Top 30 NBA Spurs (Updated every Sunday)

[Zunni]

You are the one with the like argument using playoff success to rate players over others...not I.

Because the playoffs don't matter? Fine.

Did you know that Perdue has a better regular season FG% than Tim or David? All hail Will!!!

[FromWayDowntown]

Noted. However, conference finals used to be the second round. If you go by that, Spurs are an annual fixture.

Says you. The argument that makes far more sense is that the playoffs during Gervin's era were fairly select company and advancing even one round deep truly meant something. Regardless, the Gervin era Spurs were among the last 4 NBA teams playing in multiple seasons; George Gervin was an extremely significant reason for that happening -- far more significant than anything than the contributions that Manu Ginobili, Sean Elliott, or Tony Parker offered to their respective teams. Gervin was the Tim Duncan/David Robinson of those teams; Parker, Ginobili, and Elliott are perhaps better, more successful versions of Mike Mitc and Johnny Moore, in that context.

Gervin as #6 in the history of this franchise is patently ridiculous. There is no reasonable rationale to support that sort of ranking for the Iceman. None. Not even the, "well I never saw the Iceman" explanation -- there is plenty of video available and certainly little doubt beyond this board that George Gervin was a substantially better basketball player than Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker are or than Sean Elliott was. I suspect that even those guys would tell you that.

I'm officially done with that issue.

[whottt]

Did you know that Perdue has a better regular season FG% than Tim or David? All hail Will!!!

False...he doesn't have a better regualar season FG% than Drob...


You are also overlooking the 15ppg difference in scoring totals...as opposed to the less than 4 difference between Gervin and Jordan.

[Zunni]

False...he doesn't have a better regualar season FG% than Drob...


You are also overlooking the 15ppg difference in scoring totals...as opposed to the less than 4 difference between Gervin and Jordan.

Perdue .553
DRob .518. Look it up.

You also don't seem to have a problem overlooking several THOUSAND points for your precious 50%, Quixote, about 10,000 in Jordan's case.

[Zunni]

I'm also seeing a DISTINCT lack of a whott list. Are you going to lay it out there, or are you just the trick ass , picking at other peoples lists, that you appear to be?

[Zunni]

(waits patiently for whott's all time Spurs FG% list)

[Zunni]

1. Coyote
2. DRob
3. Gervin

I admit, I'm having to extrapolate your Gervin/Drob ranking, but since David has more points and a higher FG%, this is my projection of your top 3.

[spurtime]

This argument is on the ridiculous side. No rational argument can be made that Gervin is any lower than #3 all time for the Spurs. If you don't like th fg% argument then you also shouldn't look at an "arbitrary" number like les. Neither Sean, nor Manu, nor TP could have won a le as the centerpiece of the teams that Gervin played on.

[whottt]

Perdue .553
DRob .518. Look it up.

Perdue's regular season FG% is 515%.

You also don't seem to have a problem overlooking several THOUSAND points for your precious 50%, Quixote, about 10,000 in Jordan's case.

Ok...fair enough I am overlooking about 7 thousand points or 10 thousand if you want to discount Gervin's ABA career...

You are overlooking about 17 thousand points...not to mention @ 15ppg.

[Zunni]

The devil is in the details. As a Spur:

Perdue .553
DRob .518

[whottt]

This argument is on the ridiculous side. No rational argument can be made that Gervin is any lower than #3 all time for the Spurs. If you don't like th fg% argument then you also shouldn't look at an "arbitrary" number like les. Neither Sean, nor Manu, nor TP could have won a le as the centerpiece of the teams that Gervin played on.

This is true....

Zunni's argument is without a doubt one of the stupidest in the history of the Universe...

However, I am not sure if we aren't just as stupid for attempting to argue with him about it...

I mean there a certain kinds of stupid that just can't be fixed...and Zunni is definitely afflicted with that kind.


Gervin < Manu, Parker and Elliott(©timvp)....

What an idiot.

[Solid D]

For those of you who don't know what some of the old-school Spurs looked like, this photo that samikeyp has as his sig is Mike "Sugar" Gale and Larry Kenon. Gale is number 25 on the Express-News Top 30. Larry "Special K"/"Mister K" Kenon has been a top 10 Spur over the years. It will be interesting to see how he fares on this list.

Is that a puca s chain on "Sugar"?

[spurtime]

Larry "Special K"/"Mister K" Kenon has been a top 10 Spur over the years. It will be interesting to see how he fares on this list.

He's #10 on mine

[whottt]

The devil is in the details. As a Spur:

Perdue .553
DRob .518

Hmmm....

Did you know that Perdue has a better regular season FG% than Tim or David?

Note the complete absence of the phrase, "As a Spur" in the original statement...


