Beckham bigger than Tiger or MJ?

[tlongII]

And by the way, I've been all over the world, including China and that little country known as Argentina and I can say unequivically that MJ and Tiger are biggest sports stars the world has ever known. Everybody the world over knows who they are.

[Marcus Bryant]

Why should we change our ways? We're happy with our sports. We love our sports. Change our ways?? What an arrogant suggestion.
You are seriously deluding yourself with most of what you've said in your past few posts. it's fine if you think baseball is boring. I, and millions of others would disagree, but I'm not here to convert people. Besides, I maintain the exact same sentiments about soccer...nothing exciting in watching a ball bounce from man to man to man...often with with no scoring....for 90 minutes.

There's nothing exciting in watching someone try to hit a ball with a stick with very little scoring and 4 hour games with the action stopping after every f-ing pitch.

And saying soccer is hard to understand??? Please. Two teams try to get a ball past the opponents goalie.

Right, that's all the game is about.

I hardly think following such a game requires any "mental effort" compared to our sports, which are far more complicated and which is probably why some people find them boring.

How is basketball any more complicated using your standard? Put the rock in the hoop. Yay. With 20 different commercial breaks during a game.

The fact that soccer is continuous only makes it more monotonous and boring to me. Soccer can't match the chess-like strategy behind football. And It takes FAR more viewer education to understand an American football game. Soccer is just too simple and basic for me. Sorry. (and by simple, I am not saying it's simple to play. I've no doubt they're all superb athletes. Doesn't make 'em fun to watch).

Actually I said that it would require too much mental effort for the average American sports fan to learn the game. Apparently I was right.

[Phenomanul]

Why should we change our ways? We're happy with our sports. We love our sports. Change our ways?? What an arrogant suggestion.
You are seriously deluding yourself with most of what you've said in your past few posts. it's fine if you think baseball is boring. I, and millions of others would disagree, but I'm not here to convert people. Besides, I maintain the exact same sentiments about soccer...nothing exciting in watching a ball bounce from man to man to man...often with with no scoring....for 90 minutes. And saying soccer is hard to understand??? Please. Two teams try to get a ball past the opponents goalie. I hardly think following such a game requires any "mental effort" compared to our sports, which are far more complicated and which is probably why some people find them boring. The fact that soccer is continuous only makes it more monotonous and boring to me. Soccer can't match the chess-like strategy behind football. And It takes FAR more viewer education to understand an American football game. Soccer is just too simple and basic for me. Sorry. (and by simple, I am not saying it's simple to play. I've no doubt they're all superb athletes. Doesn't make 'em fun to watch).

There are 100's of different schools of thought on soccer strategies... but your average viewer wouldn't even notice them...

I don't see where American Football's million and 1 rules make the sport superior simply because it is more complicated....

Just for the record I enjoy watching both... but I adore and am enthralled to play soccer compe ively every time I get that chance.

[Phenomanul]

And by the way, I've been all over the world, including China and that little country known as Argentina and I can say unequivically that MJ and Tiger are biggest sports stars the world has ever known. Everybody the world over knows who they are.

I'm pretty sure everyone knows who Ronaldinho is as well....

[Spurminator]

The merging of sports and tabloids continues.

[Extra Stout]

And saying soccer is hard to understand??? Please. Two teams try to get a ball past the opponents goalie. I hardly think following such a game requires any "mental effort" compared to our sports, which are far more complicated and which is probably why some people find them boring.

Soccer is just too simple and basic for me. Sorry. (and by simple, I am not saying it's simple to play. I've no doubt they're all superb athletes. Doesn't make 'em fun to watch).

Those statements seem quite wrong.

If soccer bores you, it's not because the game isn't complicated enough. Creating scoring opportunities, and defending against them, is very complex.

[Marcus Bryant]

There are 100's of different schools of thought on soccer strategies... but your average viewer wouldn't even notice them...

I don't see where American Football's million and 1 rules make the sport superior simply because it is more complicated....

Just for the record I enjoy watching both... but I adore and am enthralled to play soccer compe ively every time I get that chance.

Football's become rather boring to watch. How many stoppages of play (other than on changes of possession and ends of quarters and halves) are there in a typical game due to commercial breaks, timeouts, and replays? Gotta give fans a chance to piss out all of the beer they've consumed, I guess.

