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nowitzki... am tentative about it... but nowitzki...
Steve Nash
Tim Duncan
Chauncy Billups
Dirk Nowitzki
Shaquille O'Neal
Actually, I'm glad you put Shaq on the list. i want to see who the first person to vote for him is. Do we have Heat fans in here?
nowitzki... am tentative about it... but nowitzki...
Billups almost has a all star team around him. He is far from carrying that team. They are still good without him.
As much as it pains me to say this, put Billups on this current Suns team without Amare and they would win 25-30 games. I love Billups and I think he deserves recognition for the award but he isnt our main leader. 4 other Pistons help lead this team in many different ways and I am sorry but Billups isnt a leader like Nash is.
IMO only two of those guys are irreplaceable in their teams' gameplan. Billups, Duncan and Shaq are very good, but their absence wouldn't absolutely cripple their teams' playing style.
The leading candidates are:
1. Nash
2. Dirk
If the MVP voting actually turns out that way, would that be the first time 2 white boys would finish 1-2 in the MVP vote? </racist>
To be fair, if you take any of those guys off of their respective teams, those teams would be completely different...
I voted for Shaq because I could...
Nash. Billups winning the MVP would take too much away from what the other 4 guys do. IMO, Ben and Sheed are just as important to the team as Chauncey is.
Voted for Dirk, but I think Nash would take it. The ironic part is - both players don't care much about the award
And the irony that they both don't play defense and used to be on the same team. Marion made Nash better and Nash leaving made Dirk better. That alone gives me the reason why I think Dirk is better than Nash.
I disagree about Marion making Nash better. Marion spilled his guts after Kidd was traded that he needed a point guard to look better and it showed. If anything, Nash made Marion much, much better more than the other way around.
I can't say the same about Diaw though. I've always thought he was talented but needed the right system to succeed. I guess it's half Nash, half Diaw. Diaw feeds 20% of Marion's shots if I did my math correctly.
if the lakers make the playoffs, Kobes got it. How come he isnt on the list???
Marion makes Nash better by being a good help defender and hiding Nash's weaknesses on defense. Nash makes Marion better by finding him on the fastbreak and getting him open shots. Marion's ability to run the floor well is what gives Nash or a quality point guard to find him easier. Diaw though adds some to.
You, my friend, have no clue. Marion makes Nash better? All Nash needs is a guy who can run the floor and finish at the rim or hit the open 3, doesn't matter if his name is Bell, Marion, Diaw, Q or Jones . All of them have had career years with Nash. Marion just happens to be the best of the lot.
A healthy Marion led the Suns to 29 wins. Marion, Amare, Marbury and JJ combined for 44 wins. The arrival of Nash gave them 62 wins. W/o Amare, they're on pace for 56. When Nash got injured briefly last year, the Suns lost 4 or 5 straight, or else they would have been hyped as a 70-win team like the Pistons this season. Nash leads the Suns in +/- stats, not Marion.
I can understand that you overrate Marion because he punked Dirk last playoffs. But he disappeared when it mattered against a good defense. Try and watch how Nash runs that offense, how he runs the pick-n-roll in particular. It is almost undefendable. Not like he doesn't hae the stats either. 20 PPG and 14 APG with an eFG% of 55.4 is awesome.
Take Marion off the suns and see how many wins they pull off. Marion is the key to Nash's attack on offense though Diaw has added to the attack with his passing as well. When Marion got shut out by the spurs it was over. There is a reason Pop put Bowen on Marion and not Nash or Joe Johnson. If Marion is contained it is over. I figure you give Nash all the credit on offense but the defense and rebounding would not be the same without Marion. Marion allows the suns to go small without being a terrible rebounding team.
Chauncey has a chance but I'm not no, I'm not argueing his case here. The arguement is that you believe and have stated unconvinclingly that Dirk should be considered MVP because he's carrying his team, a point that after reviewing this post of yours even you seem to have abandoned.
The more you post the more confusing your argument becomes.
