Game Thoughts: Spurs vs Magic - Nov. 21

[gilmor]

Rebounding.

When the Spurs and Mavs play and the teams go small, the Mavs' small team dominates the Spurs' small team on the boards. That's why the Mavs have outrebounded the Spurs in 12 out of the last 13 games they've played, something ridiculous like that.

Just a quick question: If Udoka morph into someone Spurs thinks he is going to be, won't that solve the problem with rebounding?

[AFBlue]

Just a quick question: If Udoka morph into someone Spurs thinks he is going to be, won't that solve the problem with rebounding?

He's a better rebounder than Barry, Fin, and Bowen...but he's still a 6'5 G/F. Playing him as the small ball 4 would be a significant defensive liability, would give them less on the court offensively, and would probably only marginally upgrade their rebounding.

[AFBlue]

Just a quick question: If Udoka morph into someone Spurs thinks he is going to be, won't that solve the problem with rebounding?

If you want to have a G/F that will give you significant scoring and rebounding as the small-ball 4, then look to the Clippers' Corey Maggette.

Maggette is averaging 7.5RPG in 35MPG....and he's scoring at a 20-point clip so far this season.

And the Spurs have the expiring deal in Barry to entice the Clips to make it happen....j/k bdictjames

[[email protected]]

That was a good game.
Go Spurs Go

[T Park]

Udoka's development, and Udoka's understanding of the offense and defense, are what beating Dallas depends on.

[SRJ]

Yeah I agree here, and this is were the Spurs miss somebody like Malik Rose to fight and frustrate the mavs with his hustle and his offensive rebounding.

Malik was huge against the Mavericks - it is in matchups against them where we miss him the most.

I'm not saying he should still be here, or that they should bring him back, but he was a great anti-Maverick weapon.

[Solid D]

I just now watched the whole game (replay). I had seen about 10 minutes of the game, live, last night.

I will add to timvp's assessment regarding Dooling's defense that Jameer Nelson wasn't much better on Parker, nor was Arroyo.

The game got away from the Magic in the 4th quarter when the Spurs outscored them 18-6 during an 8 minute stretch. It looked as though the Magic were the ones playing their second game in 2 nights, instead of the Spurs.

Dwight Howard showed why he was the Eastern Conference player of the week. Rashard Lewis played more minutes than anyone (44 min.), yet only had 12 points & 5 turnovers.

Offensively, the Spurs look like they are in March/April form most of the time.

Key moments in the game. 1) Ginobili's 4 point play and 9 straight points in 3 trips late in the 3rd period. The Spurs never trailed after that. 2) With the Spurs leading by 6 early in the 4th, Michael Finley and Brent Barry bury consecutive 3 pointers, Spurs double their lead in a blink of an eye, up by 12.

[SenorSpur]

If you want to have a G/F that will give you significant scoring and rebounding as the small-ball 4, then look to the Clippers' Corey Maggette.

Maggette is averaging 7.5RPG in 35MPG....and he's scoring at a 20-point clip so far this season.

And the Spurs have the expiring deal in Barry to entice the Clips to make it happen....j/k bdictjames

The knock on Maggette, at least in this forum, is that he isn't prolific 3-pt shooter and doesn't play great defense. Personally, I'd take him specifically for the reasons you've stated and also because he gets to the rack with ease, draws fouls and is a decent foul shooter. Oh by the way, he has an effective midrange game. All those elements (or the lack thereof), the lack of foot speed and defense at the wing positions are evident when matching up against a team like the Mavs.

[MagnusKrauss]

James White! could have been the answer.

[telecomguy]

Udoka's development, and Udoka's understanding of the offense and defense, are what beating Dallas depends on.

Also I think Elson can be effective against Dirk because he is long enough to contest Dirk's jumpres and quick enough to stay in front of Dirk should Dirk fake a shot and try to dribble-drive to the paint. We can't afford to double up on Dirk like GS because aside from Manu, we don't have quick enough perimeter players that can jump in & out of double teams to harass Dirk like all the Warrior players can due to their sheer athleticism and quickness.

Let Elson play one-on-one against Dirk for extended minutes and see how he does. Elson can also take Dirk one-on-one on the offensive side as he is much quicker than Dirk and can go to the rack or at least get some fouls off Dirk. To me, Elson's development or the ability to guard Dirk without constant double team will be a real key in the playoffs should they meet because it allows us to put Bowen on Howard, and Manu/TP/Udoka can handle JET and Devin with some help from Duncan.

