important than it was in the past is scoring after an offensive rebound. You can't just throw up a brick at the end of the clock and still have the benefit of having milked almost half a minute off the clock.

I would argue an offensive rebound is more correctly valued now. You're still running time off, but converting the possession into points becomes a more necessary result to take advantage.

What I was talking about is that no goal sport (i.e. soccer, field hockey, ice hockey, water polo, lacrosse, etc) has a dumbass rule where the rules of second chance offensive possessions are different from the initial offense possession. If a water polo player shoots a shot that's saved, but is rebounded by his teammate, the rules are the still the same. This rule is a superficial contrivance to make the game more "exciting," no matter how asymmetrical it is to the overall rule set. If the NBA really has an issue with clock killing (which is a fundamental tactic in all clock based sports), then just lower the damn shot clock instead of this Calvinball nonsense they're going with. My gripe is that a hard fought offensive rebound should be rewarded with the same possession rules as the initial possession. The half minute off the clock you speak of is the reward a team gets for grabbing that board and outplaying the defense.