In that case, allow me to correct my Gervin argument...


As a Spur, Gervin scored 25k more points than Jordan and averaged over 26 more PPG all the while shooting over 50% better and averaging more assists, steals, to's blocks, ft's, fta, 3p and 3pa not to mention ulative totals.

[Zunni]

This argument is on the ridiculous side. No rational argument can be made that Gervin is any lower than #3 all time for the Spurs. If you don't like th fg% argument then you also shouldn't look at an "arbitrary" number like les. Neither Sean, nor Manu, nor TP could have won a le as the centerpiece of the teams that Gervin played on.

I'll admit to giving a heavy weighing to a starting or rotation role on multiple championship or deep playoff teams if you'll admit that there WERE no criteria given for the list.

AS for Sean, Manu and TP back in the day...championships? Maybe, maybe not, but their numbers sure as would have been a LOT gaudier, which seems to be most poster's currency for position on this list.

[whottt]

Gervin's numbers were gaudy even back in the day...not just by todays standards....and they went hand in hand with winning as the franchise centerpiece...a franchise that is just about to become the second winningest pct of all time...


Actually...Gervin's numbers were gaudier then than they are now...

When Gervin retired, only Wilt had won more scoring les and no freaking guard had even come close....

And his career totals were top 5 or 6...

[spurtime]

I'll admit to giving a heavy weighing to a starting or rotation role on multiple championship or deep playoff teams if you'll admit that there WERE no criteria given for the list.

AS for Sean, Manu and TP back in the day...championships? Maybe, maybe not, but their numbers sure as would have been a LOT gaudier, which seems to be most poster's currency for position on this list.

No criteria other than the blend of criteria that is always used in subjective lists like these, some are objectively verifiable, some aren't...Major statistical categories, longevity, and team success/the player's role in promoting that success. I don't see how you can look at all those things and come up with a formula that puts Gervin at below #3 on the list, unless you give heavy weight to les and ignore whether or not the person was personally the catalyst for the championship.

[Zunni]

Hmmm....




Note the complete absence of the phrase, "As a Spur" in the original statement...


In that case, allow me to correct my Gervin argument...


As a Spur, Gervin scored 25k more points than Jordan and averaged over 26 more PPG all the while shooting over 50% better and averaging more assists, steals, to's blocks, ft's, fta, 3p and 3pa not to mention ulative totals.

That ing Jordan scrub.

Here's a link to the site I used. I've actually never run across a stat searcher that would break out a player's stats by the time with one team.

stat searcher

[Zunni]

No criteria other than the blend of criteria that is always used in subjective lists like these, some are objectively verifiable, some aren't...Major statistical categories, longevity, and team success/the player's role in promoting that success. I don't see how you can look at all those things and come up with a formula that puts Gervin at below #3 on the list, unless you give heavy weight to les and ignore whether or not the person was personally the catalyst for the championship.

What is a catalyst? Is it just the primary player? Because we had Tim in 2001 and got our asses handed to us. Parker comes along the next year and we take a game from LA. With Parker AND Ginobili in '03, we dethrone the hated Lakers. Was it just Tim, or was it a much needed infusion of youth and athleticism?

[whottt]

And with Parker and Manu in tow in 2004 we again got our asses handed to us...

With Parker and Manu in 06 we lost in 7 to the biggest collection of pussies to ever come out of the Western Conference...

What's your point?

It's not like Parker and Manu prevent us from losing. DO they contribute? Of course....

Parker is the best PG in team history, and IMO, Manu is better than Parker to this point...however, Manu's has got some stiff compe ion at the 2 guard spot...not only does he have to contend with Gervin...but Alvin Robertson as well...I go with Manu over Alvin...but not because of talent, just because Manu isn't a headcase....

[spurtime]

Tim was the catalyst for all 3 les. You can argue that Manu did better at some points in the '05 le run, but we don't win any of those les without Timmy. I think Manu's playoff performances do add points in his favor over and above his stats, but nowhere near Gervin.

[Jimcs50]

What idiot does not put Ice as 3rd best Spur all time????



Had he started his career in the NBA, his scoring in points would place him in top 5 all time.

[Zunni]

Tim was the catalyst for all 3 les. You can argue that Manu did better at some points in the '05 le run, but we don't win any of those les without Timmy. I think Manu's playoff performances do add points in his favor over and above his stats, but nowhere near Gervin.

...and I think that's what it comes down to.

[Zunni]

What idiot does not put Ice as 3rd best Spur all time????



Had he started his career in the NBA, his scoring in points would place him in top 5 all time.

What idiot loans money to someone from an internet board?

[spurtime]

...and I think that's what it comes down to.

Gervin averaged 27 ppg for his career in the playoffs. He regularly had playoff performances that Manu has had a handful of times.