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What was that game earlier this season when Tony had all those assists? I remember that the team really responded and it was a great game- hopefully we'll see more of the same.
Thats the point though. Manu still only took 12 shots...he didn't need to take more...Why does one player "have to take" 20 plus shots?" The Spurs don't really need that. Except for maybe Tim...I like him to get a lot of touchs.
What was that game earlier this season when Tony had all those assists? I remember that the team really responded and it was a great game- hopefully we'll see more of the same.
Interesting, I thought Duncan's 2 blocked shot attempts and 3 turnovers had a lot more to do with it.Go take a look at "how" the lead disinigrated....Tony ran up and down the floor and didn't give the ball to anyone. Its pretty simple really.
Well, its to bad you look at 2 or 3 specific possessions instead of the bigger picture, which is the flow of the game...Thats what turns the tide of a 20 point lead. Not 2 blocked shot attempts.
I agree and tony is capable to do that but how many times fin,bowen,barry,manu get open looks and they didn't hit the ball? How many times duncan miss the layup(not "the dunk"because he doesn't want to smash)?
Honestly I saw 30 games over 40,and beacause they couldn't finish,tony looses 3,4 assists each time.Sometimes it's like Wow!?!!!
But it is also true that if tony is creating more,there are more chances of them hitting that damn ball.
But the problem is: we can't play like that,we can't play like the suns and we musn't. And...actually...we need tony taking 15 shoots per game because he is the only one who can finish(at this moment we can put the "53%FG" excuse).
And...actually... we have to be honest:we are just the third best team of the nba,that's all,whatever tony taking 8,8 shoots or 9,12 per game.
And that's why whitout parker the spurs suck and that's why parker is an all-star and that's pop is directing tony and that's why tony is doing exaaactly what pop demand him,and that's why pop is the spurs coach and not "telecomguy" or "ginobilifan" oror
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The Spurs don't need that, they need a balance. You also have to keep in mind that Tim gets fouled a lot and is the worst FT shooter of the big 3. I personally who takes more shots, I just like to see some sort of a balance and ball movement with a lot of assists.
That's five specific possessions. Can you give me five specific plays where Parker stalled the offense?
And when Parker came in, the Spurs were up by 14.
...except show up in the playoffs on a consistent basis.
Parker needs to learn to distribute much better. Hes a very good scorer, but in the playoffs, teams cut that penetration off. He needs to be able to pass more than improve his jumpshot so he can still keep jacking up the same amount of shots per game even if hes not penetrating well.
I fondly and nostalgically remember the ball movement in 2005 and other years and this year its been nothing like that - because Tony is too much the focus of the offense.
Of course they need balance. Thats my whole premise in the take.
My point was if "anyone" was going to take maybe 20 shots a game it could be Tim. doesn't mean he has to...but if he is getting 20 shots a game, they could be put backs, offensive rebounds, 2 man game with Finley or Barry or Manu on the wings...BUT, they don't NEED him to take 20 shots a game.
we don't care we won in the past and we are talking about now not 50 000 years ago
No, when Duncan sat the remaining of the third quarter, we were absoulutely horrible defensively. They were making jumpshots at that point and cut a 23-point lead to just 14 in the last quarter.
Uh... he didn't fair so well in last year's playoffs. I dont have his exact numbers but his FG% was way down. Thats not 50,000 years ago.
EDIT: he shot 46% compared to 55% during the regular season. I couldn't find his assists but I'm fairly sure they were around, what, 4 a game?
LMAO at how all the usual mor-, uh, I mean, suspects refuse to admit that Tony does what his coach tells him to do.
Rationalization. It's a beautiful thing.
yeah...you're right, that was 1 year ago but the spurs lost against the mavs,not against the kings.And parker wasn't the problem of the defeat.
And the mavs=best team in the nba it is sad but it is true.
Then maybe you can say parker didn't fair so well in last year's confrontation against the mavs.
I think you make a good point- just because you pass the ball more and shoot less shots does not mean that you are setting your teammates up for good shots.
