Call your Ideal 2025 Off-Season

[LeBowen]

Of course I can place my bets however I want. It's MY ideal off-season.

And I said it's fine to post your ideas, even if unrealistic.
But takes like we're doomed if Harper busts are unserious.

I know I’m just whistling in the wind but at anyone who thinks KD is a good mentor. Who tf has he ever mentored? KD is the ultimate ME player. he’s even worse than KoMe Bryant. Dude plays zero defense, has zero leadership, doesn’t mentor others, kills coaches, but everyone thinks he’s good bc he puts up 26 empty points a game.

I want KD as far away from Wemby as possible. Imagine wanting a guy who runs away from adversity, takes zero responsibility for losses, and admits to having no intention of being a leader wanting to mentor our ing star player

Agreed.
Exactly why I don't want him here.
He's one of the biggest cancers in the league, but somehow always gets a free pass.

[Ocotillo]

I know I’m just whistling in the wind but at anyone who thinks KD is a good mentor. Who tf has he ever mentored? KD is the ultimate ME player. he’s even worse than KoMe Bryant. Dude plays zero defense, has zero leadership, doesn’t mentor others, kills coaches, but everyone thinks he’s good bc he puts up 26 empty points a game.

I want KD as far away from Wemby as possible. Imagine wanting a guy who runs away from adversity, takes zero responsibility for losses, and admits to having no intention of being a leader wanting to mentor our ing star player

Yeah, I was scratching my head about the KD as a mentor thing myself. He works hard on his game but outside of that, I got nada. Plus, he would be I think a handful for a rookie coach who is his peer agewise.

[thOOdee]

maybe somehow getting rfa santi aldama or a center like sorber, kalkbrenner, or maxime, followed by getting durant while dumping some dead weight, with at most losing a first round pick and maybe a pick swap.

[CorrectCrusader]

Draft

• Pick #2 Dylan Harper
• Pick #14 Carter Bryant
• Pick #38 - Maxime Raynaud

Trades

• Vassell for John Collins straight up

Free Agency

• Mamu resigned one a 1-year minimum deal

Opening Day Depth Chart

Fox/Harper/Wesley
Castle/Branham
Barnes/Champ/Keldon
Jollins/Sochan/Bryant
Wemby/Raynaud/Mamu

[ginobilized]

What's your proposal for getting Ellis?

I was leaning into the ideal part of this equation. I wasn't aware of Keon's contract situation per se. I wouldn't hire me as a GM.

[Dverde]

I want crazy eyes Bobby Portis as back up big. Draft Harper. #14 is dealer’s choice. Keep Blake Wesley to practice against Harper and Castle. Cut Branham. No CP3. Do not want Giannis, KD, John Collins. Contract extension for Barnes. Don’t overpay Sochan on potential, but offer a market friendly extension. Bassey and Mamu one year minimum contracts.

[Ice009]

Blake is a great guy and good to have around the team (he seems to have a really positive at ude, works hard and cares about his health), but man, he has no touch/feel at all around the basket. Not sure that will ever get better. He's also a mediocre 3 point shooter. While I love his aggressiveness on defense, not sure if his defense is good enough to cover what he lacks on the offensive side of the ball . I really wanted him to work out and become a serviceable player. do you guys think there is still some potential improvement left?

[Dex]

Blake is a great guy and good to have around the team (he seems to have a really positive at ude, works hard and cares about his health), but man, he has no touch/feel at all around the basket. Not sure that will ever get better. He's also a mediocre 3 point shooter. While I love his aggressiveness on defense, not sure if his defense is good enough to cover what he lacks on the offensive side of the ball . I really wanted him to work out and become a serviceable player. do you guys think there is still some potential improvement left?

I love his speed and tenacity on the fast break, but yeah...doesn't do much good if you can't finish at the rim and I feel like that is one of those skills you develop growing up (and not later in your NBA career).

His three-point shoot seems to have improved which I think makes him serviceable, but his ceiling is still probably end-of-the-bench role player. Still think he is a better prospect than Branham which is crazy considering their draft position.

[Ice009]

You are right, he has improved his 3 point shot, but he's not really a consistent threat from outside. Really does suck as I loved the energy he brought in the first few games of his rookie season. I wish he never got injured to see if he could have built off of that.

