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  1. #51
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    Where in that post did I talk about height? The problem isn't that Sochan can't play PG because he's 6'9", he can't play PG because he doesn't have the skills for it. Simple as that. He doesn't have the ball-habdling of a PG, he doesn't have the first step of a PG, he doesn't have the shot creation of a PG, he can't shoot. Among many other things.

    Lebron is 6'9" and he would make a great PG.

    Sochan isn't Lebron. Sochan is more on the mold of a Draymond Green or Bam Adebayo. Good secondary ball-handlers/playmakers, that work great on that role, but that if you made them full-time PGs would struggle mightly.

    And in the case of Wembanyama it is the same. Sure, you can play him as a forward if you want, but you will be taking away all the things that make him a matchup nightmare. Folks wanting him to play more as a Durant than a Jokic are fatally mistaken on what makes Wemby a great prospect.

    Wemby can shoot a bit FOR A CENTER. He averages 28% from 3 on FIBA sized 3 pt line. That's not a Durant that you can constantly have on the perimeter taking jumpshots.

    Wemby can dribble the ball a bit FOR A CENTER. He turns the ball a lot as it is, imagine having him constantly on the perimeter.

    Wemby can move his feet laterally a bit FOR A CENTER. If you have him constantly guarding opossing forwards on the perimeter he will get burned more times than not.

    Make no mistake about it, Wemby's biggest strength is his ungodly length, and the way to make the most of that is to play him at center.
    Prepare to be disappointed. They have already said that they are going to start him at the 4 as his game and body develops.

  2. #52
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    Prepare to be disappointed. They have already said that they are going to start him at the 4 as his game and body develops.
    while i believe this is the likely outcome, when did the spurs say wemby will start at the 4? they havent even formally acknowledged that he will be the pick

  3. #53
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Prepare to be disappointed. They have already said that they are going to start him at the 4 as his game and body develops.
    It doesn't worry me because at the end of the day I know Wemby will inevitably end up as the center of the team.

  4. #54
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    This reminded me of the time I argued against Keldon being a PF. Everybody and their mother argued here that he should play there, the Spurs even played him there. What did end up happening? He's a SF now. Time puts everything on its place.

  5. #55
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    It doesn't worry me because at the end of the day I know Wemby will inevitably end up as the center of the team.
    5+ years down the road? Sure. Not now, though. I'm convinced that Wemby's unicorn analog, Porzingod (7'3" 230 pre-draft), was destroyed by injuries caused by playing center early in his career. Only now, when teams are moving him to the perimeter is he getting back above 65 games/30 minutes. It took 4 years, including one missed season.

  6. #56
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    5+ years down the road? Sure. Not now, though. I'm convinced that Wemby's unicorn analog, Porzingod (7'3" 230 pre-draft), was destroyed by injuries caused by playing center early in his career. Only now, when teams are moving him to the perimeter is he getting back above 65 games/30 minutes. It took 4 years, including one missed season.
    Wemby will be finishing games at C as soon as next season. By the time the Spurs are back in contention (which I hope it won't take 5 years) Wemby will be playing center full time, 'cause that's where he will be at his most effective.

  7. #57
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    while i believe this is the likely outcome, when did the spurs say wemby will start at the 4? they havent even formally acknowledged that he will be the pick
    Apparently that is what he and his club want and was what he got his clubs in France to agree to. I could have sworn I saw it for the Spurs too but I am wrong. Youre right about the Spurs they have been mum.

  8. #58
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    Wemby will be finishing games at C as soon as next season. By the time the Spurs are back in contention (which I hope it won't take 5 years) Wemby will be playing center full time, 'cause that's where he will be at his most effective.
    He doesn't want to play center. He wants to play power forward. He says he wants to let his body put on weight naturally. So maybe when he is into his 20s a bit.

  9. #59
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    while i believe this is the likely outcome, when did the spurs say wemby will start at the 4? they havent even formally acknowledged that he will be the pick
    In a piece of gigantic stupid ery, the NBA has prohibited them from saying the obvious, that Wemby will be their pick. Nevertheless, he will be, and they've been planning for this for months, just in case. Word is percolating out from their FO.

  10. #60
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    We aren’t tanking this season bro….. if that’s considered win now to you. Time to get back to playing ball; there to much buzz surrounding the team.
    Nah I didn't say tank, I don't think we'll tank. But I think Wemby will get controlled minutes to prioritize his long term health.

    "Win now" in my mind is using all that cap space, signing veterans, playing the starters heavy minutes, etc

  11. #61
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    If off the bench who's our sg? 30% Branham?

  12. #62
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
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    If off the bench who's our sg? 30% Branham?
    Kevin Durant shot 28.8% as a rookie. Good shooters eventually figure it out. His shot so pure, and coupled with his 83% FTs, I have a hard time not seeing him eventually be a 40% 3 point shooter.

  13. #63
    俺はまんこが大好きなんだよ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Spurs are probably going to need to trade Keldon because I can't imagine he's going to be happy with a bench role when he's still a young player trying to make a name for himself in this league. Sucks to do but Sochan is too good a prospect to hinder with a move to the bench, especially after seeing the way he learned and developed from a DeAndre Jordan level FT shooter to a Sean Elliott level FT shooter over the course of a season. Though that would definitely necessitate adding a PG who can shoot the three.

  14. #64
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    At people thinking entering most halves (he'll still likely occasionally start even if everyone is available due to matchups) approximately 6 minutes in, is going to "stunt Sochan's development" . . . because it really held back that Ginobili guy.

