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  1. #51
    Believe. duncanchick21's Avatar
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    Just curious...What plot holes did you find?

    Firstly, the whole secret keeper thing is a huge plot hole. Mr. Weasley said that they all became secret keepers of 12 Grimauld Place because Dumbledore died. The Death Eaters cannot go in because there is a jinx that sticks Snape's mouth to the roof of his mouth, therefore he cannot reveal the secret. Then how did that Death Eater get into Grimauld Place when they were escaping the Ministry of Magic if he was never told? I know he apparated with the trio, then why didn't Snape apparate Death Eaters into Grimmauld Place? Also, how can Harry and the other prisoners from Malfoy Manor appear at Bill's house if they were never told the location from Bill, who is the secret keeper?

    Another more obvious one, Hermione says she modified her parents memories so they can believe that they live in Australia and never had a daughter. Two chapters later Harry tells her to modify the Death Eaters memory in the cafe, but she says she's never modified someones memory before.

    It might be just me, but The Elder Wand and wand possession was never really explained. Grindelwald, from what i understood, disarmed Gregorovitch and therefore was the true master of the Elder Wand. Dumbledore beat him in the duel, which made him the new master. Malfoy disarms him, and then Harry disarms Malfoy making Harry the Master of the Wand. Ollivander says that by beating or one-uping some one in a duel you can take possession of their wand. Doesn't that mean that Harry is the Master of all the wizard's/witche's wands he has disarmed? What about when they were practicing disarming with the D.A., are other D.A. members "masters" of the wands they disarmed?

  2. #52
    REVENGE Avitus1's Avatar
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    Firstly, the whole secret keeper thing is a huge plot hole. Mr. Weasley said that they all became secret keepers of 12 Grimauld Place because Dumbledore died. The Death Eaters cannot go in because there is a jinx that sticks Snape's mouth to the roof of his mouth, therefore he cannot reveal the secret. Then how did that Death Eater get into Grimauld Place when they were escaping the Ministry of Magic if he was never told?
    Yaxley grabbed onto one of them (I think it was Hermione) when they apparated to escape the Ministry. So Yaxley was pulled to Grimauld Place which showed him the secret which forced them to have to use the tent.


    I know he apparated with the trio, then why didn't Snape apparate Death Eaters into Grimmauld Place?
    Probably wasn't concerned at any rate he was secretly working against them so maybe he decided it best not to bet Death Eaters there, and lied about the location. Or something... Thats a good question actually.

    Also, how can Harry and the other prisoners from Malfoy Manor appear at Bill's house if they were never told the location from Bill, who is the secret keeper?
    Elf Magic is different then human magic so it probably gives them this little loop hole....

    I'm a bit sleep though so I'll see if I can give the rest a good once over later.

  3. #53
    I come in Marklar. Marklar MM's Avatar
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    Another more obvious one, Hermione says she modified her parents memories so they can believe that they live in Australia and never had a daughter. Two chapters later Harry tells her to modify the Death Eaters memory in the cafe, but she says she's never modified someones memory before.
    Wrong. Hermione modified her parents memories. In the cafe, she erases the death eaters memory, which she had never done before.

  4. #54
    Eh, Fuck It. easjer's Avatar
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    Ron knew the secret of the location, because that's where he stayed when he left Harry and Hermione. He told Harry/Dobby the location. I guess the point is that he shouldn't have been able to do that if he wasn't the secret keeper? Hm. But elf magic is different, and I don't see any problem with him apparating there if he's given the location, since elves can apparate inside Hogwarts.

    I think the thing with the Fidelius charm is that they didn't know if they'd broken it or not. Hermione thinks it may have been broken, because Yaxley was hanging onto her when they apparated onto the top step. But they knew where it was anyway, because DeathEaters were watching it constantly - I think the issue was that they didn't know if they were there or if they could get in. Wasn't the Fidelius charm supposed to protect them in that case? Regardless, when Hermione apparated there, they knew for certain that they were using it and it made it dangerous to go back. And it's the same reason they didn't call Kreacher to them, in case Deatheaters were holding onto him hoping they could locate them that way.

    Anyhow, I really enjoyed the book. I only read them in the past couple of months, but was able to re-read 4-6 before the 7th came out. Some of my theories were right (a Weasley twin dying) and some were wrong (Harry was a horcrux, but it was unintentional), but I really enjoyed the series and the progression. I need to reread book 7, because I stormed through it the day it arrived and I know I missed a bunch of stuff.

  5. #55
    Believe. duncanchick21's Avatar
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    Ron knew the secret of the location, because that's where he stayed when he left Harry and Hermione. He told Harry/Dobby the location. I guess the point is that he shouldn't have been able to do that if he wasn't the secret keeper? Hm. But elf magic is different, and I don't see any problem with him apparating there if he's given the location, since elves can apparate inside Hogwarts.