Agreed. Tim needs to take the most shots, not Parker. The thing Tim is that if he takes 20+ shots in the post, he is going to get the opposing bigs into foul trouble earlier (ok his foul shooting is not so good but that's nothing new). What this means is that the opposing bigs may go into the 4th qtr with foul problems IF Tim gets lot of looks and touches in the post in the first 3 quarters. Parker cannot do that by chucking up 20 layups or jump shots as unlike Manu, Parker isn't very good at drawing or creating fouls.
Now, once the opposing bigs are in foul trouble, this will allow PARKER to penetrate easier in the 4th quarter as well as for rest of the Spurs to be more aggressive taking the ball to the rack.
I remember when Duncan routinely used to foul out the opposing team's centers and PF's or get them into severe foul problems by the middle of the 4th quarter -- and at that point, their defence becomes much more hesitant and less aggressive for fear of fouling out or getting the team into foul shot situation.
We have gone away from this since Parker started to dominate the ball and scoring.....hence lately Spurs rarely have their opponents in foul trouble in the 4th quarter. See the difference?
My take is Duncan should establish his post game early, and get lots of looks, shots, and either make the points or get their bigs into foul trouble. This will soften up the opposing defence and allow other Spurs (including Parker) more spacing and make everyone more effective in the crunch time.
Duncan is the Force, not Parker....so we should be riding him early to put pressure on the opposing team. A non-passing scoring guard will NEVER win championship. Look at Jordan....he was winning all kinds of scoring les in the first 6 years but never won anything because he didn't know how to make his teammates better. It was only when he started to pass more that the Bulls started their dynasty....and obviously Parker is no Jordan (not even close) so all the more reason that he should quickly learn to play within the team and utilize the players around him, especially if their names are Duncan and Ginobilli...and even Barry. Look at Kobe -- even he is getting it now and has made Lakers that much more potent by getting scrubs like Walton, Bynum, and Smush open looks and easy layups.
Pop is asking Parker to now go to another level becuase he knows we cannot win with Parker putting up 20+ shots in a 7 game playoffs when things get intense and defence becomes much more tighter.
I agree and tony is capable to do that but how many times fin,bowen,barry,manu get open looks and they didn't hit the ball? How many times duncan miss the layup(not "the dunk"because he doesn't want to smash)?
Honestly I saw 30 games over 40,and beacause they couldn't finish,tony looses 3,4 assists each time.Sometimes it's like Wow!?!!!
But it is also true that if tony is creating more,there are more chances of them hitting that damn ball.
But the problem is: we can't play like that,we can't play like the suns and we musn't. And...actually...we need tony taking 15 shoots per game because he is the only one who can finish(at this moment we can put the "53%FG" excuse).
And...actually... we have to be honest:we are just the third best team of the nba,that's all,whatever tony taking 8,8 shoots or 9,12 per game.
And that's why whitout parker the spurs suck and that's why parker is an all-star and that's pop is directing tony and that's why tony is doing exaaactly what pop demand him,and that's why pop is the spurs coach and not "telecomguy" or "ginobilifan" or
Excuse me but did you say Spurs can't shoot? And that this is why Parker is not averaging 8 or 9 assist per game? You must be joking. Spurs are one of the best 3 pt shooting team in the league. AND, Duncan is shooting close to 54%....and they have Barry, Ginobilli, and Bown all shooting over 40% from the 3 pt line. WHERE do you get this idea that the only reason Parker sucks with assists is because Spurs cannot put the ball in when he passes it to them? The reality is that Parker does NOT create an easy shot for his players and the last time I checked, this is what PG should do. AND this is how basketball should be played, instead of one guy trying to go to the hoop or expecting 35+ year old vets to create their own shots or dumping it into Duncan into the post after dribbling the ball around for 15 seconds trying to go solo to the rack before hitting a wall and realizing no opening, give it to Tim to try to force his way through double, triple teams.
I think you maybe got the real point.
I mean maybe tony shouldn't score 10 points or + in the first quarter,20 points in the first half as he did usually this year.It should be duncan.
And they used to play like that few years ago.
But why it has changed?
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ask pop.
But you can find the answer alone and then give it to us(hint:it's not difficult)
It's simple:the spurs don't play like the suns,they don't play like the hornets (with paul of course).