His speed is nice on the fast break, but again, not much of a threat to finish and his passing also isn't the best in those situations.

I also like that he can play full court defense and pressure if need be.

[Dverde]

When Castle mentioned in some interview the game was slowing down for him midseason, it reminded me of Blake Wesley’s issues. His feel for the game still feels off. I love his work ethic, defense tenacity, he involves others on the court, but I doubt his future will be here. As I mentioned earlier, I think he is worth keeping around for one last year.

[rjv]

Wemby is fully healthy.

[Ignazzz]

Make impossible possible. Cooper Flagg.

[John B]

Who does Wemby benefit from learning more from? Giannis or Durant? With Giannis, he learns how to train his body. With Durant, he refines his game and masters it. Max out on longevity or max out skill?

Hands down Gianni’s’ work ethic. I don’t want diva soft KD influencing Wemby. But I rather they build up and save their future picks, than splurge on costly trades. When the championship team starts rolling, vets ring chasers will start knocking cheap. The Spurs can afford to play patient.

My ideal: Trade Vassell to Nets to get #8, however it takes. Before Vassell’s value goes down.

#2 Harper, #8 Sorber, #14 Bryant (I don’t know who’s available at #14 either between Sorber or Bryant). And if Reynaud is available at #38 or another defensive big.

Sign either Adams or Capela as backup center.

Another scenario is trading #2 plus Vassell and couple of future FRP’s to facilitate Giannis to Mavs. Bucks gets Vassell, just maybe Lively if Mavs is desperate, and multiple FRP’s. The Spurs gets Flagg. That’s the only scenario that I’ll trade #2 Harper, to get Flagg.

[Chinook]

I feel like a lot of folks only know Durant from his tweets. The dude clearly has a high work ethic, and yes, he does mentor young players around the league. , so did Kobe, which is why it's weird for a poster to use Bryant as an example of a bad mentor. Like with Kobe, there's a reason why Durant is so highly thought of by his fellow players. I think it's silly to confuse Durant not winning a le as a top option as him not being a leader or teacher. Wemby in particular seems to like Durant far more than he likes Giannis. I'm not sure what Giannis could even teach Victor, but the age difference doesn't work well in their favor. Giannis may not leave MKE because he's been given so much control there. He's the king of that city, and he's not going to be second fiddle to Wemby. Durant already knows he wont' be the first fiddle at this point. So Wemby's not compe ion for him; he's a talent he can work with, ala Robinson and Duncan.

I'm not saying Durant has done bad things (that Scarlett Johansson tweet remains the most cringe thing I've ever seen an NBA player do), but I actually think that just makes Durant a better mentor. Wemby already has Tim and David as folks he can look to who stayed with one team their whole careers. I think having a guy like Durant, who can tell him exactly what he's giving up if he caves to pressure and toxic "alpha mentality" and lets it force him to leave good situations. I've always found Durant to be pretty thoughtful when he's giving interviews. He's a person who's learned a lot and really just seems to enjoy being around basketball, let alone getting to play it. I don't know what happens when he gets in front of a keyboard, but I think Durant would be really good for the Spurs culture, whereas I think Giannis would be toxic to it.

[Manu&Duncan fan]

I feel like a lot of folks only know Durant from his tweets. The dude clearly has a high work ethic, and yes, he does mentor young players around the league. , so did Kobe, which is why it's weird for a poster to use Bryant as an example of a bad mentor. Like with Kobe, there's a reason why Durant is so highly thought of by his fellow players. I think it's silly to confuse Durant not winning a le as a top option as him not being a leader or teacher. Wemby in particular seems to like Durant far more than he likes Giannis. I'm not sure what Giannis could even teach Victor, but the age difference doesn't work well in their favor. Giannis may not leave MKE because he's been given so much control there. He's the king of that city, and he's not going to be second fiddle to Wemby. Durant already knows he wont' be the first fiddle at this point. So Wemby's not compe ion for him; he's a talent he can work with, ala Robinson and Duncan.

