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  1. #51
    Bombs Away! AFE7FATMAN's Avatar
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    I have no reason to doubt what you are saying if it is indeed slated for closure. I only think that sometime in the past five years someone in the administration could have figured out that maybe a couple more casualties made their way back to the states than originally expected in the halcyon days before "mission accomplished."
    This happen a year ago, guess the members of BRAC didn't give a sheet
    about the wounded or even know about them.

    Posted 8/25/2005 8:51 AM Updated 8/26/2005 9:17 AM

    Walter Reed Army Medical Center selected to close
    By Dave Moniz, USA TODAY
    WASHINGTON — Walter Reed Army Medical Center in Washington, where seriously wounded soldiers have received care since 1909, was recommended to close by the federal base closure commission. (Related story: Hospital's history turns a page)
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/washing...-closing_x.htm
    The administration of GWB or Congress couldn't/can't stop it.
    If your in the "Administration" and want to stay there your not going to be the greek bearing the message.

    If your in the Military and A Officer, your not going to endanger your Officer Performance Report,

    If your in the Press, You have no idea of how many casualties, as you can't
    get to see them, when they come back, except for Photo Ops at places
    they spent the last 24 hrs spit- shinning.

    and quite frankly
    What else is new? This is how military men and retirees have been treated since the Revolution. This is not one man's fault, but a systemic action from the entire American public that military people are great in words but not worth a damn if it requires their $

    They should be respected the most for what they have given us but are in fact treated with utter disrespect/though to be less than equal, see remarks by Obama, McCain, Kerry, etc.
    This nation needs a new revolution to purge these greedy, incompetent politicians,& bureaucrats, however it's not going to happen.

    Gotta go pick up the folks at the Mall
    Last edited by AFE7FATMAN; 03-10-2007 at 06:54 AM.

  2. #52
    Gotta Fly, to Old to drive. BIG IRISH's Avatar
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    The string of firings is raising questions about just who is being held accountable as the nation prepares to enter its fifth year of the war in Iraq.

    Sec pf the Army is gone, and the career of the Walter Reed commander he fired Thursday, Major General George Weightman, is all but over.

    The temporary Walter Reed boss, Lieutenant General Kevin Kiley is likely to meet the same fate.



    Army forces surgeon general to retire – 3rd major dismissal in Walter Reed controversy




    By Pauline Jelinek
    ASSOCIATED PRESS

    2:21 p.m. March 12, 2007

    WASHINGTON – Army Surgeon General Kevin C. Kiley abruptly stepped down under pressure from military superiors, the third top Army official forced out in the fallout from revelations of shabby treatment of wounded soldiers at Walter Reed Army Medical Center.
    The Army said Monday that Lt. Gen. Kiley had submitted a request to retire over the weekend


    http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...alterreed.html

    However, Rep. Ike Skelton, D-Mo., chairman of the Armed Services Committee, said Kiley's firing alone won't solve the problem. “With the installation of new leaders, the real test will be making sure that the work fixing problems actually gets done,” he said.

    “We've made a good start, but much remains to be done,”

  3. #53
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    Kiley's peformance before Congress was unbelievably horrible.

    His basic position was "As commander, I give commands, others execute commands" with the sub-text being "the buck stops with the commanded, not with the commander".

    iow, "it wasn't my responsibility to provide out-patient care or monitor its quality."

    Horrible mgmt practice (no feedback or controls or verification), and total asshole of an officer.

  4. #54
    Gotta Fly, to Old to drive. BIG IRISH's Avatar
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    Kiley's peformance before Congress was unbelievably horrible.

    His basic position was "As commander, I give commands, others execute commands" with the sub-text being "the buck stops with the commanded, not with the commander".

    iow, "it wasn't my responsibility to provide out-patient care or monitor its quality."

    Horrible mgmt practice (no feedback or controls or verification), and total asshole of an officer.

    ty
    Got a link for his performance before congress?
    Maybe he could open a GYN clinic

  5. #55
    "Have to check the film" PixelPusher's Avatar
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    All of this whining and complaining about Walter Reed...there's a war on dammit! All of that mold, rat turds and privatized outsource - um, I mean government bureacracy is just there to "battle harden" the troops so they'll be ready to get back into the fight.

