A part of me will die when Pop retires.
He's almost family, how long he's been a part of my life.
And he's the best coach I have ever seen.
You're right, he lost some fire for a bit, but it looks like he's on point again and I love it.
He's not perfect, but there isn't a coach alive, or dead that is/was.
Dude, you are diverting the conversation trying to make it seem like folks are somehow hating on Pop's player development just because we called you out on your take of Poeltl being a borderline scrub before.
I don't know how Poeltl would have fared on another team. Maybe he would be less of a player, maybe he would be better. Likely he would be right about the same. All we know for certain is that he has been a good player all the years of his carrer so far.
No what I did was divert the conversation by giving all the credit for Jak’s improvement to PopDude, you are diverting the conversation trying to make it seem like folks are somehow hating on Pop's player development just because we called you out on your take of Poeltl being a borderline scrub before.
I don't know how Poeltl would have fared on another team. Maybe he would be less of a player, maybe he would be better. Likely he would be right about the same. All we know for certain is that he has been a good player all the years of his carrer so far.
I also did the same for Luka and Murray...
but you took offense to the Jak part. for some reason and even suggested that Pop has inhibited Jak as a player by saying he could’ve been better on another team. Pop has a stellar track record for teaching youth to play and mold them into better players. But somehow he didn’t improve Jak one bit? Jak was always that good? C’mon man. We both know that ain’t true. If Jak “always” played this well then I probably wouldn’t have ed about the contract to begin with...
probably
And who said Jak has always been THIS good?No what I did was divert the conversation by giving all the credit for Jak’s improvement to Pop
I also did the same for Luka and Murray...
but you took offense to the Jak part. for some reason and even suggested that Pop has inhibited Jak as a player by saying he could’ve been better on another team. Pop has a stellar track record for teaching youth to play and mold them into better players. But somehow he didn’t improve Jak one bit? Jak was always that good? C’mon man. We both know that ain’t true. If Jak “always” played this well then I probably wouldn’t have ed about the contract to begin with...
probably
Now you are just making up because you know you have no leg to stand on.
Of course Poeltl has never been this good. No player is as good in his rookie year as in the following ones. The argument has never been that Poeltl has been THIS good. The point is that Poeltl has never been a scrub. He has met expectations ever since he arrived to the league and he just keeps getting better as the natural development process indicates. Your problem was trying to sell Poeltl as some kind of scrub that only got good when he got to the Spurs just to try to make your point. That's what people called you out on.
Nah he was always a scrub. He had potential sure. But a guy who averaged 4 points 4 rebounds his first 3 seasons with Toronto and played less than 20 minutes a game is pretty scrub like. It’s almost the definition. He was also had that scrub mentality when he got here where he would foul like crazy bc he had no idea how to play proper defense. Pop benched him for stupid fouls and got rid of that habit. He taught Poeltl positioning and where to be in order to not foul. Poeltl would not be this good in Toronto. To say otherwise IS a slight to PopAnd who said Jak has always been THIS good?
Now you are just making up because you know you have no leg to stand on.
Of course Poeltl has never been this good. No player is as good in his rookie year as in the following ones. The argument has never been that Poeltl has been THIS good. The point is that Poeltl has never been a scrub. He has met expectations ever since he arrived to the league and he just keeps getting better as the natural development process indicates. Your problem was trying to sell Poeltl as some kind of scrub that only got good when he got to the Spurs just to try to make your point. That's what people called you out on.
I guess Devin Vassell isn't a promising rookie that will get better with time, he's just a scrub because he averages less than 20 mpg and shoots 39% from the field. See how re ed your argument is?
His last season in Toronto, Poeltl averaged 7 pts and 5 rbds with positive metrics both on offense and defense. Those numbers declined the following 2 seasons after getting to San Antonio. If anything, getting here might have slowed his development a bit.
Stop trying to argue this . Your argument is dumb. You make no sense, you have no evidence to back you up, and when you find yourself without a comeback you resort to moving goal posts or trying to play with semantics. I see it, you see it, we all see it. Stop embarrassing yourself. The posters everybody hates are the ones that keep fighting lost causes that everyone and their mothers can see are lost.
Tim Duncan bless, son.
Last edited by DAF86; 03-04-2021 at 12:51 AM.
It takes a while to just know our playbook...usually at least one year just to be able to follow the main guidelines...I know after DDR and LMA came here the playbook, at least the first year, has been limited and so become more simplier, but I think that with a NBDL team playing the same plays we have now a pretty solid habit of developing our player's knowledge of the entire playbook.
I say that because the conversation above is simply one that, I hope, can be explained and resolved in the sense that Poeltl improvement belong in part to his natural develompent as a skilled player from the beginning (DAF86) in part because of the teaching skills of Pop and our environment and other coaches (KobeAchilles), in part, finally, in consideration of the necessary time to absorb the main principles of our difficult playbook (possible missing link)...