I'm not saying Durant has done bad things (that Scarlett Johansson tweet remains the most cringe thing I've ever seen an NBA player do), but I actually think that just makes Durant a better mentor. Wemby already has Tim and David as folks he can look to who stayed with one team their whole careers. I think having a guy like Durant, who can tell him exactly what he's giving up if he caves to pressure and toxic "alpha mentality" and lets it force him to leave good situations. I've always found Durant to be pretty thoughtful when he's giving interviews. He's a person who's learned a lot and really just seems to enjoy being around basketball, let alone getting to play it. I don't know what happens when he gets in front of a keyboard, but I think Durant would be really good for the Spurs culture, whereas I think Giannis would be toxic to it.

Yes. Durant definitely can teach Wemby a lot of skills, while his bad ego won't affect Wemby.

If he can agree MLE for year 2 and 3, then it's a perfect situation for both sides. He can get two more les before retiring.

He still want to win badly. So, this trade of (Vassell + Keldon + #14 + Brahnam) could happen.

[LeBowen]

The dude clearly has a high work ethic

Noone said he doesn't.

, so did Kobe, which is why it's weird for a poster to use Bryant as an example of a bad mentor. Like with Kobe, there's a reason why Durant is so highly thought of by his fellow players.

It's not just about skillset, but mentality.
Do you want a player with Kobe's mentality on the Spurs? I don't.
For players like Kobe and KD their own ego is always more important than the team.
Fellow players like that because everyone looks for their best interests.

I think it's silly to confuse Durant not winning a le as a top option as him not being a leader or teacher.

It has nothing to do with him not being a leader, it's about his mentality.
Leaving OKC was fine, he did everything he could. But then he chose to join a team that just ended his OKC career and happened to be the best regular season team ever.
He won two, time for redemption? Think again.

Brooklyn? Brand new team, hand picked teammates and co-stars...not good enough for him. Two years and he wanted out.
I guess you don't remember how Atinkson got fired because they wanted Nash to coach them or how Jarrett Allen got traded because KD was best buddies with Deandre Jordan?

Third time's a charm? Think again.
Vogel gone after one season, then him and Booker wanted Beal and now Suns are completely ed.
Guess what? KD doesn't care, he's ready to take the next hardest road.

He's like Lebron without the actual winning part, just does the part where he sets the franchise back and s off.

Wemby in particular seems to like Durant far more than he likes Giannis. I'm not sure what Giannis could even teach Victor, but the age difference doesn't work well in their favor. Giannis may not leave MKE because he's been given so much control there. He's the king of that city, and he's not going to be second fiddle to Wemby. Durant already knows he wont' be the first fiddle at this point. So Wemby's not compe ion for him; he's a talent he can work with, ala Robinson and Duncan.

Now you're going to be one of those guys who thinks it's wrong for a superstar to stay with his team even though they're not a legit contender anymore?
Giannis had nothing when he got drafted and he wasn't projected to be the next big thing. Is it so wrong that he wants to stay with a team that made him into what he is today?

I'm not saying Durant has done bad things (that Scarlett Johansson tweet remains the most cringe thing I've ever seen an NBA player do), but I actually think that just makes Durant a better mentor.

Again, there's basketball ability mentorship and mentality/leadership aspect of mentorship.
It would be great if KD could teach Wemby to stop with those low quality isos and circus shots, but KD doesn't have much to offer on the mental side of things.

He's a person who's learned a lot and really just seems to enjoy being around basketball, let alone getting to play it. I don't know what happens when he gets in front of a keyboard, but I think Durant would be really good for the Spurs culture

The issue is that his actions are way off his interviews, he says one thing and does the other. It's always been like that.

whereas I think Giannis would be toxic to it

I don't want Giannis because as I explained in detail in another topic, we don't have enough to get him and be a let's say top5 team in the league right away.
And every year with Giannis without winning it all would be a waste.

[Chinook]

Yes. Durant definitely can teach Wemby a lot of skills, while his bad ego won't affect Wemby.

If he can agree MLE for year 2 and 3, then it's a perfect situation for both sides. He can get two more les before retiring.

He still want to win badly. So, this trade of (Vassell + Keldon + #14 + Brahnam) could happen.

Durant isn't agreeing to the MLE. That makes no sense. He's far, far (far) better than an MLE player. The Spurs have had multiple players throughout their years who could shows exactly how valuable old superstars can still be if put in the right environment. You pay Durant what he's worth, which won't be the max but is much closer to that than the MLE.

[scott]

scott I'm pretty much aligned with your scenario, but I'd rather trade Keldon + Branham instead of Devin. Since Keldon is our worst defender (5th percentile) and 3rd worst 3-point shooter (after Wesley and Sochan) he's virtually useless.