    The Army is ordering injured troops to go to Iraq

    At Fort Benning, soldiers who were classified as medically unfit to fight are now being sent to war. Is this an isolated incident or a trend?

    By Mark Benjamin

    March 11, 2007 | COLUMBUS, Ga. -- "This is not right," said Master Sgt. Ronald Jenkins, who has been ordered to Iraq even though he has a spine problem that doctors say would be damaged further by heavy Army protective gear. "This whole thing is about taking care of soldiers," he said angrily. "If you are fit to fight you are fit to fight. If you are not fit to fight, then you are not fit to fight."

    As the military scrambles to pour more soldiers into Iraq, a unit of the Army's 3rd Infantry Division at Fort Benning, Ga., is deploying troops with serious injuries and other medical problems, including GIs who doctors have said are medically unfit for battle. Some are too injured to wear their body armor, according to medical records.

    On Feb. 15, Master Sgt. Jenkins and 74 other soldiers with medical conditions from the 3rd Division's 3rd Brigade were summoned to a meeting with the division surgeon and brigade surgeon. These are the men responsible for handling each soldier's "physical profile," an Army do ent that lists for commanders an injured soldier's physical limitations because of medical problems -- from being unable to fire a weapon to the inability to move and dive in three-to-five-second increments to avoid enemy fire. Jenkins and other soldiers claim that the division and brigade surgeons summarily downgraded soldiers' profiles, without even a medical exam, in order to deploy them to Iraq. It is a claim division officials deny.

    The 3,900-strong 3rd Brigade is now leaving for Iraq for a third time in a steady stream. In fact, some of the troops with medical conditions interviewed by Salon last week are already gone. Others are slated to fly out within a week, but are fighting against their chain of command, holding out hope that because of their ills they will ultimately not be forced to go. Jenkins, who is still in Georgia, thinks doctors are helping to send hurt soldiers like him to Iraq to make units going there appear to be at full strength. "This is about the numbers," he said flatly.

    That is what worries Steve Robinson, director of veterans affairs at Veterans for America, who has long been concerned that the military was pressing injured troops into Iraq. "Did they send anybody down range that cannot wear a helmet, that cannot wear body armor?" Robinson asked rhetorically. "Well that is wrong. It is a war zone." Robinson thinks that the possibility that physical profiles may have been altered improperly has the makings of a scandal. "My concerns are that this needs serious investigation. You cannot just look at somebody and tell that they were fit," he said. "It smacks of an overstretched military that is in crisis mode to get people onto the battlefield."

    Eight soldiers who were at the Feb. 15 meeting say they were summoned to the troop medical clinic at 6:30 in the morning and lined up to meet with division surgeon Lt. Col. George Appenzeller, who had arrived from Fort Stewart, Ga., and Capt. Aaron K. Starbuck, brigade surgeon at Fort Benning. The soldiers described having a cursory discussion of their profiles, with no physical exam or extensive review of medical files. They say Appenzeller and Starbuck seemed focused on downplaying their physical problems. "This guy was changing people's profiles left and right," said a captain who injured his back during his last tour in Iraq and was ordered to Iraq after the Feb. 15 review.

    Appenzeller said the review of 75 soldiers with profiles was an effort to make sure they were as accurate as possible prior to deployment. "As the division surgeon and the senior medical officer in the division, I wanted to ensure that all the patients with profiles were fully evaluated with clear limitations that commanders could use to make the decision whether they could deploy, and if they did deploy, what their limitations would be while there," he said in a telephone interview from Fort Stewart. He said he changed less than one-third of those profiles -- even making some more restrictive -- in order to "bring them into accordance with regulations."

    In direct contradiction to the account given by the soldiers, Appenzeller said physical examinations were conducted and that he had a robust medical team there working with him, which is how they managed to complete 75 reviews in one day. Appenzeller denied that the plan was to find more warm bodies for the surge into Baghdad, as did Col. Wayne W. Grigsby Jr., the brigade commander. Grigsby said he is under "no pressure" to find soldiers, regardless of health, to make his unit look fit. The health and welfare of his soldiers are a top priority, said Grigsby, because [the soldiers] are "our most important resource, perhaps the most important resource we have in this country."