[cornbread]

"The Soccer World Cup is still the biggest thing in the world of sports" - David Stern, as pointed out by Phenomanul in another thread.

[Avitus1]

David Beckham is bigger then MJ and MJ is much bigger then Tiger. Every nation in the world has a national soccer team and every nation in the world competes or tries to compete in the World Cup. Everyone outside the US knows who he is, that says enough. While he is not the best player to ever hit the field after all Ronaldo is probably much better then he'll ever be. He's the most marketable for being English. To say he isn't as big as MJ or Tiger is just foolish, and your fooling yourselves. Still if the US wants to save MLS (and it should its laughable compared to other leagues) They really need to try to recruit from outside the US. I'm not saying the teams need to be made up of nothing but foreigners but if each team had 1 or 2 the Americans who play Soccer would learn to elevate there game. Soccer is highly enjoyable and when I do visit England (which is quite often) I always make sure to go see a soccer game, its unlike most sporting events in the US and its hard to understand the atmosphere until you go. Hopefully MLS will one day reach that kind of excitement.

[englishspursfan]

beckham was great for man u ,one of the only a few who has managed to score straight from kick off ,he got a bit lazy imo when he went to madrid but now hes here an friends with tom cruise ive nothing but respect for him an that skinny of a wife.

[TDMVPDPOY]

beckham was great for man u ,one of the only a few who has managed to score straight from kick off ,he got a bit lazy imo when he went to madrid but now hes here an friends with tom cruise ive nothing but respect for him an that skinny of a wife.

he went down hill when he got married man, then going to madrid his career has been going and madrid not winning any les also helps his cause

[Soul_Patch]

Making 90 Brazillion dollars an hour will make a man fairly lazy i think.


Beckham stopped being a world class footballer when it became more about the money and fame than the sport...

[Otaku]

My ranking... as most influential, well-known, famous male athletes of the last half century.... (some of the people on the list would be ranked higher had the marketing media giant we know today - as aided by the internet - existed in their day)....

1) Michael Jordan
2) Pelé
3) Tiger Woods
4) Maradona
5) Muhammad Ali
6) Ronaldo
7) Michael Shumacher
8) Magic Johnson
9) Larry Bird
10) Joe Montana
11) Lance Armstrong
12) Pete Sampras
13) Mickey Mantle
14) Ronaldinho
15) Zinedine Zidane
16) Roger Federer
17) Cal Ripken Jr.
18) Oscar de la Hoya
19) Kareem Abdul Jabbar
20) O.J. Simpson
21) Andre Agassi
22) Yao Ming
23) Dale Earnhart
24) Jerry Rice
25) Wilt Chamberlain
26) Johann Cruyff
27) Bjorn Borg
28) Jack Nicklaus
29) Michel Platini
30) David Beckam
31) Emmitt Smith
32) Franz Beckenbauer
33) Brett Favre
34) Jackie Robinson
35) Sugar Ray Leonard
36) Lou Gehrig
37) Hugo Sánchez
38) Lothar Matthäus
39) Gabriel Batistuta
40) Paolo Maldini

My opinion of course...

How can you put Schumacher on that list and forget about Fangio or Senna???

[Phenomanul]

How can you put Schumacher on that list and forget about Fangio or Senna???

Let's just put it this way.... Schumacher has been a winner most of his career and has been in the top 20 highest grossing sportsmen list for the last 10 years or so.

I don't even know who those other two characters are....

[MajorMike]

Wow, that's actually a pretty damn good list.

[Phenomanul]

My ranking... as most influential, well-known, famous male athletes of the last half century.... (some of the people on the list would be ranked higher had the marketing media giant we know today - as aided by the internet - existed in their day)....

1) Michael Jordan
2) Pelé
3) Tiger Woods
4) Maradona
5) Muhammad Ali
6) Ronaldo
7) Michael Shumacher
8) Magic Johnson
9) Larry Bird
10) Joe Montana
11) Lance Armstrong
12) Pete Sampras
13) Mickey Mantle
14) Ronaldinho
15) Zinedine Zidane
16) Roger Federer
17) Cal Ripken Jr.
18) Oscar de la Hoya
19) Kareem Abdul Jabbar
20) O.J. Simpson
21) Andre Agassi
22) Yao Ming
23) Dale Earnhart
24) Jerry Rice
25) Wilt Chamberlain
26) Johann Cruyff
27) Bjorn Borg
28) Jack Nicklaus
29) Michel Platini
30) David Beckam
31) Emmitt Smith
32) Franz Beckenbauer
33) Brett Favre
34) Jackie Robinson
35) Sugar Ray Leonard
36) Lou Gehrig
37) Hugo Sánchez
38) Lothar Matthäus
39) Gabriel Batistuta
40) Paolo Maldini

My opinion of course...