As a back up center I'd prefer Adams or Kornet. I'd probably roll with Adams if we draft Sorber, just so Sorber can get more playing time.

Adams is one of my favorite non-Spurs in the league... so I'm trying not to be too greedy and hope that by not mentioning him maybe I can reverse speak it into existence.

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Durant isn't agreeing to the MLE. That makes no sense. He's far, far (far) better than an MLE player. The Spurs have had multiple players throughout their years who could shows exactly how valuable old superstars can still be if put in the right environment. You pay Durant what he's worth, which won't be the max but is much closer to that than the MLE.

Then Spurs should walk.

Imagine at the end of the regular season, he suddenly have a serious injury.

Spurs are at a point that has no need to take risk anymore. We can win with moderate upgrades - John Collins/PJ Washington, Kennnard/Gary Trent, Lopez/Adams, etc.

[scott]

Ok I know the usual suspects will go crazy but this is MY ideal scenario :

Trade #2 + Vassell + Sochan for #7 + Murphy + Herb Jones (I even add a protected future first if needed)

In one trade you purify the roster completely. Harper better be Harden on steroids for this trade not to be worth it. If he busts the Wemby era might be effed forever. Imo it's no brainer to trade the pick.

Draft Demin at 7 and Reynaud at 14

Fox CP3
Castle Demin
Jones Champagnie
Murphy Barnes
Wemby Reynaud

This team is awesome and can go blow for blow with OKC next season. Still would look to upgrade from Fox in a few years (Garland or someone else with a 3pt shot would be ideal).

All scenarios are welcome in my "Call Your Ideal Off-Season" threads. Hopefully it leads to some good, respectful, conversation.

[scott]

I was leaning into the ideal part of this equation. I wasn't aware of Keon's contract situation per se. I wouldn't hire me as a GM.

Haha, all good. I like Ellis as a player so I genuinely curious. He's just in one of those weird contract situations that make him hard to get. Toumani is another guy like that, IMO. Would love to have him but it would cost a fortune from POR to get him in part due to his contract.

[scott]

Blake is a great guy and good to have around the team (he seems to have a really positive at ude, works hard and cares about his health), but man, he has no touch/feel at all around the basket. Not sure that will ever get better. He's also a mediocre 3 point shooter. While I love his aggressiveness on defense, not sure if his defense is good enough to cover what he lacks on the offensive side of the ball . I really wanted him to work out and become a serviceable player. do you guys think there is still some potential improvement left?

I'd love to see what Blake is after a year of being Fox's understudy. IMO, De'Aaron is the perfect guy for Blake to model his game after. Whether or not he has enough talent, is another question... but I kind of want to see what Blake looks like this time next year.

[KobesAchilles]

I feel like a lot of folks only know Durant from his tweets. The dude clearly has a high work ethic, and yes, he does mentor young players around the league. , so did Kobe, which is why it's weird for a poster to use Bryant as an example of a bad mentor. Like with Kobe, there's a reason why Durant is so highly thought of by his fellow players. I think it's silly to confuse Durant not winning a le as a top option as him not being a leader or teacher. Wemby in particular seems to like Durant far more than he likes Giannis. I'm not sure what Giannis could even teach Victor, but the age difference doesn't work well in their favor. Giannis may not leave MKE because he's been given so much control there. He's the king of that city, and he's not going to be second fiddle to Wemby. Durant already knows he wont' be the first fiddle at this point. So Wemby's not compe ion for him; he's a talent he can work with, ala Robinson and Duncan.

I'm not saying Durant has done bad things (that Scarlett Johansson tweet remains the most cringe thing I've ever seen an NBA player do), but I actually think that just makes Durant a better mentor. Wemby already has Tim and David as folks he can look to who stayed with one team their whole careers. I think having a guy like Durant, who can tell him exactly what he's giving up if he caves to pressure and toxic "alpha mentality" and lets it force him to leave good situations. I've always found Durant to be pretty thoughtful when he's giving interviews. He's a person who's learned a lot and really just seems to enjoy being around basketball, let alone getting to play it. I don't know what happens when he gets in front of a keyboard, but I think Durant would be really good for the Spurs culture, whereas I think Giannis would be toxic to it.