  15. #65
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    He doesn't want to play center. He wants to play power forward. He says he wants to let his body put on weight naturally. So maybe when he is into his 20s a bit.
    He says that but he already plays as a center in France, so it really doesn't matter what he says.

  16. #66
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    Supposedly, like Duncan, he doesn't have a problem playing C so much as being put in the traditional box of one.

  17. #67
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    At people thinking entering most halves (he'll still likely occasionally start even if everyone is available due to matchups) approximately 6 minutes in, is going to "stunt Sochan's development" . . . because it really held back that Ginobili guy.
    When you start on the bench, you inevitably play less minutes per game than if you were starting. Playing less minutes per game prevents you from developing at the rate you would be developing getting starters minutes.

  18. #68
    俺はまんこが大好きなんだよ baseline bum's Avatar
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    At people thinking entering most halves (he'll still likely occasionally start even if everyone is available due to matchups) approximately 6 minutes in, is going to "stunt Sochan's development" . . . because it really held back that Ginobili guy.
    Manu was 29 and already a star by the time he went to the bench.

  19. #69
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    When you start on the bench, you inevitably play less minutes per game than if you were starting. Playing less minutes per game prevents you from developing at the rate you would be developing getting starters minutes.
    Nah. Wembanyama is probably looking at around 30 mpg and Collins mid-high 20s mpg and I'd be surprised if either exceeds 70 games.

    That leaves plenty of opportunity for Sochan to play mid-high 20s mpg himself, which is fine. He's not some elite prospect (not every good/pedigreed prospect starts, even for re-building teams) and virtually everything from now on should be based on what's best for Wembanyama.

    Manu was 29 and already a star by the time he went to the bench.
    I'm well aware. The point stands.

  20. #70
    Wolf Ruvinskis tonight...you's Avatar
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    Nah. Wembanyama is probably looking at around 30 mpg and Collins mid-high 20s mpg and I'd be surprised if either exceeds 70 games.

    That leaves plenty of opportunity for Sochan to play mid-high 20s mpg himself, which is fine. He's not some elite prospect (not every good/pedigreed prospect starts, even for re-building teams) and virtually everything from now on should be based on what's best for Wembanyama.



    I'm well aware. The point stands.
    The point that 29 year old, fully developed Manu wasn't held back from developing more by being on the bench so Sochan should be held in the same category in that respect?
    Interesting point.

  21. #71
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Nah. Wembanyama is probably looking at around 30 mpg and Collins mid-high 20s mpg and I'd be surprised if either exceeds 70 games.

    That leaves plenty of opportunity for Sochan to play mid-high 20s mpg himself, which is fine. He's not some elite prospect (not every good/pedigreed prospect starts, even for re-building teams) and virtually everything from now on should be based on what's best for Wembanyama.



    I'm well aware. The point stands.
    Sochan averaged 26 mpg on his rookie season, common sense dictates he should play considerable more minutes on his sop re year if he were to develop as expected. I think 30 mpg should be the minimum to expect from him minutes wise. And that will be hard to do if he watches the first 6 minutes of each half from the bench.

  22. #72
    Out with the old... Obstructed_View's Avatar
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    Ginobili was a 57th pick that nobody cared about. That’s why he came off the bench. A top 10 lottery pick coming off the bench can only be seen as a failure.
    Sorry, but I'm pretty sure that is wrong. I'm also pretty sure Hedo Turkoglu didn't have anything to do with Manu going to the bench.

    Manu had established himself as the second best player behind Duncan when he went to the bench, and it's because Michael Finley's ego couldn't cope with not starting. Look at when his starting numbers dropped.

    I agree with you that Sochan should start, though. 100 percent. Sochan is the best Spurs rookie since Duncan, IMO.

  23. #73
    Veteran RC_Drunkford's Avatar
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    Sorry, but I'm pretty sure that is wrong. I'm also pretty sure Hedo Turkoglu didn't have anything to do with Manu going to the bench.

    Manu had established himself as the second best player behind Duncan when he went to the bench, and it's because Michael Finley's ego couldn't cope with not starting. Look at when his starting numbers dropped.

    I agree with you that Sochan should start, though. 100 percent. Sochan is the best Spurs rookie since Duncan, IMO.
    I guess you forgot about nephew...

  24. #74
    Out with the old... Obstructed_View's Avatar
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    I guess you forgot about nephew...
    He wasn't drafted until three years later. Not sure what you are referring to. Did he and Finley even play on the Spurs at the same time?

    EDIT: oh, you mean the best rookie thing. My bad. No, I didn't forget Kawhi. Sochan was better as a rook.

  25. #75
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    The point that 29 year old, fully developed Manu wasn't held back from developing more by being on the bench so Sochan should be held in the same category in that respect? Interesting point.
    I didn't say anything about "developing". I said it didn't hold him back and it wouldn't Sochan either, like it hasn't many a player, prime, developing, etc.

    Sochan averaged 26 mpg on his rookie season, common sense dictates he should play considerable more minutes on his sop re year if he were to develop as expected. I think 30 mpg should be the minimum to expect from him minutes wise. And that will be hard to do if he watches the first 6 minutes of each half from the bench.
    One, it's rare nowadays to have an entire rotation active, so again, count on Wembanyama and Collins missing x amount of games, where if Sochan is available, he can start and play around 35 or whatever minutes.

    Two, even with both active, can easily still exceed 26 mpg off the bench, just like Ginobili often did. It's not rocket science.

    Three, only Johnson and Vassell exceeded 30 mpg last season, so let's not pretend starting guarantees x amount of minutes.

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