Which players in your opinion was destined for Greatness before Tragedy?

[dallaskd]

Shaun Livingston?

[jbspurs]

Billy Ray Bates Portland Trail Blazers

[mavs>spurs2]

People are forgetting about Malik Sealy, although I can't remember exactly how he died.

[ShoogarBear]

While it is sad when a player dies young or has a career-ending injury, that in and of itself doesn't mean he was destined for greatness.

Bobby Hurley?

[JamStone]

To me Bobby Phills death will always be a tragedy considering this guy was well on his way to becoming an all-star calibur player. In here we all rave about how great a defender Bowen is but believe it or not Bobby Phills was even a better a defender then Bowen. Thats how great defensively he was. I would watch games down here in Charlotte in which he would just shut out the teams top perimeter player just hold the guy below double digits or even scorless. He was truly amazing to watch on defense. Jordan even once said in the '98 playoffs that Phills was the toughest defender he had ever gone up against in his career. I remember the last game I saw of him was against the Lakers a few days before his death in which he held Kobe to 6-8 points. On top of that Phills had a good offensive game. To me his death will always be a tragedy because I just think he would have made a difference on a le contending team. He definitely had spurs material written on him I even remember AJ once tried to get him to sign with the spurs back in '97.

Bobby Phills was already 30 years old when he died. While a terrific defender and a good team leader, he was still nowhere close to being an all-star, nevermind even being in the conversation for "greatness."

Oh, and I looked up that game you talked about him shutting down Kobe. Kobe went 5 for 19 for 13 points. It's funny how as bad as that is for Kobe, a 13 point game for Kobe goes down as a memory of 6 or 8 point game. But, I guess for Kobe, it might as well have been 6-8 points.

[JMarkJohns]

If we're talking straight up basketball injury, then Kevin Johnson, pre-surgery numbers of 22 ppg, 11 apg, on 51% from the field in an era of great PGs, he was rated second or third best several times in his first five seasons.

Then he had knee surgery in three of the next four years, and while he had some very good numbers when healthy afterwards, he never came close to the dominance he had pre-injury. People forget, or never really knew, but in 92-93 when the Suns made the Finals, that was the first year of KJs injury. Had he been healthy like the year prior, who the knows.

That's the tragedy in this case.

BTW, KJs playoff numbers were better than his regular season numbers.

As for a real tragedy, then Bias is a great choice, Reggie Lewis is another good choice, while Drazen Petrovic and Bobby Hurly are others...

Hate to beat the Suns drum, but another, who's "greatness" is up for debate, but who was a fantastic player was Tom Gugliotta. When Randy Livingston kamakazi'd into his knee and just blew it the out, it effectively ended the big man's career.

From 1995 to 1998, Googs averaged 18 ppg and 9 rpg. He was rewarded with a roster spot on the Olympic qualifying team in the summer of 1999, where hsi play was shortlived due to an inadvertant elbow from teammate, Jason Kidd, breaking his nose and being unable to compete for the remainder of the tournament. In December of 1999, Tom suffered a seizure after taking a vitamin suppliment. Later that year his knee was was introduced to Livingstons upperbody, starting a vicious cycle of rehab and failed comeback attempts because Googs ultimately suffered repeat stress fractures in his feet from all the rehab. During this sad process, his mother died from cancer and his wife divorced him.

Pretty ty couple of years.

[ShoogarBear]

I'm not sure that "injury" = "tragedy".

If it does, then my pick is easy:

[LakeShow]

I probably should know who that is, but the name escapes me. Who is that Shoog?

[Condemned 2 HelLA]

Shaun Livingston?

Damn Clipper curse!!

[FromWayDowntown]

I probably should know who that is, but the name escapes me. Who is that Shoog?

James Silas. Unless Shoog thinks Gus Williams' career was cut short by injury.

[LakeShow]

James Silas. Unless Shoog thinks Gus Williams' career was cut short by injury.

Oh ok, I looked up James Silas and I couldn't find what injuries he substained to ruin his career. I did know Gus Williams but he didn't have a career changing injury, that I know of. I remember him sitting out a year because of his contract.

[RonMexico]

I'd put Kobe Bryant on that list - his ego and rape charges have cemented his status as 2nd fiddle to Shaq and left him with a 3-ring total... all before he was 25.

Grant Hill could be included, as well.

Wilt Chamberlain could have slept with at least a 1,000 more women if he didn't die so young.

[MrChug]

...Let's not forget Isaiah Rider.

Yes...LETS.

[RonMexico]

Harold Miner was Baby Jordan... I guess you could say he ruined his career by having no tangible basketball skills beyond dunking.

[ShoogarBear]

Oh ok, I looked up James Silas and I couldn't find what injuries he substained to ruin his career.

Silas had two major injuries. The first was during the 1976 ABA playoffs after an All-ABA 1st year, when he broke his ankle in the first game of the series against the Nets, a series the Spurs would lose in 7 games.

He recovered from in time for the 1977 preseason (the first post-merger year), then injured his knee during an exhibition game and was out for most of the next 1.5 years. When he got back he was still pretty darn good, but never the same.

[ambchang]

I always loved Laphonzo Ellis's game, I am not sure he was destined for greatness, but he would definitely have been an all-star if his body held up. He was like a smallish, in his prime Shawn Kemp.

[Fillmoe]

drazen and len bias come to mind