For example,watch paul's games: realise how much he is keeping the ball,dribbling, same with nash,it's just wow!!! and THEN they can create,make open looks to their buddies.
Now,watch spurs games: the ball is always in the hands of duncan first.
So the creator is duncan not tony,so it's not his fault.
What I'm saying is that the few times tony gets the ball and can attack, he uses his speed to penetrate,shoot and CREATE too.
1)when he penetrate:he is succesfull
2) when he shoots:he is succesfull
3)when he give 1 million dollar open look to his teammates,they miss a lot.
But I agree with you that it isn't that which making tony a just 5.6 assists guy.
It is because he don't have the ball enough to do a la nash or paul for example.It is as simple as that.And that's why making 19.5 points and 5.6 assists is already a miracle.
I think that IF Parker could control the ball and zip passes as well as Nash can, Parker WOULD be controllling the ball a lot more. The problem is that Parker does not have this skill. But he still holds the ball, dribbling around, lot more than Duncan and makes more shot attempts than Duncan does or very close to Duncan's number. Look at Deron Williams...the guy averages very close to Tony's numbers in pts but his assist total is close to 9 a game. Are you suggesting that Utah has much better shooters than San Antonio?
Parker is still young...has oodles of athleticism and physical skills. There is no reason why he cannot learn to distribute the ball better and become more of a PG or at least have that skill set to draw on when they start to stack the post to stop him from penetrating. The only caveat is that until he learns how to hit the mid-range jumpers (it has improved but that only shows how bad it was in the past!), I am not sure how Parker is going to draw defenders to him in the perimeter as Nash and Billups can. without drawng the defenders like a magnet like Nash, Parker cannot free up the post or other Spurs and give them easy looks. So as much as I want parker to become better set up guy, I have my doubts whether he can pull that off until his jumpers become much more reliable.
yeah you're right at certain points .
And I totally agree with you about that parker must improve (but not much more)
Finally I think parker wasn't so good in the past except his athleticsm and physical skills.But today he's learning and I would say he's learning quite well.
Tony said himself that he need at least 2 years to get definetly a good jumper like billup,nash...and he's working it.
But don't compare him with deron williams.
And don't forget that Tony has the talent(if not he wouldn't be at this place)
And the most important,tony accepts the criticizes,he is a very good teammate and he wants to be the best he wants to progress.
Then I have any doubt about his capacity.
I would say give him peace for just 1 or 2 years.
Wait and see,then we can really judge if parker has the blood of big time players.But with the "handicap" he has now I say that he's doing a good job.
(fortunately he is only 24)
Don't get me wrong....I like Parker on a personal level. But he is probably only 65% to 75% to being a complete PG in every sense of the word. For those of you who claim that Pop doesn't want Parker to be PG and wants him only to score, if that is really the case (I highly doubt it!), then we need to GET a true PG and let Parker become the SG (which then leaves Manu as a 6th man -- not a bad idea).
And exactly what "handicap" are you talking about? Do you not think Nash or Billups or Kidd would do really well with Spurs? Do you not think those guys could take Spurs to the top if Parker was traded for them? (not going to happen obviously).
the "handicap" is exagerated but I was talking about what you said yourself:his not very good jumpers.
And the most important thing:he can not shoot 3s (don't get me wrong he's still better than smush parker but he 's trying to shoot as well as nash,billups,even kidd?)
The fact is that the day he would have the permission to shoot 3pointers he can be a big big threat(I said the permission not the efficiency of nash)
And in this case,we really can say "handicap".
Plus,with parker(good or not) the spurs won twice,made at least semi-finals,(and i'm not saying it is THANKS to parker!),and I'm convinced the best still to come.
Then, getting nash(33),billups(31),kidd(34) is just insane.
I prefer having parker who is "killing" kidd on matchups,rivalising nash easily,struggling against billups, and all of that at just 65%(!!!) to being a complete PG as you said,at just 24(!!!)...
I mean as I said what it Will be the day Tony is 100%,(and this will be in 2 years...)
I think we still have the chance to win twice during this process...
Telecomguy, you are making a lot of sense.
That is because I am really Greg Popovich in disguise.....heh heh heh....
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