Even in preseason the Mavs are getting on!

[samikeyp]

He got a bad haircut on his last visit to Supercuts.

[FromWayDowntown]

I'm not the one who brought up the Allen-Bowen incident. I was just responding to the comparison that was made and your defense of Bowen. I didn't realize we couldn't comment on something peripheral to the subject of the thread.

Comment on whatever you wish, it just strikes me as a move away from the topic at hand to unearth a Bowen incident from two seasons ago that bears little similarity to the actions of Josh Howard last night. Bowen might have instigated (though we have never been told what instigated that incident) but definitely wasn't the third guy in when he mixed things up with Allen; Howard was indisputably the third guy in, despite having been about as far away from the incident as he could have been while still on the floor. I have no idea why those two situations would ever be deemed similar.

If the point is that Bowen's situation might provide precedent for punishment not including a suspension -- and it seems to me that was the point that brought Bowen into this -- I'd be interested to know how frequently a guy has been permitted to race across the floor and directly involve himself in an altercation (not counting situations where all or most of the players on the floor are in a scrum surrounding the fracas, ala Game 4 of the 2007 WCSF) and avoid a suspension for doing so.

[cornbread]

He got a bad haircut on his last visit to Supercuts.

I would be disappointed too. How hard can be it to toss up a chili bowl?

[Obstructed_View]

Nice to know that Josh Howard still hasn't learned how to control himself. With all the guys on that team that can be taken out of their game so easily, the league will be using that formula to beat them pretty soon.

I find it interesting that anyone would try to compare this to Bowen kicking Allen. That was the only time I recall that Bowen's ever lost his cool on the floor and retaliated. Josh has done it at least half a dozen times.

[stretch]

Yea, hitting a guy who isnt looking takes some balls

Ditto for Bowen, kicking a guy in the back. Only difference is he has no balls to get back at Allen despite Allen coming after him. I guarantee that Howard would not have just backed off like that, and would have went right back at him.

[Obstructed_View]

Ditto for Bowen, kicking a guy in the back. Only difference is he has no balls to get back at Allen despite Allen coming after him. I guarantee that Howard would not have just backed off like that, and would have went right back at him.

And would have gotten suspended by piling stupid on top of stupid. You should be really proud of that kind of brains, Mav fan.

[stretch]

And would have gotten suspended by piling stupid on top of stupid. You should be really proud of that kind of brains, Mav fan.

Going back at someone does not get you suspended. Punching someone does. I never said anything about punching or hitting anyone. But letting them know you aren't a punk, and aren't going to let them punk you out is perfectly acceptable IMO.

[samikeyp]

But letting them know you aren't a punk, and aren't going to let them punk you out is perfectly acceptable IMO.

Why does this matter? Why does it matter what someone on another team thinks of you? Josh Howard is better than just about everyone on the Kings roster....who gives a rat's ass what they or anyone else thinks? All that matters is winning...anything else is irrelevant and if you put anything else in front of that, then you are not mentally on a championship level.

[stretch]

Why does this matter? Why does it matter what someone on another team thinks of you? Josh Howard is better than just about everyone on the Kings roster....who gives a rat's ass what they or anyone else thinks? All that matters is winning...anything else is irrelevant and if you put anything else in front of that, then you are not mentally on a championship level.

Because you can't let teams punk you, the way that Golden State punked us last year, or the Lakers used to do in the past. If team's know you are soft, they will take advantage of that.

[samikeyp]

If you win, no one punks you.

[samikeyp]

Spurs fans think it's so easy, just "go win" as if anybody can do it. They don't understand the whole "punking" element of basketball because they have one of the few guys in this league that has the respect of EVERYBODY. NOBODY will ever with Tim Duncan, so Spurs fans don't understand some of these other mental aspects to the game.

I understand them perfectly, I just don't agree with other assessments. You are right, no one will with TD but they will with others on the team and have. Those players got over it by winning the game.

[stretch]

I understand them perfectly, I just don't agree with other assessments. You are right, no one will with TD but they will with others on the team and have. Those players got over it by winning the game.

Oh well. Agree to disagree. Maybe if you played the game, you would understand the element of "punking" and how it relates to mental toughness a little more.

[samikeyp]

I disagree big time. Nobody tries to punk the Spurs the way they try to punk the Mavericks or the Suns or the Bobcats or most any other team.