Are you even suggesting that Chauncey is the MVP? So far your argument has been that Chauncey is the MVP because Dirk doesn't carry his team, as evidenced by the fact that Dirk "only" plays 37 MPG (Chauncey plays 35) and that he "only" scores 25% of his team's points (Chauncey is 19%).
Can't you find any factors that favor Chauncey? Because every one of your arguments against Dirk is even more of an argument against Chauncey so far.
Chauncey definitely belongs in the MVP discussion, but not for any reasons you're giving...
Dirk is having his usual excellent year but his scoring and rebounding are both down from last year yet the team is winning far more games and that's just one more reason why you're arguement that Dirk is carrying the team is without merit.
Dirk should be given strong consideration for MVP but not at all for the reasons you have argued.
Who's confused here?
He's the floor general but I agree the load is shared too evenly for him to be considered for MVP on the arguement that he's carrying the team.
Top 5 candidates IMO in no particular order.
Nash
Wade
Dirk
Chauncey
Lebron
Kobe would be on my short list but not the top 5 because I believe the voters put weight on high team performance. Put him on one of the top teams and I believe he becomes one of the top 3
give credit where it is due Nash Hater. It is one thing to hate Nash for bolting and kicking your teams ass last year, it is another to say stupid ass things like Marion made Nash so much better. Marion has been part of the teams success this season agreed, but Nash is the difference between 30 and 50-60 wins for the Suns.
Nash will repeat.
No player in basketball at any level makes his teammates better just by playing with a certain player than Nash does, that is a fact.
3 new starters this year, and it is business as usual. Nash is unbelievable. I think if he were on the Lakers, he would get them a 2 seed, and give then a legit shot at winning the West.
That's funny. Because last season it was..."Take Amare off the suns and see how wins many they pull off." Now this season it's all about Marion?
Give credit where credit is due. Nash pushes that team to be what it is. Sure, Marion and Amare are great players...but having a guy like Nash feed you the ball for easy transition buckets, makes the game a lot easier.
I wish I could say Dirk, but he's obviously not the most valuable player to his team in the league. We have been able to win games when he's been shut down. Maybe that's due to the teams focusing so much on Dirk that he can pass to open players when they double him, who knows? But unfortunately, Nash has to be the MVP even though he's been doing the SAME things for the past 5 years. That team cannot win without Nash and we all know it. It's ashame that the MVP can't be a decent defensive player as well, but I guess it's just how the cookie crumbles. Billups cannot be considered for MVP simply because he's just as important to the team as Hamilton, Prince, Rasheed, and Ben. Maybe they can give the award to their 5 starters, cause they defenitely collectively deserve it.
Mavsfan1000, I think your case for Dirk being MVP is way off. The Suns have basically all new players except for Nash, Marion and Barbosa (Jim Jackson doesn't count since he doesn't play) and our most dominant player, Amare, has been out for most of the season and Nash has led us to the fourth best record in the league. Dirk has the same players from last year so they have played together longer. I don't see how this is considered carrying your team! Marion is a very good player but without Nash our team only won 29 games. Marion cannot carry a team like Nash. Dirk is not carrying his team since his numbers are down and he has the same players from last year. Also you have to take into consideration that Nash's numbers are up and he has a player named Diaw who makes at least five assists a game and it is amazing he is still averaging around eleven assists a game. So, I think Nash is the clear MVP, especially since he was good enough to be the MVP last year and is doing better this year and that is without Amare and all of our other player injuries. Just my two cents and yes I am a homer!
This is the guy I would pick, but I know he won't get it. After the Spurs, the Clippers are my next and only favorite team.
I don't think Steve Nash will win 2 years in a row. Shaq and Dirk are not even in the running, IMO. So, that leaves Billups and Duncan...it's a toss-up.
Why did Nash not have this type of success in Dallas than? Nash was good with Dallas but Marion raised Nash's game to the next level. He is the perfect compliment to Nash's game of run and gun. Also having a ton of outside shooters helps as well. If the suns had the best record I would think Marion would be an MVP candidate as well. I also remember the suns getting blown out by the rockets last year when Marion was out so you can't say Marion doesn't mean a lot to the suns.
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