    Grigsby said he does not know how many injured soldiers are in his ranks. But he insisted that it is not unusual to deploy troops with physical limitations so long as he can place them in safe jobs when they get there. "They can be productive and safe in Iraq," Grigsby said.

    The injured soldiers interviewed by Salon, however, expressed considerable worry about going to Iraq with physical deficits because it could endanger them or their fellow soldiers. Some were injured on previous combat tours. Some of their ills are painful conditions from training accidents or, among relatively older troops, degenerative problems like back injuries or blown-out knees. Some of the soldiers have been in the Army for decades.

    And while Grigsby, the brigade commander, says he is under no pressure to find troops, it is hard to imagine there is not some desperation behind the decision to deploy some of the sick soldiers. Master Sgt. Jenkins, 42, has a degenerative spine problem and a long scar down the back of his neck where three of his vertebrae were fused during surgery. He takes a cornucopia of potent pain pills. His medical records say he is "at significantly increased risk of re-injury during deployment where he will be wearing Kevlar, body armor and traveling through rough terrain." Late last year, those medical records show, a doctor recommended that Jenkins be referred to an Army board that handles retirements when injuries are permanent and severe.

    A copy of Jenkins' profile written after that Feb. 15 meeting and signed by Capt. Starbuck, the brigade surgeon, shows a healthier soldier than the profile of Jenkins written by another doctor just late last year, though Jenkins says his condition is unchanged. Other soldiers' do ents show the same pattern.

    One female soldier with psychiatric issues and a spine problem has been in the Army for nearly 20 years. "My [health] is deteriorating," she said over dinner at a restaurant near Fort Benning. "My spine is separating. I can't carry gear." Her medical records include the note "unable to deploy overseas." Her status was also reviewed on Feb. 15. And she has been ordered to Iraq this week.

    The captain interviewed by Salon also requested anonymity because he fears retribution. He suffered a back injury during a previous deployment to Iraq as an infantry platoon leader. A Humvee accident "corkscrewed my spine," he explained. Like the female soldier, he is unable to wear his protective gear, and like her he too was ordered to Iraq after his meeting with the division surgeon and brigade surgeon on Feb. 15. He is still at Fort Benning and is fighting the decision to send him to Baghdad. "It is a numbers issue with this whole troop surge," he claimed. "They are just trying to get those numbers."

    Another soldier contacted Salon by telephone last week expressed considerable anxiety, in a frightened tone, about deploying to Iraq in her current condition. (She also wanted to remain anonymous, fearing retribution.) An incident during training several years ago injured her back, forcing doctors to remove part of her fractured coccyx. She suffers from degenerative disk disease and has two ruptured disks and a bulging disk in her back. While she said she loves the Army and would like to deploy after back surgery, her current injuries would limit her ability to wear her full protective gear. She deployed to Iraq last week, the day after calling Salon.

    Her husband, who has served three combat tours in the infantry in Afghanistan and Iraq, said he is worried sick because his wife's protective vest alone exceeds the maximum amount she is allowed to lift. "I have been over there three times. I know what it is like," he told me during lunch at a restaurant here. He predicted that by deploying people like his wife, the brigade leaders are "going to get somebody killed over there." He said there is "no way" Grigsby is going to keep all of the injured soldiers in safe jobs. "All of these people that deploy with these profiles, they are scared," he said. He railed at the command: "They are saying they don't care about your health. This is pathetic. It is bad."

    His wife's physical profile was among those reevaluated on Feb. 15. A copy of her profile from late last year showed her health problems were so severe they "prevent deployment" and recommended she be medically retired from the Army. Her profile at that time showed she was unable to wear a protective mask and chemical defense equipment, and had limitations on doing pushups, walking, biking and swimming. It said she can only carry 15 pounds.

    Though she says that her condition has not changed since then, almost all of those findings were reversed in a copy of her physical profile dated Feb. 15. The new profile says nothing about a medical retirement, but suggests that she limit wearing a helmet to "one hour at a time."

    Spc. Lincoln Smith, meanwhile, developed sleep apnea after he returned from his first deployment to Iraq. The condition is so severe that he now suffers from narcolepsy because of a lack of sleep. He almost nodded off mid-conversation while talking to Salon as he sat in a T-shirt on a sofa in his girlfriend's apartment near Fort Benning.