And if I had to add names I would probably go with....

From Baseball: Babe Ruth, Roger Clemens, Barry Bonds, Ken Griffey Jr., Alex Rodriguez, Ivan Rodriguez, Derek Jeter, Nolan Ryan

From Football: Payton Manning, Barry Sanders, Tom Brady, John Elway, Joe Carter, Terry Bradshaw

From Basketball: Shaquille O'Neal, Hakeem Olajuwon, George Gervin, Charles Barkley, Tim Duncan, Julius Erving, Jason Kidd, John Stockton, Karl Malone, Pete Maravich, Scottie Pippen

From Soccer: Gerd Muller, Franco Baresi, Eric Cantona, Peter Schmeichel, Marco Van Basten, Romario, Jürgen Klingsmann, Rivelino, Tostao, Oscar Ruggeri, Roberto Baggio, Bobby Moore

From Tennis: Jim Courier

Golf: Bobby Jones, Ben Hogan, Arnold Palmer

Other: Michael Phelps

And my biggest blunder of all:
Having ommitted a Top 20 member in Wayne Gretzky

[Otaku]

Let's just put it this way.... Schumacher has been a winner most of his career and has been in the top 20 highest grossing sportsmen list for the last 10 years or so.

I don't even know who those other two characters are....

'nuff said...

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Let's just put it this way.... Schumacher has been a winner most of his career and has been in the top 20 highest grossing sportsmen list for the last 10 years or so.

I don't even know who those other two characters are....

You don't know who Juan Manuel Fangio and Ayrton Senna are? Well Fangio is arguably the greatest F1 pilot ever along with Schumacher. Senna was amazing as well, not mention an incredible human being. I believe if he hadn't died in that horrible accident he probably would have been among the greatest ever as well.

[Otaku]

Senna was amazing as well, not mention an incredible human being. I believe if he hadn't died in that horrible accident he probably would have been among the greatest ever as well.

Senna is the greatest ever. les are not everything, even less in the way MS got them...

[Phenomanul]

Well considering I started the post with.... "My ranking... as most influential, well-known, famous male athletes of the last half century" coupled with the fact that I'd seriously have never heard of these other 'racing greats'; you could see why they were omitted from the list.

Michael Schumacher has built an empire behind him..... one that is visible even to non-racing fans.

Nothing personal...

[Manu'sMagicalLeftHand]

My ranking... as most influential, well-known, famous male athletes of the last half century.... (some of the people on the list would be ranked higher had the marketing media giant we know today - as aided by the internet - existed in their day)....

1) Michael Jordan
2) Pelé
3) Tiger Woods
4) Maradona
5) Muhammad Ali
6) Ronaldo
7) Michael Shumacher
8) Magic Johnson
9) Larry Bird
10) Joe Montana
11) Lance Armstrong
12) Pete Sampras
13) Mickey Mantle
14) Ronaldinho
15) Zinedine Zidane
16) Roger Federer
17) Cal Ripken Jr.
18) Oscar de la Hoya
19) Kareem Abdul Jabbar
20) O.J. Simpson
21) Andre Agassi
22) Yao Ming
23) Dale Earnhart
24) Jerry Rice
25) Wilt Chamberlain
26) Johann Cruyff
27) Bjorn Borg
28) Jack Nicklaus
29) Michel Platini
30) David Beckam
31) Emmitt Smith
32) Franz Beckenbauer
33) Brett Favre
34) Jackie Robinson
35) Sugar Ray Leonard
36) Lou Gehrig
37) Hugo Sánchez
38) Lothar Matthäus
39) Gabriel Batistuta
40) Paolo Maldini

My opinion of course...

Different sporting cultures I guess, but I have absolutely no clue who those in bold are. I could do a Google and look smart, but I won't.