I never said the Spurs players got punked as much as others. Your implication was that it never happens to the Spurs and I say it does, although not to the same degree. You are right, they don't with the exception of Parker who gets the knocked out of him every time he drives the lane. You said no one s with TD and I agreed with you. Other teams get more of that because it works on them and not the Spurs which you did say and I agree with that.

[CubanMustGo]

Oh well. Agree to disagree. Maybe if you played the game, you would understand the element of "punking" and how it relates to mental toughness a little more.

Do you play in the NBA? Do tell ... we're not talking about some ing playground here.

[mardigan]

Oh well. Agree to disagree. Maybe if you played the game, you would understand the element of "punking" and how it relates to mental toughness a little more.

Not this maybe if you had ever played again

[RocketsDynasty]

Do you play in the NBA? Do tell ... we're not talking about some ing playground here.

Do you play in the NBA? Do tell ... how do you know that the " ing playground " doesn't apply any?

[mardigan]

Do you play in the NBA? Do tell ... how do you know that the " ing playground " doesn't apply any?

Because its not being played at a ing playground

[RocketsDynasty]

Because its not being played at a ing playground

playground basketball is a mentality. And it's in the NBA. see Allen Iverson. see Tim Thomas. see Stephon Marbury. see Gilbert Arenas. and on and on and on.

[Obstructed_View]

Going back at someone does not get you suspended. Punching someone does. I never said anything about punching or hitting anyone. But letting them know you aren't a punk, and aren't going to let them punk you out is perfectly acceptable IMO.

If this were prison, I might agree with you. It's a basketball game, genius. The point is to win, not to show who's the most manly. In that respect, Bruce Bowen shows Ray Allen he isn't a punk every time they play by being in his face for the entire game and making him work for everything he gets. Bowen takes the crying to the media, the little cheap shots and shoves, the milked injuries and the boos and has managed to win. He only lost his cool once, and that basically cost his team the game. He's not likely to ever lose it again. Welcome to championship caliber basketball. Maybe Josh will learn that someday.

[mardigan]

Ditto for Bowen, kicking a guy in the back. Only difference is he has no balls to get back at Allen despite Allen coming after him. I guarantee that Howard would not have just backed off like that, and would have went right back at him.

Allen and Bowen have a past, and it was him dealing with Ray Allen no matter how it might have been. Its compeletly different when you run all the way across the court to hit a guy in the back for bumping your teamate onto the floor in a pre-season game while he was talking to a ref

[Shank]

What's Brad Miller so depressed about all the time? He always looks so sad.

He hates being white.

[Obstructed_View]

Oh well. Agree to disagree. Maybe if you played the game, you would understand the element of "punking" and how it relates to mental toughness a little more.

I'd bet that you've never played anything, and spend a lot of time listening to rap, because you have a re ed and adolescent sense of compe ion.

[RocketsDynasty]

I'd bet that you've never played anything, and spend a lot of time listening to rap, because you have a re ed and adolescent sense of compe ion.

I'm glad we've established that nobody in the NBA listens to rap.

[samikeyp]

Oh well. Agree to disagree. Maybe if you played the game, you would understand the element of "punking" and how it relates to mental toughness a little more.

So...if someone disagrees with you...they can't have possibly played any organized sports ever and do not know anything as much as you?


I did play several sports well into high school and I understand totally the whole mental aspect. I just think that its more important to win the game then to worry about what someone on the other team thinks. Personally, I respected every opponent I faced until they gave me reason not to. If they think i'm weak, fine..that works to my advantage. Bottom line is that the team win is the most important, if they think i'm weak, but my team wins...who cares? Personal feelings are secondary to the team dynamic. Like this here, for some reason you chose to make it personal just because I disagreed with you. That is your choice. I didn't see the need to since we weren't talking about me but you have the right to post as you see fit. It doesn't bother me, made me curious, not im not hurt or upset.

My point still stands however. If (and I am not saying this is the case) Josh Howard and the Mavericks care more about what other teams think of them and make proving they are not "punks" their primary focus instead of winning a le, then they are not championship caliber. Personally, I think they are of that caliber, they are perfectly capable of winning a le and too good of a team to have to resort to being thugs.

[Obstructed_View]

I'm glad we've established that nobody in the NBA listens to rap.

If only that were the sole requirement for being a good basketball player...