    Smith is trained by the Army to be a truck driver. But since he is in constant danger of falling asleep, military doctors have listed "No driving of military vehicles" on his physical profile. Smith was supposed to fly to Iraq March 9. But he told me on March 8 that he won't go. Nobody has retrained Smith to do anything else besides drive trucks. Plus, because of his condition he was unable to train properly with the unit when the brigade rehearsed for Iraq in January, so he does not feel ready.
    Click Here!

    Smith needs to sleep with a CPAP (continuous positive airway pressure) machine pumping air into his mouth and nose. "Otherwise," he says, "I could die." But based on his last tour, he is not convinced he will be able to be in places with constant electricity or will be able to fix or replace his CPAP machine should it fail.

    He told me last week he would refuse to deploy to Iraq, unsure of what he will be asked to do there and afraid that he will not be taken care of. Since he won't be a truck driver, "I would be going basically as a number," says Smith, who is 32. "They don't have enough people," he says. But he is not going to be one of those numbers until they train him to do something else. "I'm going to go to the airport, and I'm going to tell them I'm not going to go. They are going to give me a weapon. I am going to say, 'It is not a good idea for you to give me a weapon right now.'"

    The Pentagon was notified of the reclassification of the Fort Benning soldiers as soon as it happened, according to Master Sgt. Jenkins. He showed Salon an e-mail describing the situation that he says he sent to Army Surgeon General Lt. Gen. Kevin C. Kiley. Jenkins agreed to speak to Salon because he hopes public attention will help other soldiers, particularly younger ones in a similar predicament. "I can't sit back and let this happen to me or other soldiers in my position." But he expects reprisals from the Army.

    Other soldiers slated to leave for Iraq with injuries said they wonder whether the same thing is happening in other units in the Army. "You have to ask where else this might be happening and who is dictating it," one female soldier told me. "How high does it go?"

  6. #56
    Veteran velik_m's Avatar
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    I bet american soldiers would rather be in austrian prison, than in american hospital.

  7. #57
    Gotta Fly, to Old to drive. BIG IRISH's Avatar
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    All of this whining and complaining about Walter Reed...there's a war on dammit! All of that mold, rat turds and privatized outsource - um, I mean government bureacracy is just there to "battle harden" the troops so they'll be ready to get back into the fight.

    Nothing new here folks, just move along, People still trying to get out of fighting, General Patton wouldn't have put up with this.

  8. #58
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    "People still trying to get out of fighting"

    Like dubya and head during VN war?

    Like the millions of red-state kids who refuse to enlist and die for dubya?

    The military is taking ex-cons now. Neo-cons won't go.

  9. #59
    Gotta Fly, to Old to drive. BIG IRISH's Avatar
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    "People still trying to get out of fighting"

    Like dubya and head during VN war?

    Like the millions of red-state kids who refuse to enlist and die for dubya?

    The military is taking ex-cons now. Neo-cons won't go.

    If they would let me go back on flight status, I'd go, jump my retired pay 2 1/2 %,
    Tax Free, College Education, free medical,






    check my avitar, the camera added a few years.

  10. #60
    Gotta Fly, to Old to drive. BIG IRISH's Avatar
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    On a more serious note as to what the Administration and congress think of the retiree:


    Once again the Military Officers Association of America (MOAA) and other members of the Military Coalition are having to gear up to fight the Pentagon's attempts to triple annual TRICARE fees for military retirees younger than 65 in some cases because of the president's recently submitted budget.

    What's most egregious is that the fiscal 2008 budget assumes even larger fee increases than last year.

    MOAA and Military Coalition members said that these dramatic fee increases were not appropriate. Adding to the argument, the Department of Defense had not done enough to pursue other available options to keep health care costs down. Congress agreed.


    This year, the Pentagon has not yet published a fee plan. It is waiting for findings from a Defense Department-appointed task force on the future of military health care. That task force is supposed to provide interim recommendations on cost sharing and pharmacy co-pays in May.

    In essence, the administration has underfunded the Defense Department health care budget by presuming the task force's outcome.

    Also, the administration has challenged Congress to either implement fee increases high enough to save $1.8 billion or find the same amount from another source to make up for the underfunding.

    MOAA thinks it is wrong to play this kind of budget "chicken" with the Defense Department health care program.