Guys who have never seen Poeltl play before being traded to SA talking about his years in Toronto
Strangley enough the same guys been saying he's not worth his contract.
Well done, keep on going. You're raising the ceiling of ST
I wonder where Shakril is these days
My argument is that Pop developed Jak. You say he didn’t. Then you suggested he would be even better somewhere else. I mean how would he be better than he is now? Seriously.I guess Devin Vassell isn't a promising rookie that will get better with time, he's just a scrub because he averages less than 20 mpg and shoots 39% from the field. See how re ed your argument is?
His last season in Toronto, Poeltl averaged 7 pts and 5 rbds with positive metrics both on offense and defense. Those numbers declined the following 2 seasons after getting to San Antonio. If anything, getting here might have slowed his development a bit.
Stop trying to argue this . Your argument is dumb. You make no sense, you have no evidence to back you up, and when you find yourself without a comeback you resort to moving goal posts or trying to play with semantics. I see it, you see it, we all see it. Stop embarrassing yourself. The posters everybody hates are the ones that keep fighting lost causes that everyone and their mothers can see are lost.
Tim Duncan bless, son.
And yes to answer your question about Vassell. If he had 3 straight seasons of trash scoring and never got much playing time in those 3 seasons I would totally say he was a bust for where he was drafted. You don’t draft a guy at 11 hoping he can give you 18 minutes a game. Poeltl had no feel for the game. Pop knew it. Timvp ran a report on him when we got him and it said he was foul prone.
Now all of a sudden he doesn’t foul as often. But that has nothing to do with Pop? Pop taught him technique, positioning his body, and demanded something from Jak that honestly wasn’t demanded from him over in Toronto and that was to pay attention to detail. Jak had the tools. But if you can’t see Pop’s influence on Jak’s game that isn’t me being wrong that is you being blind.
Poeltl shot 59% of his free throws in his second season in Toronto. And for the Spurs? What does that say about the Spurs development?
The Spurs developed Jak, but so did the Raptors (and Utah before that). I mean, the Raptors proved to be good in developing players over the last few seasons: VanFleet, Siakam, Anunoby,... Jak played from the beginning for the Raptors and was part of the Raptors "Bench Mob" in his second year - a line-up, which had similar numbers to this year's Spurs bench. And Jak was a big reason for that. He had a +10 netrating as a rookie, +18 in year 2. he definitely was no scrub when he came into the league. The Raptors would have been happy to keep him if they hadn't got the chance for Kawhi.
If you don't stop lying on him, Coach Knight will throw a chair at you from the retirement home!!!
It looks like they have been re-working his free throw shot. When you do that, things typically get worse before they get better until you get confident with the new form.Poeltl shot 59% of his free throws in his second season in Toronto. And for the Spurs? What does that say about the Spurs development?
Granted, 31% is ing awful
It's not like he just dropped off a cliff out of nowhere, and at least he is taking the time to try to improve even if the results aren't there yet.
He's a smart player, he understands what iy takes to play at that level and has worked his ass off
We have two different definitions of scrubs. I mean the guy came in as a top 10 pick and gave you 1 made basket and 3 rebounds a game in 11 minutes a game. You make him sound like was some integral part of the team. If he was so important, why did play so little? Kwame Brown probably makes your hall of fame if your standards are that low. I'd love to have you as my agent, but hate to have you as my GM. Look at his net rating as a rookie! Yeah he didn't play any or score any or rebound any, but that net rating though. He was a BIG part of the bench squad... even though the rest of the bench got more minutes than himPoeltl shot 59% of his free throws in his second season in Toronto. And for the Spurs? What does that say about the Spurs development?
The Spurs developed Jak, but so did the Raptors (and Utah before that). I mean, the Raptors proved to be good in developing players over the last few seasons: VanFleet, Siakam, Anunoby,... Jak played from the beginning for the Raptors and was part of the Raptors "Bench Mob" in his second year - a line-up, which had similar numbers to this year's Spurs bench. And Jak was a big reason for that. He had a +10 netrating as a rookie, +18 in year 2. he definitely was no scrub when he came into the league. The Raptors would have been happy to keep him if they hadn't got the chance for Kawhi.
He did explode in year 2. I will give you that. He nearly tripled his production offensively and doubled it rebounding wise. His defense was probably pretty good too. I didn't watch a lot of Toronto games other than when they folded in the playoffs or if we faced them. So I am no Raptor expert.
But this year, I don't know what Pop did to him in the middle of the season but it worked. Jakob seemed whiney all offseason, looked like he put in zero effort at all during the offseason. His free throw percentage actually helps my point with Pop not hurts it. Without Pop, his lazy ass didn't shoot a single free throw during the offseason. With Pop (and obviously others in the coaching staff) it has gotten progressively better. Poeltl came in here whining about wanting more minutes and wanting to be a starter and Pop sent his ass to the bench, told Poeltl what he expected from him in order to be a starter, high lighted what they are going to focus on to improve during the season, and told him that he wouldn't expect anything less than his best. And this is the result.