Durant is thought highly of bc he is a skilled player. He has a “full bag” as the players like to say. But a lot of what you said is so completely wrong that I’m surprised you think that way. The reason why I don’t think KD is a leader is bc KD himself literally said: “I’m not a leader.” Him not being able to win championships despite his ability has proven him correct imo. So it’s by his own admission that I don’t think he’s a leader. Also Kobe might be the worst leader of any superstar player. He ran Shaq out. He ran Phil out. He quit on his team in game 7 of the playoffs. He beefed with his teammates through out his career. From Shaq to Smush to Pau and Bynum to Nick Young to Russel to Randel. He was a terrible leader for young players and by all accounts the team vets basically had to slap him to stay in line during the 3peat.

He had great work ethic. Kobe had the best moveset in the league. He was a great player. But he hated young players and hated was ty to teammates pretty much all the time. It’s only masked by them winning with Pau. Tbh I think I’m more impressed with Pau Gasol than most people are just for putting up with that level of toxicity on the court and media.

KD runs away from adversity. He just does. You can say well he can tell Wemby all the downsides that came with leaving from franchise to franchise but KD is too prideful for that. Dude has never accepted that he wasn’t good enough to not get a team to a championship as the lead dog. It’s just excuses with him. He gets coaches fired, he values friends over fit (and that’s something I really wish Wemby doesn’t do) and I’ve never seen him say in the past decade “I’m the issue. I’m the reason why we lost. I will rally the troops and get us past this.” I have seen him say it’s the role players fault. It’s the fit of the team. It’s managements fault. It’s the coaches fault. Heck I know Chuck said KD isn’t a bus driver and just a passenger but man KD has ran over a lot of people and reversed back over them time and time again.

You don’t think Giannis could teach Wemby how to spend every day as a pro? You don’t think he can teach Wemby how much he needs to be in the weight room. How he needs to be on his diet. How he needs to change his mentality and at ude. I’m sure Wemby is aware of all these things but Giannis does all of these things at the top level of any athlete in the world. How many times does Wemby jog back on offense? How many times does he mentally check himself out of plays. How many times has he checked himself out of entire quarters. Giannis doesn’t play that way. There is no checking out with Giannis. There is no jogging on offense with Giannis. There is no I’m going to take the backseat for the next 5 plays with Giannis or I’m tired so I’m going to jack up a three. we have a thread on here calling Wemby soft. Nobody calls Giannis soft. We don’t have a grown dog pitbull in our yard. We have a growing one but he’s not there yet.

You are the poster who correctly said, that Wemby isn’t a franchise player yet. He can be soon. But he isn’t there yet. Well Giannis shouldn’t take a back seat to Wemby. He will force Wemby to up his game to a higher standard while KD will just let Wemby hoop. That’s the difference. Giannis will push Wemby and KD will just let Wemby be.

[KobesAchilles]

Scott. What do you see as the price for Giannis? Am I way off on what you think it would take to get him?

[LeBowen]

Scott. What do you see as the price for Giannis? Am I way off on what you think it would take to get him?

Not scott, but as I wrote before, the optimistic Giannis package would be something like:
Devin
Jeremy (those two for sure)
Barnes or Keldon (whichever they prefer as a salary match)
#2 or Castle (Bucks would probably ask for Castle and not Jeremy, but we have to draw the line somewhere, they probably take Harper because of his higher ceiling)
3 or 4 more FRPs
#14 '25
'27 ATL
'29 SAS
And a bunch of SRPs would be my best realistic guess.

Then we'd be left with no tradeable picks before '31 and the following roster:
Fox/?/Wesley
Castle/?/Branham
Barnes/Champ/?
Giannis/?/?
Wemby/?/?

How exactly would you fill out that roster?
Around 10 million cap space and MLE left.
That's a great starting 5 and Champ as the only reliable bench player.

And that's the optimistic scenario. Bucks probably hold the line at both Harper and Castle.

The issue isn't trading for Giannis, the issue is that we'd definitely need a couple more trades.
Reliable backup PG, another reliable wing and Wemby backup.

Brand new team, new coach with no experience and Wemby coming off a serious injury.
Too many moving parts for something not to go wrong. And then we'd be ed.
At least that's how I see things because I'm always prepared for the worst.