    The way the Fidelius Charm works is that only the Secret Keeper can reveal the location of the place. I think it's explained in Prisoner of Azkahban that Sirius could not reveal the location of the Potter's hiding in Godric's Hollow to Voldemort because Wormtail was SK. Also, in Half-Blood Prince, Snape explains to Bellatrix that he cannot tell them the location of Grimmauld Place because he is not SK.

    Well, if Elf magic is different, couldn't Snape tell Voldemort the location of Grimmauld place and use and elf to apparate to the then Headquarters of the Order of the Phoenix?

    Oh, Voldemort has to be the dumbest villain around. How can he assume that no one will be able to open the Room of Requirement when there are loads of things that were hidden there centuries before he hid the diadem there. Also, Draco spent most of the previous year in the Room of Requirement. Voldemort must have known that at least on student of the present generation knew about the RoR. Draco found out about it because Harry was using it for the D.A. meetings. Wouldn't that mean that Voldy should have known that Harry knew about the RoR?

  6. #56
    Eh, Fuck It. easjer's Avatar
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    I thought there was some protection that was keeping people out - clearly they knew of it, because they were staking it out, but I don't know what else they could or couldn't do. I have to go back and re-read!!

    As for Voldemort being an idiot, well, duh. Apart from some of it being children's literature and therefore a bit simplistic in some terms, Voldemort was always blinded by his sense of his own greatness and uniqueness. He assumed that at every point, from his childhood onwards. Harry didn't escape him, Harry wasn't his equal, he was lucky. No one else seemed to know about the RoR, and he was so fantastic, why would anyone else find it? (not to mention that it is entirely possible Voldemort wouldn't bother about a little detail like where Draco found DA) Just like instead of killing Harry on the spot in one of the numerous opportunities he has, he tries to show off his own greatness and make a game of it. He had ample opportunity to kill Harry in GoF, in OotP. He always underestimated the old magic/power of love because he himself scorned it. It's completely in keeping with his character, that despite finding the RoR and hiding something there (I will grant you that it was maybe a bit coincidental to be hidden where everything else is hidden and not saved as a secret place only for Voldemort to enter, but hey, plots must be attended to), he would assume that no one else would find it and even if they did, they wouldn't know what they were looking at amidst all the other junk.

  7. #57
    I come in Marklar. Marklar MM's Avatar
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    Voldemort, as said by easjer, was not stupid. He was so arrogant and self centered that he felt no wizard outside of Dumbledore could defeat him. No wizard was on his level in terms of magic and power. He could have hidden all his horcruxes, but he chose not to. They were all in places that people knew about. Why hide them when there was no equal to vanquish you and very few people who knew how to destroy them. Voldemort didn't understand the force behind certain magic...he felt his power alone could trump anything.

  8. #58
    REVENGE Avitus1's Avatar
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    I dont think Snape could tell people about Grimmauld Place because he wasn't the SK. When Sirius died Harry inherited the location so he became the SK. Which is why Snape couldn't tell others about it. I doubt he would of tried to hard anyways after he searched the location he probably came to the conclusion that it wasn't an active sight for the Order but to keep an eye on it which is why the Death Eaters were stationed outside it.

  9. #59
    Eh, Fuck It. easjer's Avatar
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    Except that they say early on in Book 7 that with Dumbledore's death (as Dumbledore was the SK for the Order/Grimmauld Place), everyone to whom he told the secret became the Secret Keeper (which made over 20 secret keepers, which was unruly and unwise - and why they ditched using it). It's also why Hermione was apologizing for breaking the fidelius charm.

  10. #60
    REVENGE Avitus1's Avatar
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    Ahhh yes..... forgot all about that.

  11. #61
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    Yea I wish they would of told a bit more at the end of the Epilogue like what George was doing, or Luna, and pretty much everyone else. I think the Snape character is still probably one of the best of the series because he defied Voldemort for the one thing Voldemort could never understand.
    Luna comes to see the truth about her father, eventually acknowledging there are some creatures that don’t exist. She however continues to travel the world looking for different creatures

  12. #62
    uups stups! Cant_Be_Faded's Avatar
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    Chapter 15 spoiler, Criss Angel's wizard staff mindfreaks hermione's gully hole.

  13. #63
    He's Manu Ginobili carina_gino20's Avatar
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    I'm too tired to check if this was posted already. But just in case it hasn't been yet, here's JK talking about her original epilogue: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19959323/

  14. #64
    In Limbo mardigan's Avatar
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    I'm too tired to check if this was posted already. But just in case it hasn't been yet, here's JK talking about her original epilogue: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19959323/
    Awesome, thank you, I cant believe she is going to write a encyclopedia about all the characters with their backstorys

  15. #65
    I cannot grok its fullnes leemajors's Avatar
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    Awesome, thank you, I cant believe she is going to write a encyclopedia about all the characters with their backstorys
    she's gotta milk it for all she can.

  16. #66
    In Limbo mardigan's Avatar
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    she's gotta milk it for all she can.
    maybe, but she's already the richest woman in Britian

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