He didn't just magically get better in the middle of the season. That is coaching
Are we ignoring that his better play and foul rate are probably caused by him not having to cover Forbes as much? He's going to look good with 2-3 plus defenders and look bad with less.
That is Poodle agent won’t hear from him until next contract time. Lol
It was funny, I sat right behind Luka and Keldon at a game last season, and watching Luka made me think of how a high school kid would act if you suddenly handed him a couple million dollars. You realize truly how young and naive these guys are when you have any opportunity to be near them for a bit. He's obviously making great strides in just a year.
Good write up and have to say I agree with you 100% - Poodle is the type of Player that needs hard consistent coaching or he will just fade away. What soured me on him is that he whined about getting more minutes but you could tell he put ZERO work this off season - His free throws form and shooting were just terrible and don’t even talk about mid range or 3We have two different definitions of scrubs. I mean the guy came in as a top 10 pick and gave you 1 made basket and 3 rebounds a game in 11 minutes a game. You make him sound like was some integral part of the team. If he was so important, why did play so little? Kwame Brown probably makes your hall of fame if your standards are that low. I'd love to have you as my agent, but hate to have you as my GM. Look at his net rating as a rookie! Yeah he didn't play any or score any or rebound any, but that net rating though. He was a BIG part of the bench squad... even though the rest of the bench got more minutes than him
He did explode in year 2. I will give you that. He nearly tripled his production offensively and doubled it rebounding wise. His defense was probably pretty good too. I didn't watch a lot of Toronto games other than when they folded in the playoffs or if we faced them. So I am no Raptor expert.
But this year, I don't know what Pop did to him in the middle of the season but it worked. Jakob seemed whiney all offseason, looked like he put in zero effort at all during the offseason. His free throw percentage actually helps my point with Pop not hurts it. Without Pop, his lazy ass didn't shoot a single free throw during the offseason. With Pop (and obviously others in the coaching staff) it has gotten progressively better. Poeltl came in here whining about wanting more minutes and wanting to be a starter and Pop sent his ass to the bench, told Poeltl what he expected from him in order to be a starter, high lighted what they are going to focus on to improve during the season, and told him that he wouldn't expect anything less than his best. And this is the result.
He didn't just magically get better in the middle of the season. That is coaching
ball work. He didn’t look like he lifted weights nor even worked on dunking the ball that told me he just expected to start and get better all by magic.
I have not been a fan and have said he is not a starter but a good bench player. But like Luka it looks like the light bulb may have finally gone on for him. I do think Pop had some tough love conversations with him and what he needs to do daily and what he needs to do to get better if he wants to continue to be a Spur. The last couple of games I have given him props he almost had back to back doubles and if he can continue to get 8 to 10 pts and 8 to 10 rebounds a game I will be a happy camper and will give him his props.
Like I said, moving goal posts and/or changing words to invent an answer.
Poeltl has been a good player ever since he got to the league. He posted positive metrics ever since his 2nd year. He improved every year (except that year that he went from the Raptors to the Spurs). These are all facts and that's what I'm looking at. You can carry on with your unsupported opinion though, just don't expect folks that know better to buy it, tbh.
that's not bad at all tbh...
the guy literally said in an interview that basketball doesn’t motivate him and he only plays it cause he’s tall
somehow people here whine about players not putting in work but Jakob Turtle gets a pass cause he plays defense
Agreed.the guy literally said in an interview that basketball doesn’t motivate him and he only plays it cause he’s tall
somehow people here whine about players not putting in work but Jakob Turtle gets a pass cause he plays defense
And these same guys refusing to give Pop any credit. Dude showed in the off-season that he put in NO work during it. He had about the tiest start to a season you could ask of from a player. Next thing you know, after couple months of actual coaching from Pop, and he is balling. But my Poeltl would always be good
Like I said, we just have two different definitions of good. I call all star players good and franchise players great. You call Jakob Poeltl good from year 2. It is what it is. I considered Poeltl meh to aight.Like I said, moving goal posts and/or changing words to invent an answer.
Poeltl has been a good player ever since he got to the league. He posted positive metrics ever since his 2nd year. He improved every year (except that year that he went from the Raptors to the Spurs). These are all facts and that's what I'm looking at. You can carry on with your unsupported opinion though, just don't expect folks that know better to buy it, tbh.
I don't know how Poeltl would have fared on another team. Maybe he would be less of a player, maybe he would be better. Likely he would be right about the same. That's what you said. I didn't have to invent anything. The guy came into this season playing beyond horribly. He showed no proof that he worked on anything during the offseason. All he really did was whine about his minutes and how he should start. Dude doesn't seem to be self-motivated and he himself has said so. raw talent is useless without a drive. He needs real coaching and Pop is giving it to him.
And how do you transform that sentence into "you said he would be even better on another team"?
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