Elson and Udoka will be key new players for both rebounding and defending the Mavs in the playoffs and they can really make a deference in helping out Bowen/Manu/DUncan/TP.

I also saw Bonner harass Dirk effectively in spots last game so he can also spell Elson & DUncan in trying to contain Dirk who is still their focal point and the key to dallas offense along with Devin and Howard (JET to me is a loser and will not be performing at this level come playoff time -- when the going gets tough Devin will respond but not JET and the jury is still out on Dirk although in all fairness to him, Dirk was double & Triple teamed by the Warriors)

[roycrikside]

I had my doubts about TimVP's contention that Bruce guarded Lewis in the first half so I rewatched the game and charted it, possession by possession. Sure enough, my instincts were correct as Bruce was on Hedo pretty much the whole game the two were on the floor together.

The only stretch where Bruce guarded Lewis was when he and Manu were on the court together a bit during that second quarter, but pretty much whenever it was Bruce and Finley, Bruce had Hedo. Also, I don't think it's appropriate to give Bruce (or anyone) credit for good defense on Hedo. The guy just missed a lot of WIDE OPEN shots and lay-ups. He could've just as easily finished 15 for 18 as the 9 for 18 he wound up with.

I would suggest to TimVP that he rewatch the game and concede that Bruce just didn't have a good night defensively. It's worth noting that Pop didn't play Bowen the final 9 minutes of the game, perhaps he came to the conclusion that the small gain Bowen would give him defensively wasn't nearly enough to make up for the deficit at the other end. The Spurs blew them away in the 4th largely for that reason.


1. On Hedo, no shot – 1
2. On Hedo, no shot – 2
3. On Hedo, no shot – 3
4. On Hedo, Finley switch, 3 pointer miss (Finley 0/1)
5. On Hedo, no shot – 4
6. On Hedo, screen, Oberto switch, driving lay-up (Oberto 1/1, 2 pts)
7. On Hedo, no shot – 5 Hedo assist 1
8. Transition, N/A
9. On Hedo, no shot – 6
10. On Hedo, driving lay-up (Bowen 1/1, 2 pts)
11. Transition, Bowen on Howard, no shot – 1
12. On Hedo, no shot – 7
13. On Hedo, no shot – 8
14. On Hedo, driving lay-up (Bowen 2/2, 4 pts)
15. Transition, bad press, on Hedo, no shot – 9, Hedo assist 2
16. On Hedo, no shot – 10
17. On Hedo, transition switch, Tony on Hedo, no shot – 1, nearest man on Bogans three (Bogans-Bowen 1/1, 3pts) Hedo asst 3
18. On Hedo, no shot – 11
19. On Hedo, no shot – 12
20. On Hedo, scramble because of Manu steal attempt, closest to Nelson three (Nelson-Bowen 1/1, 3pts)
21. Transition, Bowen on Howard, 3 second call, no shot – 2
Bruce checks out with 3:06 left in 1st
22. Tony on Hedo, no shot – 2
23. Manu on Hedo, driving lay-up (Manu 1/1, 2 pts)
24. Transition, Finley on Hedo, shooting foul (Finley 2 pts on FT)
25. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 1
26. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 2
27. Vaughn on Hedo, no shot – 1
Hedo checked out, very early in 2nd quarter
Bowen, Hedo check in with 8:24 to go in 2nd quarter
28. On Lewis, no shot – 1
29. On Lewis, no shot – 2, Manu on Hedo, jumpshot good (Manu 2/2, 4 pts)
30. On Hedo, blocking foul on Tim on drive
31. On Arroyo, no shot – 1, Manu on Hedo, no shot – 3
32. On Lewis, jumper no good (Lewis-Bowen 0/1)
33. On Lewis, no shot – 3
34. On Hedo, no shot – 13
35. On Hedo, transition, no shot – 14
36. On Hedo, no shot – 15
37. On Hedo, alley-oop to Howard, Hedo assist 4
38. On Hedo, screen switch to Oberto, shot and-1 (Oberto 2/2, 5 pts)
39. On Hedo, no shot – 16
40. On Hedo, no shot – 17
41. On Hedo, shooting foul (Hedo 1 pt on FT)

Bruce checks out with 2:15 to go in 2nd quarter

42. Barry on Hedo, no shot – 1
43. Finley on Hedo, no shot – 1
44. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 3
45. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 4, Hedo assist 5