    It is especially shortsighted and disheartening to do so in a time of war.
    Sincerely,

    Ret. Vice Adm. Norb Ryan Jr.
    President
    Military Officers Association of America
    Alexandria, Va.

  11. #61
    Bombs Away! AFE7FATMAN's Avatar
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    Quit your ing Irish
    It won't be long till all the VN vets are dead and than the Democrats
    can cut the military to the bone and give the $ to illegal immirgants
    for college.


    Mar 09, 2007
    BY Spc. April L. Dustin

    Retired Army Cpl. Howard V. Ramsey, Oregon's last living World War I veteran and the last known U.S. combat veteran of WWI, died in his sleep Feb. 22 at an assisted living center in southeast Portland.

    PORTLAND, Ore. (Army News Service, March 9, 2007) - The echo of a 21-gun salute and bugler playing Taps seemingly marked the end of an era as a state and national treasure was laid to rest in Portland, Ore., March 2.

    Retired Army Cpl. Howard V. Ramsey,the last living World War I veteran and the last known U.S. combat veteran of WWI, died in his sleep Feb. 22 at an assisted living center in southeast Portland. He was honored in a memorial service attended by nearly 200 people at Lincoln Memorial Park exactly one month before reaching his 109th birthday.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------



    His conflict has never had the recognition it deserved.

    With Civil war tactics meeting modern weaponry for the first time in such large numbers of troops, WW1 was truly a horror.

    Many of these old timers that survived gas attacks had to soak in tubs whenever possible to give relief to skin damage 50 years after the event.

    The medical community never caught up to the sheer volume of these gas cases, affecting eyes, lungs and skin.
    RIP

  12. #62
    Bombs Away! AFE7FATMAN's Avatar
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    P.S.

    Talk about Vets that are dead and got screwed.

    For those that are old enough to remember when
    for years America's Military, and Vets were told
    that agent Orange had no effect on them.

    In 1985, while Sir Richard was a paid consultant for Monsanto, he stepped into the debate over the herbicides Agent Orange and dioxin, which had been sprayed from the air in the Vietnam war.

    An Australian royal commission was investigating whether the herbicides, made by Monsanto, had caused cancers in Australian personnel involved in the war.

    Sir Richard offered his unsolicited views in a letter to Justice Phillip Evatt, who headed the inquiry, and gave Agent Orange a clean bill of health.


    http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/st...967386,00.html




    http://www.guardian.co.uk/medicine/s...967381,00.html
    Scientist's Payoff for Work on Agent Orange Is Black Mark on Reputation
    The British epidemiologist Sir Richard Doll failed to disclose that he was in the pay of a chemical company for 20 years while he was investigating links between a company product and cancer, The Guardian reported today.

    The company, Monsanto, was paying Sir Richard $1,500 a day, according to a contract found among his papers in the Wellcome Foundation library. That contract, dated April 29, 1986, extended an agreement that began in May 1979. While on Monsanto’s payroll, Sir Richard told an Australian commission that there was no evidence that one of Monsanto’s products, the defoliant known as Agent Orange, caused cancer, the British newspaper reported.

    Agent Orange was widely used by American forces in the Vietnam War, and lawsuits against its manufacturer persisted for many years after the conflict ended.
    Sir Richard, who died last year, was famous for his work in helping to demonstrate that smoking causes lung cancer.

    If this so-called scientist had found that Agent Orange does cause the cancer that so many Vietnam vets and Vietnam people experienced after being exposed to it – then he would have some credibility.

    However, to claim to scientifically examine the chemicals and find no correlation between cancer and Agent Orange, while at the same time receiving $1,500 a day ($547,500 annually) from the chemical company that makes Agent Orange – to me, this man is not only a paid pros ute but a mass murderer.

    His bias and falsified findings have not only negatively effected hundreds of thousands of families, by denying them redress of their grievances, but he has also robbed them of their right to receive compensation for having been poisoned and/or killed by the policies of inhumane corporate profiteers in the chemical industry.

    It is hard to imagine that people like this exist but here they are dressed in respectability and prestige – hiding in plain site behind educational and scientific ins utions.
    .....
    ....

    From the Chronicle of Higher Education News Blog.
    http://chronicle.com/news/article/13...-on-reputation

    Last edited by AFE7FATMAN; 03-15-2007 at 04:45 AM.

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