I think some names are missing, like Jonah Lomu, Serge Blanco, Frik Du Preez (rugby union), Valentino Rossi, Michael Doohan (Moto GP), Sebastian Loeb, Tommi Mäkinen (Rallying), Michael Johnson (sprint), etc.

I also think that Hugo Sanchez, Batistuta and Maldini shouldn't be there, they were amazing footballers, but there are some more important missing.

[Phenomanul]

Different sporting cultures I guess, but I have absolutely no clue who those in bold are. I could do a Google and look smart, but I won't.

I think some names are missing, like Jonah Lomu, Serge Blanco, Frik Du Preez (rugby union), Valentino Rossi, Michael Doohan (Moto GP), Sebastian Loeb, Tommi Mäkinen (Rallying), Michael Johnson (sprint), etc.

I also think that Hugo Sanchez, Batistuta and Maldini shouldn't be there, they were amazing footballers, but there are some more important missing.

Like I said, it was a personal list.... but you're right, it stems from a difference in sporting cultures.

As far as Sánchez is concerned... he was a huge icon in Europe, and naturally of the 2nd most populous nation in Latin America - México.

To Hugo Sánchez's detriment he never had the benefit of the massive media hype machine that exists today, including the internet - specifically Youtube.

And unfortunately, Sánchez didn't have the benefit of playing for an elite National Squad - a stage where most footballers have made a name for themselves and where their legacy can be cemented in the pages of history. Nevertheless, Hugo led México to their best World-Cup finish ever (better than the 1970 accomplishment once one considers the number of participating nations in both tourneys).

Now imagine if Hugo Sánchez had played on the Argentinean National team alongside Maradona!!!! Argentina would have likely repeated as World Champions in 1990 and perhaps even taken the cup in 1982. Truth be told, Hugo's biggest detriment was not having been born in Brazil, Argentina, England, Italy, Germany, France or Holland. For had he been born in any of those nations, Hugol would probably be considered one of the best strikers in the history of the game.

Short excerpt from Wikipedia:

After five successful seasons in Mexico, with 99 goals to his name, Sánchez drew the attention of several Spanish sides, and signed with Atlético Madrid in 1981. He turned down an offer to play for Arsenal FC, a prominent English soccer team. It took him a while to find his feet in La Liga, but by the 1984-85 season he was scoring regularly with a team that won the Copa del Rey, finished in second place in the Spanish League and won the Spanish Super Copa. That year Hugo also won his first Pichichi trophy for being the most prolific scorer in the league.

At the high-point of his career, he signed for Real Madrid in 1985 and played with players such as Camacho, Butragueño, Gordillo, Valdano and Míchel. This team won five consecutive league les (from 1985-86 to 1989-90), the Copa del Rey in 1989, and the UEFA Cup in 1986. During those five years, Sánchez garnered four consecutive Pichichi trophies, scoring 207 goals in 212 games. He scored 27 or more goals in four consecutive seasons between 1986 and 1990, including 38 goals in the 1989-90 season, tying the single-season record set in 1951 by Telmo Zarra and earning the European Golden Boot award to the best scorer in Europe. Overall, he scored 23 goals in 45 European Cup games.

See for yourself.... as many don't remember his game much. His striking ability has yet to be matched on the pitch...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYMWT...elated&search=

On a sidenote: Goals number 6 and number 2 on that countdown are the reason why Antonio LaVolpe hated Sánchez - as Hugo had guaranteed a score both times. Goal number 2 being the 2nd Bicycle Kick Hugo scored on LaVolpe after LaVolpe had already vowed never to concede another "Chilena" to Hugo.

Think of it this way.... if Beckham had been a 5 time scoring champion in La Liga... some people would consider him a soccer GOD. Scratch that... Nike or Adidas would throw millions of dollars at him... possibly making him their number 1 endorsee. His picture would be everywhere, his contract would be 200 Million dollars plus.... wait a second..... That already is the case for Beckham... and Beckham never won a Pichichi or led any his teams to 5 consecutive championships.... Yeah... that's exactly what I'm talking about.

Just goes to show that some players will always be underrated... even in their legacy. Frankly, I think his place on that list should have been above Beckham's. Then again, as mentioned above, he was never promoted by the propaganda machine and media sensationalism that exists today 'ala Becks and Ronaldinho.

[Phenomanul]

Here's a vid that shows Hugo's route to his record tying 38-goal season.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NSWhQ3INiw