Half Time

46. On Hedo, switch to Nelson, no shot – 1
47. On Hedo, 3 pt attempt no good (Bowen 2/3, 5 pts)
48. On Hedo, no shot – 18
49. On Hedo, lay-up attempt bothered by Tim (Bowen 2/4, 5 pts)
50. On Hedo, no shot – 19
51. On Hedo, forces turnover (Turnover 1)
52. On Hedo, back cut lay-up good (Bowen 3/5, 7pts)
53. On Hedo, no shot – 20
54. On Hedo, missed lay-up (Bowen 3/6, 7 pts)
55. On Hedo, no shot – 21
56. On Hedo, no shot – 22
57. On Hedo, wide open 3 pt attempt no good (Bowen 3/7, 7 pts)
58. On Hedo, left him, shooting foul on Tim (Bowen 2 pts on FT, 9 pts)
59. Transition Tim on Hedo, no shot – 1, Bowen/Barry on Howard, lay-up (Bowen-Howard 1/1, 2pts)

Hedo checks out 3:58 to go in 3rd

60. On Lewis, no shot – 4
61. On Lewis, fell down on Nelson screen, Barry steal
62. On Lewis, no shot – 5
63. On Lewis, no shot – 6

Hedo checks in with 1:33 to go in 3rd

64. On Lewis, Lewis jumper good (Lewis/Bowen 1/2, 2pts), Manu on Hedo, no shot – 5
65. On Hedo, transition, no shot – 23
66. On Lewis, no shot – 7
End of 3rd
67. On Hedo, no shot – 24
68. On Hedo, switch/scramble with Finley, open 3pt shot good (Finley 1/2, 5 pts)
69. On Hedo, no shot – 25

Video problem on NBA League pass

70. Bruce on Hedo, Duncan block (Duncan 0/1, 0 pts)
Bruce checks out with 8:42 to go in 4th
71. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 6
72. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 7
73. Transition, Manu on Hedo, foul
74. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 8
75. Transition, Barry on Hedo, no shot – 2
76. Manu on Hedo, wide open jumper no good (Manu 2/3, 4 pts)
77. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 9
78. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 10
79. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 11
80. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 12
81. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 13
82. Manu on Hedo, no shot – 14
83. Manu on Hedo, switch/confusion with Barry, missed lay-up (Barry 0/1, 0 pts)
84. Udoka on Hedo, wide open 3pt good (Udoka 1/1, 3 pts)
85. Udoka on Hedo, no shot – 1
86. Udoka on Hedo, no shot – 2

Hedo points: 9/18 2/6 3pts, 6/7 FT 26 pts

Vs. Bruce 3/7, 0/2 3pts, 3/4 FT, 9 pts, 3 assists, 1 turnover
Vs. Finley 1/2, 1/2 3pts, 2/2 FT, 5 pts
Vs. Oberto 2/2, 1/1 FT, 5 pts
Vs. Manu 2/3, 4 pts, 1 assist
Vs. Udoka, 1/1, 1/1 3pts, 3 pts
Vs. Duncan 0/1, 0 pts
Vs. Barry 0/1, 0 pts
Vs. ?, 0/1, 0/1 3pts, 0 pts
Vs. Tony 0/0, 0 pts, 1 assist

Bowen Vs. Other People

Vs. Bogans 1/1, 1/1 3pts, 3 pts, 1 possession
Vs. Nelson, 1/1, 1/1 3pts, 3pts, 2 possessions, 1 no shot
Vs. Lewis 1/2, 2pts, 10 possessions, 7 no shots, 1 switch
Vs. Howard 1/1, 2 pts, 3 possessions, 1 turnover, 1 no shot
Vs. Arroyo 0/0, 1 possession, 1 no shot

Possessions Vs. Hedo

Bowen: 45 Possessions, 7 FGA, 3 fouls, 3 assists, 1 turnover, 8 switches, 23 no shots
Manu: 18 Possessions, 3 FGA, 1 assist, 1 foul, 1 switch, 12 no shots
Finley: 4 Possessions, 2 FGA, 1 foul, 1 no shot
Barry: 3 Possessions, 1 FGA, 2 no shots
Oberto: 2 Possessions, 2 FGA, 1 foul
Duncan: 2 Possessions, 1 FGA (block), 1 no shot
Tony: 2 Possessions, 1 assist, 1 no shot
Vaughn: 1 possession, 1 no shot

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Jesus.